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Old 20-01-2013, 18:59   #1
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No backstay rig...

Hi all, perhaps this question has been asked before, but what are your thoughts on a no-back stay rig?. I am talking about a two-pair swepet back speader mast on a 25 footer. Some say that those rigs don´t work properly since you cant control sail shape, etc. We know that most yachts carry back stays but I´ve seen new designs with big mainsails without a back stay.

Your views are welcomed!!

Thanks
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Old 20-01-2013, 19:07   #2
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Re: No backstay rig...

Yes. you can still control the shape. Vang, Cunningham, outhaul etc. There are lots of no backstay boats. However, I assume the boat your talking about is a fractional rig also. For a little 25 footer, no problem. Just one less thing to maintain.

The only real downside is when running downwind, the boom and main wont go as far. As long as you have chafe protection for the main, no problem.
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Old 20-01-2013, 19:10   #3
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Re: No backstay rig...

On smaller boats the back stay is there to hold the mast up until the mainsail is hoisted or running before the wind.

What make of boats are these? I'd like to see the rig that doesn't need a back stay, that isn't a already a free standing rig..
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Old 20-01-2013, 19:15   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by delmarrey View Post
What make of boats are these? I'd like to see the rig that doesn't need a back stay, that isn't a already a free standing rig..
Pretty much all Hunters.. they even have a 50' without a backstay - the aft-most diagonal is the topping lift.
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Old 20-01-2013, 19:32   #5
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Re: No backstay rig...

Quote:
Originally Posted by delmarrey View Post
On smaller boats the back stay is there to hold the mast up until the mainsail is hoisted or running before the wind.

What make of boats are these? I'd like to see the rig that doesn't need a back stay, that isn't a already a free standing rig..
No it isnt. The rig will stay up regardless of a backstay. There are multiple designs that dont have a backstay...

Hunters
Tigers
Some Farrs
Newer Dufours
Multiple trailer yacht designs
Most sports boats like Melges24
Just about every off the beach cat and dinghy
Jeanneau Sun Odyssey range
I am sure google will add substantial numbers to that list.
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Old 20-01-2013, 19:33   #6
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Re: No backstay rig...

Our trailerable boat (Sandpiper 565) doesn't have a backstay, just the set-back side-stays with swept-back spreaders.

On most points of sail, it's not a problem. But in the region from broad-run to dead downwind in a good blow, it sometimes seems to me like the rig 'pumps' a bit. I've managed to reduce the severity of the pumping by loosening the boom vang, which I think allows the sail to flex a bit more in gusts.

As we get more comfortable with stronger winds, I'm thinking of adding a backstay, just to resist some of the forward motion, in hopes of preventing a downwind dismasting. The previous owner had actually done that, but I opted to restore the stock standing rigging.
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Old 20-01-2013, 19:35   #7
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Re: No backstay rig...

Quote:
Originally Posted by ozskipper View Post
No it isnt. The rig will stay up regardless of a backstay. There are multiple designs that dont have a backstay...

Hunters
Tigers
Some Farrs
Newer Dufours
Multiple trailer yacht designs
Most sports boats like Melges24
Just about every off the beach cat and dinghy
Jeanneau Sun Odyssey range
I am sure google will add substantial numbers to that list.
Well, I guess I haven't been keeping up with the new rigs out there!

Quote:
What? No backstay?
Hunter’s trademark B&R Selden rig with swept-back spreaders and no backstay continues on the 50. This design can allow for a longer boom and a big, roachy main. However, the review boat came with the smaller sail area of the in-mast furling version with vertical battens, an option allowing easy sail handling. Up front there was a self-tacking roller staysail with genoa rolling off the forestay.

The Selden mast support is good with the inner shrouds connected to the internal hull frame and outboard shrouds on thick stainless chainplates while the compression post is integrated in the forward saloon bulkhead.
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Old 20-01-2013, 19:36   #8
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Re: No backstay rig...

Perry on B&R rig

Bergstrom & Ridder 38

Hunter ad describing B&R rig:

The B & R rig | Cruising World
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Old 20-01-2013, 19:47   #9
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Re: No backstay rig...

I see......... a tripod with stabilizers.
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Old 21-01-2013, 17:15   #10
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Re: No backstay rig...

Many of the yachts designed by Gregg Elliott (NZL) from the late-80s on had/have no backstay. As per previous poster mainsheet tension and vang sheeting become much more important.
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