Port tack in Moody 40

[boathead]

Maybe you'll all raise an eyebrow at this, I have an old Westerly33, very traditional saloon layout with settee berths port and starboard (and fore and aft cabin), easy to get comfortable short naps on either tack whilst waiting your turn at the wheel. So on an old Primrose designed Moody 40 and of course many newer boats where the seating area is all to either port or starboard and the galley area opposite with no appropriate pilot berth available, how do you manage without using either the fore cabin or aft cabin which may not be particularly tenable in 'bouncy' conditions. I will assume I'm being utterly stupid so please humour me.

Thanks.

[Dockhead]

Originally Posted by boathead

Maybe you'll all raise an eyebrow at this, I have an old Westerly33, very traditional saloon layout with settee berths port and starboard (and fore and aft cabin), easy to get comfortable short naps on either tack whilst waiting your turn at the wheel. So on an old Primrose designed Moody 40 and of course many newer boats where the seating area is all to either port or starboard and the galley area opposite with no appropriate pilot berth available, how do you manage without using either the fore cabin or aft cabin which may not be particularly tenable in 'bouncy' conditions. I will assume I'm being utterly stupid so please humour me.

Thanks.

Nothing stupid at all about this question.


I guess more than 90% of modern cruising boats are never sailed on a multi-day passage, so sea berths are just not a factor at all.

The only boat I've ever sailed with seating all on one side in the salon was a Beneteau 423, which I chartered a couple of times. I never sailed it overnight, but the quarter berths would have made quite OK sea berths.

On my boat, the aft cabin is fine at sea. The island berth is split down the middle, and it's easy to rig a lee cloth between the matress halves. It's good even in quite rough weather.

I have seating on both sides, but the port side settee is a little short for comfortable sleeping. The preferred place to sleep in the salon on passage is actually lying athwartship along the forward part of the stb settee.

Then forward I have a pullman cabin with single berths with lee cloths which is also fine for sleeping at sea, provided the sea is not too rough. The forward guest cabin is the worst for sleeping at sea, because of the motion, but actually has decent bolsters on the sides, so even this is OK in reasonably calm weather.


How you do it on a Moody 40 I don't know -- never sailed one. But knowing a little about Angus Primrose designs -- the only yacht designer I know, by the way, who died with his sea boots on -- I doubt that he neglected this question.

[Asher]

Lea cloths. Thats all i can think of although on a a 6 day from Gib to Lanzarote I was in a port side stern cabin and just adjusted my style accordingly. Diagonally one way or the other across the mattress. Worked fine

[Jim Cate]

But knowing a little about Angus Primrose designs -- the only yacht designer I know, by the way, who died with his sea boots on -- I doubt that he neglected this question.

I guess that you can add Frans Maas to your list, according to a new thread here on CF today, and then there was Art Piver who disappeared at sea on one of his own designs many years ago. I reckon it would be good if ALL NAs had to both make a passage on their boats before they coulld be released, and to change oil, filters and impellers on the engines. Might see some attitude changes...

Jim

[a64pilot]

I think the day of a designer being in total control of manufacturing is long gone, now marketing dept has a bigger role as they come in and say the customers want this, not that. And accounting has a big role too in determining what is done.
Only small companies maybe the designer will control things, maybe.
I can tell you I designed an airplane, Million dollar airplane, I used actual aircraft latches on the baggage compt. door, purchasing told owner of the company they were $25 a piece, he said I won't pay $25 for a latch, so now it has what looks like a Walmart tool box latch on the doors, same thing with the fuel filters, that he paid out the nose to have all of them replaced, same with the electric fuel pumps, that are failing left and right and hurting the sales, as owner has a 500% mark up on them.

[Jim Cate]

Originally Posted by a64pilot

I think the day of a designer being in total control of manufacturing is long gone, now marketing dept has a bigger role as they come in and say the customers want this, not that. And accounting has a big role too in determining what is done.
Only small companies maybe the designer will control things, maybe.
I can tell you I designed an airplane, Million dollar airplane, I used actual aircraft latches on the baggage compt. door, purchasing told owner of the company they were $25 a piece, he said I won't pay $25 for a latch, so now it has what looks like a Walmart tool box latch on the doors, same thing with the fuel filters, that he paid out the nose to have all of them replaced, same with the electric fuel pumps, that are failing left and right and hurting the sales, as owner has a 500% mark up on them.

Yeah, you're right about that! So, I'll amend my idea to include the marketing managers in the crew that must make passage in and service a design before release!

Doubt if this will be feasible, for clearly none of the market managers are sailors!

Jim

[a64pilot]

Jim, I don't know if it is true or not but I was told when I toured the Mercedes factory in Germany that every Engineer was required to spend I think one year assembling cars before going to work in the Engineering dept.
I believe that is not all that uncommon in Germany, or was anyway as I was there a little over 20 years ago.
The Aeronautical Engineer that worked with me designing the airplane was an A&P licensed mechanic as well, which is I believe exceedingly rare.

[Jim Cate]

Originally Posted by a64pilot

Jim, I don't know if it is true or not but I was told when I toured the Mercedes factory in Germany that every Engineer was required to spend I think one year assembling cars before going to work in the Engineering dept.
I believe that is not all that uncommon in Germany, or was anyway as I was there a little over 20 years ago.
The Aeronautical Engineer that worked with me designing the airplane was an A&P licensed mechanic as well, which is I believe exceedingly rare.

While I applaud the idea of engineers working on the assembly line, it isn't the same as doing routine service on a completed (and perhaps dirty and worn) vehicle. I fear that such experience will lead to assembly line improvements rather than service ease.

After all, many of the design features of high production boats are aimed at speed of assembly, not access when assembled, and I suspect a similar thought process exists in the automotive field.

At any rate, there are so many pitfalls in modern boats, things like wiring and plumbing that can not be reached after the liner is glued in, or in your case, chain plates that can't be inspected/replaced without major surgery, that one despairs of long term maintenance practice.

Grump.

Jim

[a64pilot]

The chain plates were at the time I believe thought to be permeant, and mine are 30 yrs old, so an argument can be made as to how long is something supposed to last?
They were wrong of course, but I believe that they thought encapsulating the SS would mean that it would last until the hull fell apart.
I can't speak to the aluminum tanks though, plastic is cheaper, why aluminum?
Driving down the road the other day I heard on the radio an ad by lawyers, advertising for you to get in on a class action lawsuit. See if your house was built before 1975, you could have that dangerous, inferior iron pipes, just waiting to burst and cause damage, join the lawsuit and force the Insurence companies to re-pipe your house.
How long is something supposed to last?

Anyway the Mercedes Engineers working on the floor was a step anyway, and as I said Lew the now Retired Aeronautical Engineer having an Airframe and Powerplant mechanics license was unheard of.

The mechanics and I designed that aircraft, there was only one length of oil line, there were several lines of course, but all identical, one spare covered all lines, special access cover to make oil change easier, and GE worked with me so that the entire engine wiring harness was fed into two cannon plugs, need to change an engine, just disconnect two cannon plugs and all electrical connections were done, engine wiring harness stayed with the engine.
Engine rigging was done via rig pins, install a rig pin at the throttle quadrant, and adjust linkage so that the pin will fit in at the engine end, rigging complete.

[a64pilot]

Our competitor in the aircraft business believed and designed the aircraft to be a throwaway item like an automobile, there your supposed to throw away a car at I guess average life of ten years and purchase a newer, more efficient, more modern one.
I think most modern boats are built with a definite lifespan, think about it, the really popular models interiors fall apart before they reach ten years, and as you say the systems are not meant to be serviced and or replaced as often access is impossible or nearly so.