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Old 05-02-2016, 09:36   #31
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Re: Pro/Con of outboard for blue water cruising

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Originally Posted by Shanachie View Post
...
If you do go with an outboard, please remove the inboard and glass up the holes. There's no reason to sail a junk sailboat. Plus, you get plenty of storage space.
I agree. On my Morgan 27 a PO removed the Atomic plus everything else and glasses in the shaft hole. I've filled the empty area with batteries, Over 500 amp hours. Also a small refrigerator, 4000 w inverter. We have a Honda 9.9 extra long shaft that pushes us at hull speed.
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Old 05-02-2016, 09:56   #32
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Re: Pro/Con of outboard for blue water cruising

Beware. Ethanol absorbs water and the chemical mix corrodes the brass jets. Witness the white powder, in time, in the carb.

You have been warned.
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Old 05-02-2016, 10:01   #33
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Re: Pro/Con of outboard for blue water cruising

i just went thought this transition from a 2002 2 cylinder volvo to a 15HP extra long shaft honda with remote control and electrical tilt &trim wich is enough to get out of the water while sailing ,mounted in the transom .It took me some time to get the right hight and tilt in the bracket which i extensively modified (still working on it )removed the diesel and all related parts ,clean it ,get rid of 200lbs got all that space ,tested on 6 footer and 20knots ,no problem so far
i must said it required lots of customization to work all the benefits(still working on lifting,locking mechanism,being connected to the original main tank)but I loved it overall
in a month ill sail all the way to george town ,exams as the final exam
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Old 05-02-2016, 10:44   #34
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Re: Pro/Con of outboard for blue water cruising

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Beware. Ethanol absorbs water and the chemical mix corrodes the brass jets. Witness the white powder, in time, in the carb.

You have been warned.
for those of you that are worried, mix in a little Stay Bill..............
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Old 05-02-2016, 11:17   #35
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Re: Pro/Con of outboard for blue water cruising

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for those of you that are worried, mix in a little Stay Bill..............
A number of articles on this. They all seem to do an equal job, but not great. Just adding lubrication to offset the effects of the alcohol/water and water byproduct of alcohol, so by most independent testing, you can add the one that costs less.

BoatingLAB Tests: Fuel Stabilizers | Boating Magazine
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Old 05-02-2016, 11:32   #36
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Re: Pro/Con of outboard for blue water cruising

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A number of articles on this. They all seem to do an equal job, but not great. Just adding lubrication to offset the effects of the alcohol/water and water byproduct of alcohol, so by most independent testing, you can add the one that costs less.

BoatingLAB Tests: Fuel Stabilizers | Boating Magazine
Which is why a smaller outboard which uses much less fuel may be best. (less fuel to treat)

I have maybe 5 -7 gallons max onboard at any one time which will last a month or 2.

I mainly use the 1/3rd gallon integral tank on the engine. I only hook up the external tank for long trips

As far as the stabliizers, last year I had at least 2 gallons left over which sat in my external tank all winter. I used it in the Spring on a 20 mile bay crossing.

Plus, the gas stabilier is usually cheaper than the stabilizer for diesel.
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Old 05-02-2016, 11:36   #37
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Re: Pro/Con of outboard for blue water cruising

The only pro for an outboard I can think of is that when it fails you can throw it away easily and replace it. all else are cons.
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Old 05-02-2016, 11:47   #38
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Re: Pro/Con of outboard for blue water cruising

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The only pro for an outboard I can think of is that when it fails you can throw it away easily and replace it. all else are cons.
Not quite.

You can enter and exit your slip on an old full keel sailboat much easier with an outboard.

I can move my boat at 90 degree angles since I can rotate my outboard through maybe 190-200 degrees.

Also, vibration is minimal with a small outboard.

You can relocate the outboard at anytime on the boat.

The pull start is nice. No need for a starter battery.

A small one burns less than a liter of fuel an hour

Gas is cheaper than diesel.

There's no fuel or oil leaking into the bilge.

It's quite in the cabin when the engine is running.

You can buy a new outboard for around $1,500.00

Better access to the engine especially if you back into your slip.

You can use it on your dinghy.

You can bring along a spare and keep it in your lazarette locker.

The prop is out of the water when sailing. Less drag.

Minimal maintenance. I have yet to change the spark plug after 4 years. Just the oils and impeller. Have a spare fuel filter onboard but haven't used it yet.

http://onlineoutboards.com/mercury-5...otor-4102.html
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Old 05-02-2016, 11:59   #39
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Re: Pro/Con of outboard for blue water cruising

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Not quite.

You can enter and exit your slip on an old full keel sailboat much easier with an outboard.
Absolutely untrue, once you learn how to use prop walk to your advantage it’s a piece of cake with inboard. With an outboard and a cross wind or current you will be out of control fast. Been there done that many times.
I can move my boat at 90 degree angles since I can rotate my outboard through maybe 190-200 degrees.
This will not move your boat sideways, it will rotate your boat.
Also, vibration is minimal with a small outboard.

You can relocate the outboard at anytime on the boat.

The pull start is nice. No need for a starter battery.
…and no way of charging your battery, and leaning over the back to pull start is a PITA… especially in a situation where you need immediate assistance!
A small one burns less than a liter of fuel an hour
My 3GM30 diesels burned less than a quart an hour at the HP rating of a small OB.. less than 2 quarts wide open.
Gas is cheaper than diesel.

There's no fuel or oil leaking into the bilge.

It's quite in the cabin when the engine is running.

You can buy a new outboard for around $1,500.00

Better access to the engine especially if you back into your slip.

No need for aces on an inboard, all the controls are right there at the helm.
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Old 05-02-2016, 12:14   #40
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Re: Pro/Con of outboard for blue water cruising

I agree with Zeehag, can't stand fourstrokes, overly complicated and unreliable. I got rid of my (brand new) Honda 2.3 because although it would start first time from cold, it hated to start when it was warm, had it serviced and tried everything, even tried running it dry (which took ages ) rather than straight shutting down in case it was flooding, all to no avail. Got rid of it and bought an old but much more reliable two stroke Mariner 3.3 which also has a neutral gear, making choked starting much less stressful. It always starts first pull but of course is more thirsty, oily and you need to remember to add 2T oil to the fuel (easy to forget if your absent-minded or distracted). Would NOT want to move up to a bigger outboard with attendant weight and complication. As a back up to my 15Hp diesel Yanmar, the Mariner is fine but I would never consider getting a boat that did not have a diesel engine or could not have one installed.
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Old 05-02-2016, 12:14   #41
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Re: Pro/Con of outboard for blue water cruising

Solar is the new thing for charging your batteries. No need to run the engine.

It's quite obvious that if you can rotate your engine it's much better than using prop walk for entering and exiting your slip..

We run our outboards at maybe 1/3 - 1/2 throttle when motoring. The one liter fuel consumption per hour was at 5500 rpm

Leaning over to start is quite easy IF you are in good shape.
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Old 05-02-2016, 12:22   #42
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Re: Pro/Con of outboard for blue water cruising

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I agree with Zeehag, can't stand fourstrokes, overly complicated and unreliable. I got rid of my (brand new) Honda 2.3 because although it would start first time from cold, it hated to start when it was warm, had it serviced and tried everything, even tried running it dry (which took ages ) rather than straight shutting down in case it was flooding, all to no avail.
Don't go below 4 horse power on the Mercurys, etc. The 3.3's as well as the very small Hondas all have that trouble with their tiny jets. It comes up on CF all the time

BUT

the larger say Mercury 4,5,6 Hp never have those type problem.

Also, how good are you (and Z) with engines? This could also be the problem.

Can you work on a lawn mower motor? Not complicated at all. Same thing

Also, think of the fuel consumption on your lawn mower. My outboard is a 5 hp 4 stroke about the same as your average lawn mower. How long can your mower run on that tiny amount of gas in it's tank? Then think of it hooked up to a three gallon external tank along with it's integral tank.
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Old 05-02-2016, 13:11   #43
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Re: Pro/Con of outboard for blue water cruising

My Columbia 29 was built with no accommodation for an inboard, it was an option. But I like it the way it is. The previous owner, an engineer, built a nice hoisting mount for the long shaft outboard. It goes down deep enough so I can motor in chop without much problem BUT my transom is not very high compared to others. I really like the extra space made available, no through-hulls, no smell, no noise, no water or oil in bilge. I agree that diesels are very handy, but I am not missing having one. James Baldwin at atomvoyages.com does make some great adaptations for outboards on boats under 30'. It is true that an outboard is not as economical as a diesel, but I have found I get about 3 miles to the gallon with my 2 stroke 8 hp pushing my 7500# boat so one 6 gallon tank usually serves MY needs (not everyone's I know.) My old Columbia 24 had a well for an outboard and I cut a slot in the transom to lift the engine into as Baldwin does and it worked very well. One very nice advantage to having the outboard is I can really maneuver my boat around MUCH better than an inboard by reaching over the stern and turning the engine. One disadvantage as mentioned is that I am limited in the kind of self-steering vane I will put up when/if I do. Since I am cruising coastally, it is not an issue yet. Another disadvantage I will readily admit is the outboard hanging on the stern is very unattractive. Going engineless is an option in the summer for my area though.
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Old 05-02-2016, 13:30   #44
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Re: Pro/Con of outboard for blue water cruising

We get it Thomm, you really like the fact that you have an outboard and feel it was the best choice for you.

The OP is asking peoples opinions on this, they have gotten yours quite thoroughly. If you can work on a lawnmower then you can probably work on a diesel too btw. Zee has rebuilt her engine twice now while she's been living on the boat. She has learned to be an excellent mechanic on her Model of engine. Which is exactly what I'd suggest the OP do. Buy a rebuild kit or the parts needed and get to work. It will be the easiest, cheapest way to get going. Plus when it needs work next you know what you're doing. Before you say an OB is cheaper you need to thing of total cost of ownership. Anyone that takes a boat that is designed for an inboard rips it out and puts an outboard on the back has drastically devalued their boat. If you paid $7k for a boat with a diesel that needed work and ripped it out, you'd now have a $3k boat in most boat shoppers eyes. I don't buy very price boat I don't have the money, which is probably why I work on my engines as I can't afford to pay someone every time they leak or act up.

As for my opinion, they suck when compared to an inboard. When people say they may cavitate or IF they cavitate, what they mean is they WILL cavitate at every single wave. I had a 22ft Oday with a long shaft Johnson 9.9 2 stroke. Every wave you rode over while motoring the damned thing would fluctuate speed and loose "grip". The longer the boat the more the motor is going to get pulled out of the water. They are just about completely useless when heeled over too unless you're on the right tack. If it kicks up in a storm and you're trying to get into a harbor or something again useless. It definitely was not quite down below. The high RPM of the outboard made the hull reverberate and echo. You felt the vibration everywhere. On deck it was loud, if you were going down wind the blue exhaust was a constant stink.

I've got an old westerbeke in my current 36ft boat and love it. Great power and torque. As others have said learn to use prop walk or a looped line to a piling to make the boat do what you want it to in any tide wind current situation. Using prop walk and switching from forward to reverse I can turn my boat 360 in its own footprint. Most boats can do this. I learned on my old Columbia 29 with an Atomic 4. I was so happy with that boat and engine, it was so smooth and would cruise at hull speed at 2400rpm. It was quite and no fumes floating in your face due to the water mixed exhaust.

I'm not afraid of gas on a boat its just nicer to not have to worry about it. Diesel is a much more stable fuel than gas on the current boat I have 100 gal tank. The boat hadn't been used much in the last 10 years when I bought it, sat on the hard for the last 5 of that. The former owner said they never used more than 5 gallons a year. Most of my fuel tank has to be upwards of 15 years old at least. I ran it all summer and didn't have to change the fuel filter once.

Anyways the decision is yours to make you'll do what you feel is right. Don't let the unknown or fear of a diesel make you think you have only one choice. What makes you say this engine needs rebuilding anyways? Could be a simple fix. Of course if you're still boat shopping just don't buy this boat and get one with a running engine for a good deal instead! Or Low ball the crap out of the guy and save enough to pay someone to rebuild it.
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Old 05-02-2016, 13:41   #45
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Re: Pro/Con of outboard for blue water cruising

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Hello all,
this is my first post and I haven't seen an answer in other threads.

I am shopping for my first personally-owned sailboat (27-35' range, let's say) for outfitting for oceanic sailing in the next year. For my purposes, I'm not really sure that the cost of an overhaul or replacement of in inboard diesel fits into my overall plan. Still, some tight harbors or marinas quite often require such mechanized assistance.

My question: all things being equal, would an outboard motor mounted on a transom be a nautical hindrance if I needed to avoid the problems and expense of an inboard overhaul? It seems like it would be, but then again, I've never personally seen a sailboat with an outboard actually sail across the North Atlantic. If it is, that's fine, but that sort of thing is outside of my area.

Thanks in advance for your time.
Problems with outboard. Power, gasoline and fuel efficiency.

Even the inboard diesel is usually called an auxillary engine. This assumes you'll sail most of the way and not motor.

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