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Old 25-08-2011, 16:34   #31
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Re: Opinions On Boat Size ?

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Originally Posted by cdennyb View Post
Stepping up from a mono to a multi was an awesome experience ...
Stepping up? Really?
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Old 25-08-2011, 17:32   #32
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Can anyone say?: Yeah, I sail 40' racer type boat and I spend more time sailing because the boat moves at 6.5 knts on a beam reach with 10 knts true wind, Kind of statement?
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Old 25-08-2011, 17:59   #33
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Re: Opinions On Boat Size ?

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Stepping up? Really?
Im confused now whether i stepped up from my Wharram Tiki 26 to my 6m Havsfirdra, or stepped down.

Since going back to a monohull at least i dont have to change hull to use the heads!! There are no heads!

20ft LOA is my abosolute minimum size now for cruising. We have done a few overnighters with 2 on board and its just comfortable enough. Single handed the space is absolutely fine for a spartan existance. However i would give, and pay, anything (problem is im dirt poor) to add an extra 10 feet to the waterline. To raise that hull speed would be awesome.

So i am looking to also move up in size when possible. The difference in averaging 4.5 knots and 5.5 is huge, gives you that extra security when planning around rough weather. Plus i might actually get standing headroom one day!
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Old 25-08-2011, 18:24   #34
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Re: Opinions On Boat Size ?

i must address the size difference between 35 ft sand 41, i sail 41 because is way easier to sail it than my 35. 35 is sloop. 41 is ketch. i would rather face a storm or gale in a 41 ft ketch than a 30 or 35 ft sloop--been there done that in both. 41 beats out big time. the ketch is easier to sail than the sloop-- and i donot pay for berthing unless is hurrycame season and i am there. now i am finding i am paying less than many of the smaller boats here. so.... i would MUCH rather sail a 41 than a 35 or 30.
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Old 25-08-2011, 19:06   #35
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Re: Opinions On Boat Size ?

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Originally Posted by Dangen View Post
Can anyone say?: Yeah, I sail 40' racer type boat and I spend more time sailing because the boat moves at 6.5 knts on a beam reach with 10 knts true wind, Kind of statement?
kick the speed up a little and I'll say yes...................
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Old 25-08-2011, 19:53   #36
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Originally Posted by Randyonr3

kick the speed up a little and I'll say yes...................
Heheh, yeah! It's exactly what I was hoping to hear. It may sound strange for some of you who are in areas where there are bigger marinas or yacht clubs wits lots of different boats, then you can just witness other boats sail and have a good idea of how they perform and chat with other boat owners to get their feedbacks. In the marina where I'm at, there is none of the boats in the category im interested in.
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Old 25-08-2011, 20:29   #37
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Re: Opinions On Boat Size ?

I think when we talk about the ability to single-hand a boat we need to think about the situation when things go wrong, not when we are just handling two sheets and a tiller. What if your halyard gets stuck and the sail won't drop. What if the motor won't start and you have to sail in to the slip. What if you get a line fouled around the prop in a crowded anchorage on a windy day. As soon as things go wrong, the size of the boat (esp the displacement and the weight of the sails) would seemingly matter a lot more. At this point I still have a light boat, but my wife and I consider these bad situations when we decide how big a boat we want to take cruising with two kids.
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Old 25-08-2011, 22:14   #38
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Re: Opinions On Boat Size ?

had a line befoul the prop in a wild running current in appalachiacola, fla trying to exit a slip in muni marina.... we had to wait a while for the diver to unfoul it-- was exciting. boat was 37 ft sloop
was hit in my 41 off pacific coast of mexico just north of cabo san lucas with a 60+ kt breeze which caused my mizzen boom preventer which was prevented to my taffrail--a decorative cap rail, to break the taffrail clean off for about 2 1/2-3 ft of curved teakwood....we clocked over 8 kts on gps for our speed..... that was exciting. otherwise we just sailed and fished as cruisers usually do.....
man who owned the 37 i sailed with in gulf of mexico actually used to listen to vhf weather presented by not one accurate assessment--- we were pooped by a quartering sea at 0300...was exciting. cold too. then the flying fish hit me --it was surfing that particular sea......
these were short handed sailing experiences....
kids learn fast--i know--i was taught to sail at age 7 thru 18. best years to learn anything.
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Old 25-08-2011, 22:43   #39
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Re: Opinions On Boat Size ?

We want to cruise over oceans. My kid is going to be 12 when we leave and my wife is over five foot tall, but only on humid days. This meant we shopped for a size that my wife, ALONE at 30 knots, four metre waves and 1,000 NM from land, could handle in terms of sails, steering and safety at 4 AM local time without waking me up.

It also meant it had to be a boat where my son, who will also likely be just five feet or so tall in two years, could helm safely for two hour day watches.

That put an upper limit of 41 feet LOA.

We needed to carry 140 gallons of fuel, 200 of water and three-six months provisions, we needed a small workshop for repairs, enough educational material to "boat school" my son through the appropriate grade, and sufficient battery capacity to spend five to six days at anchor when it was cloudy (though we have 4 x 135 W solar panels) and windless (though we have a 400 W wind genny), without switching on the diesel to run the alternators. That means we have a lot of manual stuff: head, foot pumps, windlass, winches, and the electrical stuff is kept simple (fridge, SSB, occasional radar).

That put a lower limit of 45 feet. Oopsie.

We solved it by going for a steel pilothouse, full keel motorsailer. We have enough room, stowage and tankage to keep 24 packs of tinned stew off the cabin sole, and the pilothouse breaks up the boat into four separate rooms that actually are semi-private from each other: aft cabin up steps to pilothouse, up steps to aft deck, down a step to sidedeck, walk forward to bow, beneath which is the workshop (no V-berth, no problem, and behind a collision bulkhead is the saloon, galley and head, and up three steps to the pilothouse, which has a helm, a sort of day bed and a place to do nav.

So it's 41 feet, which my wife can sail solo in heavy air. It's the design, not the LOA, that's made the difference.

She's cutter-rigged; I would've ideally preferred a ketch, but I can certainly live without it. We will travel at a stately five knots (yes, it actually sails well), but with more independence from the shore and, I hope, a greater willingness to go off the beaten cruiser track.
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Old 26-08-2011, 05:27   #40
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Re: Opinions On Boat Size ?

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Originally Posted by cdennyb View Post
+1 to you Tim, you and I share the same thoughts on this subject. Stepping up from a mono to a multi was an awesome experience and originally going to a smaller vessel didn't impress me and taking a 2 day trip on a 46' multi was heaven. So... after that little educational outing... out with the mono and in with a bigger multi. Damn the cost associated with it, it's only a couple of times a year and we won't be anchored or berthed in an expensive sailboat trailer park. LOL
Age catches up with everyone I guess

......I always fancied getting a sidecar for my Triumph, very practical and still "biking" but somehow kinda misses the point..........
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Old 26-08-2011, 09:05   #41
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Re: Opinions On Boat Size ?

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Originally Posted by FecklessDolphin View Post
I think when we talk about the ability to single-hand a boat we need to think about the situation when things go wrong, not when we are just handling two sheets and a tiller. What if your halyard gets stuck and the sail won't drop. What if the motor won't start and you have to sail in to the slip. What if you get a line fouled around the prop in a crowded anchorage on a windy day. As soon as things go wrong, the size of the boat (esp the displacement and the weight of the sails) would seemingly matter a lot more. At this point I still have a light boat, but my wife and I consider these bad situations when we decide how big a boat we want to take cruising with two kids.
We started sailing with a Bosten Whaler 4.6, and as many, went through the 2ft-itis..
Was looking for a FIRST 38 but all we looked at had been riden hard and put away wet..
The FIRST 42 is the same boat (some what) with a little more space..
And I not only single hand it but do it in "race" conditions..
as far as crap going wrong and having to fix it, as a halyard hanging up, I'd rather have a larger boat under me when I'm climbing the mast than a smaller one..
sailing it into a slip, or sailing backwards out of the slip for that matter, is easy, she'll turn within her own length and an ease to work on the large decks..
The wife and I have traveled a few thousand miles aboard her, been in the wash a few times, gotton pooped, and put up with some pretty strong winds and it seems odd but
The nasty-er it gets, the better she sails...
Points Like a Hound Dog, and Sails Like She's On a Set Of Tracks..
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Old 26-08-2011, 09:56   #42
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Re: Opinions On Boat Size ?

Quote:
Originally Posted by RainDog

Buy the biggest boat you can afford - you get a nicer boat, but it is more expensive and you are less likely to sail it.


Why do say this????? I'm sure I sail my boat at least as much as anyone else at my marina, and probably more.
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I'm not sure Raindog was making that argument himself; I think he was paraphrasing what he thinks some people argue.

But -- I agree with you. Where I sail there is, if anything, a positive correlation between size and intensity of use, not negative. I'm based in the Hamble, where there are seven or eight marinas and hundreds of swinging and mid-river berths -- hundreds or thousands of boats. The bigger boats are often used by clubs or associations and are in constant use. Nor is there much if any relationship between the size and cost of boats on the Hamble and whether or not they are kept in expensive marina berths. A large proportion of the most expensive boats on the Hamble -- 65' Oysters, big Swans -- are kept in the middle of the river, when they are in port at all, which at least in summer is rare.

The bigger more expensive boats are often owned by keen, active, long-time sailors who have made their way up the decade-long waiting list for the coveted mid-river berths (with no water or electricity or walk-on access).

It is my experience that large motor yachts often go unused for weeks and months at a time. But large sailboats tend to be used intensively, at least around here. Perhaps when one has dropped a million or two on a sailboat, you feel like you had better be getting enough use out of it to justify it. Whereas if you have a small, inexpensive boat -- you can regard it as a toy and use it or not use it as you feel like.

I work full time and live a couple thousand miles away from the Hamble. But I got in 52 days at sea during 2010 according to my log, and over 90 days on board my big boat. I sail year-round even in below-freezing temperatures. Big-boat comforts -- i.e., central heating -- are a definite plus for that kind of use.

As evidence for what I say about the intensity of use of big boats on the Hamble: I have been myself on a coveted mid-river mooring in the Hamble for most of the year, although I have been on the waiting list less than a year. How is that? There's no waiting list during the season for sublet berths over 50 feet -- the big boats are all out cruising abroad.
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