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Old 24-06-2016, 15:54   #76
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Re: Opinion on Cape George 36

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Many of the hulls were finished by owners. Some were the equals or better than the Cape George quality but not all.
You are too kind. Really. Most of the owner-completed boats couldn't hold a candle to the yard-completed ones, at least by my experience. But there are also very high quality owner-completed boats - I like to think my Carina is one of them. Many of the people who bought them in the late '70s did a workmanlike job (or not) and went cruising - no interest in making a museum piece.

Greg
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Old 24-06-2016, 20:06   #77
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Re: Opinion on Cape George 36

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Actually apples and oranges comparison. The above boat is an owner built boat with the quirks that these boats often have. Equipment is definitely high end, plastic ports, etc. Anyone seen a neon flasher depth sounder since the '70s??? Boat is setup for cold water, diesel stove, and wouldn't be easy to optimize for cruising in warmer water. Same hull as the one originally mentioned but that's the end of the comparison. There is another center cockpit boat that is even uglier for sale and maybe cheaper.



Many of the hulls were finished by owners. Some were the equals or better than the Cape George quality but not all.

So funny. Of the pictures you'd put up to advertise the boat, why would you post pics of a 30 year old obsolete piece of electronics... Like posting pictures of rats nest wiring, dirty heads, and the list of ad "no-no's" goes on and on.


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Old 26-06-2016, 10:06   #78
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Re: Opinion on Cape George 36

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So funny. Of the pictures you'd put up to advertise the boat, why would you post pics of a 30 year old obsolete piece of electronics... Like posting pictures of rats nest wiring, dirty heads, and the list of ad "no-no's" goes on and on.


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Maybe so, but every seller has to weigh the costs of upgrading vs. improved chances of selling near your asking price. You usually won't get the costs of those upgrades back, and maybe someone interested in a boat like this at this price point wouldn't care. But then making it look more shipshape can say a lot about the owner's upkeep and so usually worth the time and expense.

I'm contemplating having to undergo a similar process as my big Bristol is no longer fitting my needs as well as it once did. As another poster pointed out, it remains a tough time to be a seller as the recreational marine market doesn't seem to have improved significantly from the 2007-08 economic crash. There still seems to be an awful lot of remarkable older boats out there at great prices.

Thanks to those who commented on these wonderful CG boats generally, and the CG 38 in San Fran. that I've had my eye on.
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Old 26-06-2016, 14:58   #79
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Re: Opinion on Cape George 36

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Maybe so, but every seller has to weigh the costs of upgrading vs. improved chances of selling near your asking price. You usually won't get the costs of those upgrades back, and maybe someone interested in a boat like this at this price point wouldn't care. But then making it look more shipshape can say a lot about the owner's upkeep and so usually worth the time and expense.



I'm contemplating having to undergo a similar process as my big Bristol is no longer fitting my needs as well as it once did. As another poster pointed out, it remains a tough time to be a seller as the recreational marine market doesn't seem to have improved significantly from the 2007-08 economic crash. There still seems to be an awful lot of remarkable older boats out there at great prices.



Thanks to those who commented on these wonderful CG boats generally, and the CG 38 in San Fran. that I've had my eye on.

Agree completely on your first paragraph, but of 15 pictures why put up detractors?

Mike


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Old 27-06-2016, 07:05   #80
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Re: Opinion on Cape George 36

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My recollection of the translated english version of the book was that they were knockdowns, not complete capsizes... Given that we have plenty of confirmed cases of open 60's and 50's completely capsizing, I would say this is a win to the heavy displacement long keel camp. Dispite owning a light fin keeler with a spade rudder, Id still rather be in a big old heavy steel long keeler in a real blow. I'd love to try a centreboarder in heavy seas. I think lying a hull would be horrible, but talking to some friends who took their twin fore and aft centreboarder deep into the southern ocean. They say she runs off very well in a blow with the fwd board lifted and just the aft board down. In this configuration she did not want to broach.
I could be wrong for I read so many books from Slocum, Adlard Cole "Heavy Weather Sailing" to Eric and Susan Hiscock numerous books & articles, but I remember clearly the French word "sancir" in "La Longue Route". It was the first time I came across that word which means to go stern over bow... I'll try to find my copy & tell you if indeed he used that word... Cheers!
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Old 28-06-2016, 05:54   #81
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Re: Opinion on Cape George 36

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I could be wrong for I read so many books from Slocum, Adlard Cole "Heavy Weather Sailing" to Eric and Susan Hiscock numerous books & articles, but I remember clearly the French word "sancir" in "La Longue Route". It was the first time I came across that word which means to go stern over bow... I'll try to find my copy & tell you if indeed he used that word... Cheers!
Ha Alain, I have often wondered how much the excellant translations by William Rodamor helped make Bernards books so captivating. I am sure the original french versions are good, but his first book sailing tobthe reefs was translated by someone else and it never struck the same chord with me at least.

I did recently find a passage in his excellent little instruction book 'A sea vagabonds world' that describes on the long way "3 knockdowns with the masts horizontal and four more serous ones with the mast well below the horizontal and the keel 30 deg and once probably 40 degrees above the water."

I guess we can now debate about what is the definition of a knockdown vs a capsize.. But regardless it sounds pretty unpleasant, and the knockdowns were more severe than I had remembered.

It would be interesting to see how the originals in french describe it.
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Old 28-06-2016, 09:37   #82
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Re: Opinion on Cape George 36

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Ha Alain, I have often wondered how much the excellant translations by William Rodamor helped make Bernards books so captivating. I am sure the original french versions are good, but his first book sailing tobthe reefs was translated by someone else and it never struck the same chord with me at least.... I guess we can now debate about what is the definition of a knockdown vs a capsize.. But regardless it sounds pretty unpleasant, and the knockdowns were more severe than I had remembered. It would be interesting to see how the originals in french describe it.
I don't mind if I'm wrong about "sancir" or not. My real concern is WHY should we have a fixed underwater architecture while sailing in so different conditions. When you sail upwind you need a "wing" for the lift & lead deep down to contrebalance the wind pressure. But when you do a month passage down the trades or when you look for a safe anchorage**, you don't need that much keel & no (main) centerboard. Planes, birds & fishes have variable architecture, why not sailboats ? I know, I know, centerboards are more work but I'm convinced that the advantages are worth them. I would accept the compromise of keel-centerboard such as the Tartan 37 with its 4' draft

**I remember, in a previous life (1978!) we were cruising with two French sailboats, an 11m Kirk Amel & a twin tandem centerboards Trismus: At one anchorage, on a small island north of Venezuela, both our C&N 31 & the Kirk had to anchor outside a nice "pond" where the full centerboard Trismus was able to anchor with its bow... on the beach ! The kids on the Trismus would jump in the water, walk to the beach & play...
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Old 28-06-2016, 17:45   #83
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Re: Opinion on Cape George 36

I think this is a great topic Alain, probably worth its own thread. Prehaps we should stop sidetracking this one and start a new thread. In fact that is what I will do!

Centreboard Trismus type vs fixed keel architecture
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