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Old 12-05-2008, 17:21   #16
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Victoria 28?

eBay Motors: VICTOIRE 28 FOOT, SLOOP (item 320250745556 end time May-15-08 11:46:56 PDT)

I vaguely recall reading somewhere that a boat with that or a similar name is a great blue water small cruiser. The underbody of this boat is what I'd want for your purposes. The displacement and the fact it's built in Holland suggests that it's a good sea boat.
nice looking.
I don't like the unprotected prop and tiny rudder.
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Old 12-05-2008, 17:29   #17
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nice looking.
I don't like the unprotected prop and tiny rudder.
What about the forestay attachment? Seems a little "light".

Boy the price is right!!
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Old 12-05-2008, 17:42   #18
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Frankly, at that price you are more likely looking at a day sailor.

Another one you might consider but also will not fit your budget is the very well made Rhodes 22 by General Boats in Edenton, NC. They’re smaller than the two you listed but they have lot of features, are NMMA certified, a buy back program, and have an active owners group. Oh, and enough foam to be pretty much unsinkable.

Wow. I can't recall a serious post that I have disagreed with more strenuously.

First, as has been previously pointed out, there are many excellent pocket cruisers fitting the OP's purpose, that can be bought for the price range mentioned. I just posted one example a few minutes ago.

Second, the Rhodes 22 was my very first boat, and it's the only boat that I regret owning. I bought it based on all those features, before I knew anything about sailing, and I soon recognized those features were worthless gimmicks. IMO, it is not at all suited for what the OP wants. The fact that it's NMMA certified tells me the NMMA certification is pretty meaningless. I don't mean to offend, but it's a boat I frankly would not recommend to anyone. I'm astonished the builder is still in business.
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Old 12-05-2008, 17:42   #19
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You can do it. I met a young sailor last summer who had been looking for a boat for less than a year, he had a short list of three boats, one an Albin Vega. He lived in Georgia, but saw a new listing on a Friday evening on the web for a $6,000 Albin Vega in Burlington, VT. He packed his car with all his stuff, drove straight through, and was waiting for the broker when he opened the office Monday. They went to look at the boat, at which point the broker said he had listed it sight unseen based on information from the owner, which included a three year old diesel repower. The broker would have listed it for more if he had looked at it. The young sailor gave the broker a deposit on the spot. The sailor cruised Lake Champlain for the summer, did a few upgrades, although there wasn't much that needed doing and then headed south in the fall.

I would check the new listings on the web every day.
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Old 12-05-2008, 17:49   #20
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Hi, With the economy the way it is now, you should look at boats on
Yachtworld.com in the range of 12k to 16k and offer $6000. or so, many people are selling boats at a deal.
This past winter I found the boat I wanted, my wife the yard sale junky/
horse trader wanted to offer the seller half of the asking price.
I was afraid we would just tick off the seller and didn't want to do that.
She won out and MAN did we get a good deal. We purchased our new boat at 65% of the asking price, with a little more work to be done,
We are leaving our jobs in November and have no idea when we will be home again - Dreams do come true.
- Bob
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Old 12-05-2008, 17:56   #21
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Yes you can certainly do it.

One of the first things you have to accept that the most of the crowd will tell you that you can not... and that they are wrong.

Heed sensible advise and listen to those who have done and are doing what you want to do. If someone presents caution mixed with a logical reason why, and an alternative... listen. If they simply discourage they are not speaking to you but rather to their own fear....

There is a thread on SailFar that speaks to this; Naysayers, pessimists, and people who don't know what they are talking about...

Good luck to you.
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Old 12-05-2008, 18:02   #22
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Here's an example. Frankly, that's bullshit. You can find plenty of boats for 7,000.00 that are very capable of crossing oceans with some work and modifications!
I’m not really certain what your example was, there was no link. If you were referring to the one from jtt’s link, I think that was $9,852 which would be a bit over 40% more than petelesperance’s stated budget. It was also under contract and about four thousand less than the next lowest boat which was in England. But perhaps you had a different boat in mind.

I don’t think anyone has advised petelesperance’s to give up his dream or to even postpone. That would be bad advice. But it would also be wrong to give a pep talk and leave it at that. It’s like going into business for yourself - some folks will say you’re nuts, some will tell you how it’s a great idea. But neither are cutting the checks.

Now, I know quite well circumnavigations and transoceanic crossings can be done on smaller boats and have specifically cited Patrick Childress in a previous post. Hell, people have rowed across oceans. My point is not the size of the boat nor any of the amenities (which no one had advocated and that I found bewildering that you mysteriously seized upon.)

My point is the cost of the boat is not merely what you pay to the seller. You have to include the inevitable taxes. But more importantly you have to include for maintenance. If you don’t you end up with boat you may or may not be able to sail and certainly of decreased or no value.

I had a friend who bought a San Juan 21 a couple of years back. He just wanted something fun. Most people can’t sleep on them but he and his girlfriend glassed in some points to hang hammocks. It was like camping but they went sailing about 2-3 times a month around the Chesapeake -- sometimes locally, sometimes driving to a place and sailing from there. I don’t think they ever painted his boat because when the trip was done it went back on the trailer. They had never changed their zincs. They easily checked the lights before each trip. They didn’t get any doodads for it other than the GPS and mountaineering stove which were camping models they used while camping in the winter. They loved that boat right up until some idiot parked his SUV in it.

I also had a friend years ago who bought a decent sized Hunter that he could barely afford. Everything that broke was a pain to him. He dreaded every time he had the boat hauled. He also did all the work himself, but on the cheap. He had radar and GPS but didn’t want to drain the batteries because he worried about the cost of replacement. He only sailed with the jib because he didn’t want to have to replace two sails.

Who had more fun?

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Old 13-05-2008, 06:11   #23
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My point is the cost of the boat is not merely what you pay to the seller. You have to include the inevitable taxes. But more importantly you have to include for maintenance. If you don’t you end up with boat you may or may not be able to sail and certainly of decreased or no value... Who had more fun?
Good question, but I’m pleased to see that the consensus seems to be that generally this is an entirely doable undertaking… There is nothing wrong with larger, more complex and more elegant vessels and it goes without saying that “but for” them, many would-be sailors would never get out of the rocking chair… but the pocket cruiser has always fascinated me (although for much of my nautical experience I’ve been encumbered by the more traditional size vessel, and larger…); however, micro-cruising requires restraint, organization and serious contemplation in its own right… Going camping in a Winnebago is an entirely acceptable notion these days; however, the basic thought process of back-packing everything one might need is another school of thought – albeit one that is somewhat at odds with the Winnebago crowd… likewise here, to some degree…

Weston Farmer drew up the plans for a mid-20s chine-steel vessel I carried around for several years… always was fascinated by the basic utility of that little craft… and Bingham’s amateur built Flicka fascinated me for some time when the plans were still generally available (nothing wrong with the Pacific Seacraft version – the frightful price just seems to undermine the fundamental concept in my mind). Glen-L has an intriguing 22 footer that looks right for adapting to longer-range cruising as well… But these days a would-be micro-cruiser on a serious budget need not necessarily make the psychological jump to constructing a vessel, because there are buckets of forgotten, disregarded and belittled factory boats that might fit the bill, so long as the skipper views the moment of purchase as a starting-point and not the conclusion of the quest…

Admittedly most of these pocket-candidates will need a measure of elbow-grease… but the amount of materials they consume are tiny compared to their larger sisters… finding a hundred bucks for the small amount epoxy, etc, to fill, fair and repair blisters is easy compared to what larger vessels can run… and much the quicker as well… admittedly the bigger, high-tech boats blow right by me; on the other hand, one of their smaller sails costs more than my whole boat… it’s all good either way, and I’ve seen a smattering of both worlds over the years, but both have their unique rewards and advantages…

Many of the original recreational voyagers would have been at home with cruising on a budget… largely because they were… rather than corporate executives on a hasty, but much needed, extended sabbatical, they were more often than not simply imaginative folks who enjoyed the sea too, but decided to tackle the endeavor while their youthful instincts and athletic abilities were still intact… there are times I really wish I’d seen priorities more clearly back then…
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Old 13-05-2008, 06:18   #24
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To be 19 again and know what I know now, Gods cruel joke of wasting youth on the young. At 19 you can take alot more inconvienace and aggravation than you're willing to part with at 50. At 50 you laugh at seven thousand dollars while looking at the horizon. At 19 seven thousand dollars could start a trip around the world.
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Old 13-05-2008, 06:28   #25
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At 50 you laugh at seven thousand dollars while looking at the horizon. At 19 seven thousand dollars could start a trip around the world.
Ain't that the truth...
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Old 13-05-2008, 07:37   #26
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Remember you can always build a better boat then you can buy.
Witness John Welsford's Sundowner, 22ft of ocean cruiser

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Old 13-05-2008, 07:48   #27
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help

help!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

sorry to break in

but forgot how to post

thanks
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Old 13-05-2008, 08:29   #28
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There is a thread on SailFar that speaks to this; [URL="http://sailfar.net/forum/index.php?topic=699.0"
Naysayers, pessimists, and people who don't know what they are talking about...[/URL]

Good luck to you.
Thanks for the introduction to SailFar - Another fun site with lots of tips and techniques for the singlehander.
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Old 13-05-2008, 08:58   #29
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. At 19 seven thousand dollars could start a trip around the world.
My 19 year old burns through 7k of MY money in a few months in college!
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Old 13-05-2008, 11:21   #30
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Remember you can always build a better boat then you can buy...
I’d say you are correct in many/most cases… at least there is little excuse for a purpose-built boat not to meet the wishes and design priorities of her designer/builder… I’m not convinced, however, this is always a low-budget affair (and that’s assuming no/few costly techno-gizmos).

I once ran through the materials list for a smallish 22-footer, substituting Kevlar and epoxy, etc., etc., for the more standard – wanted to see what the tariff might be to construct a blue-water craft able to round the Horn and that would stand a better chance against whales and errant shipping containers… although certainly manageable in that size of vessel, it only took me a few evenings of calculations to have the price well in excess of $25K for the basic vessel (late 1980s), decidedly gizmo-free – admittedly not a deal-breaker, but considering the proscribed budget underpinnings of the current conversation, well beyond reality…

There probably isn’t a week that goes by when I don’t momentarily vacillate between the notions of committing a few hundred more bucks to our little rascal, or dropping the concept altogether for some fresh blue-water design that catches my eye… but so far I always return… fact is, there is something attractive in the notion of putting together a little seaworthy vessel on a thrifty budget (notwithstanding the fact that a seaworthy skipper/crew is still a matter to be accomplished…).

In any case, as my grandpa used to say: “A bird in the hand is worth two in the bush…”
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