Oyster 46 Shoal Keel vs Long Keel

utahmonty · 14-11-2009, 07:49

If any one has experiance of a shoal keel vessel as above would you care to comment on the pros and cons please.

I am put of by the shallow keel as i fear performance and to-wind issues, what do you say guys and girls, am i right or am i as always wrong ?

Also i fear sliding of the wave in heavy seas,

Look forward to hearing from any one with relevant input.

Ewan

MarkJ · 14-11-2009, 16:26

Unless you are racing it would make little difference. If there were 2 boats side by side I would select the deep keel.... But if its a selection between and Oyster and another boat then pick the oyster.

barnakiel · 14-11-2009, 16:49

Friends here sailed in for the ARC. It is 1.75 versus 2.16 (metric) so she is deep anyway. Some special kind of keel named HPB marketed as an improvement towards sailing characteristics, balast/disp and AVS not mentioned but she is Cat A Euro.

The boat that sailed in is believed to be a pig and upwind performance will be just so. But upwind performance is not what sells this sort of boat. For upwind performance please get a J boat, First, etc..

I would elect the shallow keel, because I believe it is as safe as the deep keel and gives acces to a couple of shallow anchoring / cruising spots. (Bahamas?)

b.

Dockhead · 14-11-2009, 16:56

Quote:

Originally Posted by barnakiel

Friends here sailed in for the ARC. It is 1.75 versus 2.16 (metric) so she is deep anyway. Some special kind of keel named HPB marketed as an improvement towards sailing characteristics, balast/disp and AVS not mentioned but she is Cat A Euro.

The boat that sailed in is believed to be a pig and upwind performance will be just so. But upwind performance is not what sells this sort of boat. For upwind performance please get a J boat, First, etc..

b.

Yikes, upwind performance is important to many cruisers, including myself. Are you talking about an Oyster 46? I am not aware that any of them, shoal or deep keel, can be characterized as a "pig", upwind or down.

barnakiel · 15-11-2009, 08:36

Oyster 46.
displ. 17.5 light, sail area (sic 150%!!!???) 120 sq m,

Equals pig.

They sailed in good puff from Cadiz to Las Palmas and the driver admits getting her to go at 8 knots was a challenge.

Oysters are pretty like a grand piano and they sail like one. But I do not mean they are bad or slow boats - I meant they are more like motor-sailor than a pure sailing boat. Off course, you throw one my way I will do my best to catch it ;-). Then I would sell it and buy myself a sailing boat, the excess of cash in the cruising kitty to take me around the world.

If you want upwind performance and a good turn of speed downwind then you get a sailing boat not a motor-sailor.

Example of what I consider a sailing boat:
J 46
displ. 11.0 half load, SA (sic 100% as it should be) 95 sq m

Equals a sailing boat.

utahmonty · 15-11-2009, 10:21

For what its worth does this type of keel impress anyone other than the paparatsi? I understand these keels are std shoal options for the oyster 46

Any good news for me?

Ewan

Randyonr3 · 15-11-2009, 13:13

Just a note from personal experance..
when We bought our boat, I was interested in the way she sails, and sails, and sails, and then after we bought her and started cruising, we found that all that performance crap went out the window..
and I come from a racing background, so My ideal cruising boat was a FIRST Series Beneteau.. A true thoroughbred, with 65 feet of mast and a deep keel at 8 feet 6 inches.. But now that we've been on the boat, cruising for a few years, I'm starting to think different, just a little..
Now I still love her lines, and she's sexy as hell, but as age creeps upon me, sexy isnt as inportant as the all-round workings of the boat.. and I find myself saying damn thats mast is high more often,and damn that water is shallow here..
So, to keep from bouncing off the bottom, and the ability to go a little further up that river, and maybe find those hide-away spots that deeper keels cant get to..
I think I'd lean more tword a shorter keel..
Remember the actuall time you'll be sailing, opposed to the time just settin around in a gunk-hole, injoying the cruising life.. Find a boat that lives well, comfortable at anchor, and easy to get around in a tight area.....
And if you ever run across a FIRST 42, A true Thoroughbred Racer, built to haul ass in open ocen conditions, tyed up under a shade tree somewhere, give me a wave, as I'll be the one taking life easy........

barnakiel · 15-11-2009, 16:37

Performance considerations aside, I like the idea of the shallow keel per se.

If I were to upgrade from my little shooter (1.25 deep, light boat) I would not go for anything deeper than 1.7, preferably less. And if I could have a shallow cat or a lifting keel, I would be very, very tempted.

b.

14-11-2009, 07:49	#1
utahmonty Registered User Join Date: Nov 2009 Posts: 9	Oyster 46 Shoal Keel vs Long Keel If any one has experiance of a shoal keel vessel as above would you care to comment on the pros and cons please. I am put of by the shallow keel as i fear performance and to-wind issues, what do you say guys and girls, am i right or am i as always wrong ? Also i fear sliding of the wave in heavy seas, Look forward to hearing from any one with relevant input. Ewan

14-11-2009, 16:26	#2
MarkJ Registered User Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: Asia - on Sea Life Boat: Beneteau 393 "Sea Life" Posts: 3,210 Images: 6	Unless you are racing it would make little difference. If there were 2 boats side by side I would select the deep keel.... But if its a selection between and Oyster and another boat then pick the oyster. __________________ OurLifeAtSea.com

15-11-2009, 10:21	#6
utahmonty Registered User Join Date: Nov 2009 Posts: 9	Scheel Keel shallow keel For what its worth does this type of keel impress anyone other than the paparatsi? I understand these keels are std shoal options for the oyster 46 Any good news for me? Ewan

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14-11-2009, 16:49	#3
barnakiel Registered User Join Date: Aug 2009 Location: between the devil and the deep blue sea Boat: a sailing boat Posts: 1,484	Friends here sailed in for the ARC. It is 1.75 versus 2.16 (metric) so she is deep anyway. Some special kind of keel named HPB marketed as an improvement towards sailing characteristics, balast/disp and AVS not mentioned but she is Cat A Euro. The boat that sailed in is believed to be a pig and upwind performance will be just so. But upwind performance is not what sells this sort of boat. For upwind performance please get a J boat, First, etc.. I would elect the shallow keel, because I believe it is as safe as the deep keel and gives acces to a couple of shallow anchoring / cruising spots. (Bahamas?) b.

15-11-2009, 08:36	#5
barnakiel Registered User Join Date: Aug 2009 Location: between the devil and the deep blue sea Boat: a sailing boat Posts: 1,484	Oyster 46. displ. 17.5 light, sail area (sic 150%!!!???) 120 sq m, Equals pig. They sailed in good puff from Cadiz to Las Palmas and the driver admits getting her to go at 8 knots was a challenge. Oysters are pretty like a grand piano and they sail like one. But I do not mean they are bad or slow boats - I meant they are more like motor-sailor than a pure sailing boat. Off course, you throw one my way I will do my best to catch it ;-). Then I would sell it and buy myself a sailing boat, the excess of cash in the cruising kitty to take me around the world. If you want upwind performance and a good turn of speed downwind then you get a sailing boat not a motor-sailor. Example of what I consider a sailing boat: J 46 displ. 11.0 half load, SA (sic 100% as it should be) 95 sq m Equals a sailing boat.

15-11-2009, 13:13	#7
Randyonr3 Registered User Join Date: Nov 2007 Location: presently, California Delta..heading south in the fall Boat: Beneteau FIRST42 Posts: 358	Just a note from personal experance.. when We bought our boat, I was interested in the way she sails, and sails, and sails, and then after we bought her and started cruising, we found that all that performance crap went out the window.. and I come from a racing background, so My ideal cruising boat was a FIRST Series Beneteau.. A true thoroughbred, with 65 feet of mast and a deep keel at 8 feet 6 inches.. But now that we've been on the boat, cruising for a few years, I'm starting to think different, just a little.. Now I still love her lines, and she's sexy as hell, but as age creeps upon me, sexy isnt as inportant as the all-round workings of the boat.. and I find myself saying damn thats mast is high more often,and damn that water is shallow here.. So, to keep from bouncing off the bottom, and the ability to go a little further up that river, and maybe find those hide-away spots that deeper keels cant get to.. I think I'd lean more tword a shorter keel.. Remember the actuall time you'll be sailing, opposed to the time just settin around in a gunk-hole, injoying the cruising life.. Find a boat that lives well, comfortable at anchor, and easy to get around in a tight area..... And if you ever run across a FIRST 42, A true Thoroughbred Racer, built to haul ass in open ocen conditions, tyed up under a shade tree somewhere, give me a wave, as I'll be the one taking life easy........

15-11-2009, 16:37	#8
barnakiel Registered User Join Date: Aug 2009 Location: between the devil and the deep blue sea Boat: a sailing boat Posts: 1,484	Performance considerations aside, I like the idea of the shallow keel per se. If I were to upgrade from my little shooter (1.25 deep, light boat) I would not go for anything deeper than 1.7, preferably less. And if I could have a shallow cat or a lifting keel, I would be very, very tempted. b.