Nine Years on the Hard - Page 2

michaeldsusa · 29-10-2009, 17:37

disuse is certainly a problem but looks like they went to a certain amount of trouble to put her in a tent and cared for her. as far as drug up the hill and forgot about her .... well I drove my '47 CJ-2 in nice shape back outa the way in the field and then life happened and there she sat for 30 yrs. so I understand how she could be forgotten..

whatever you do do it based on your own due diligence - don't walk away from what could be a great boat based on opinion of people who haven't seen her. no one on ebay expects to et full asking price either.

this opinion worth exactly what you paid for it

MarkJ · 29-10-2009, 18:35

I think it really depends on your goal in life.
Do you want to go cruising the tropical circumnavigation? Or do you want to work as a boat builder?

For the price you pay for the boat (not including what you wouold have to spend extra) you can afford a ready to go, low maintenance, ex-charter boat... buy in the BVI's today and sail away tomorrow.

Its your choice.

sailvayu · 29-10-2009, 19:56

Quote:

Originally Posted by MarkJ

For the price you pay for the boat (not including what you wouold have to spend extra) you can afford a ready to go, low maintenance, ex-charter boat... buy in the BVI's today and sail away tomorrow.

Its your choice.

I don't understand why anyone thinks buying a used charter boat is a good deal. Most i have inspected have been beat to s@#t put away wet patched with chewing gum and wishful thinking. If they were still good for cruising the charter companies would still be squeezing money out of them. They trade them because they are costing too much to maintain and all the equipment is falling apart. Get a boat that has spent most of it's life sitting in a slip and used a few weekend a year not 7 months of the year. I know some brokers that will not touch one with a 10 foot poll they know it come back and bit them.

Wayne Canning, AMS
projectboatzen.com

Dune · 29-10-2009, 18:50

Quote:

Originally Posted by sailvayu

Are there trees nearby (within 100 feet)

It has been said in the past that there are no stupid questions, only stupid answers. What is important about trees within 100 feet?

Chief Engineer · 29-10-2009, 21:58

I have been personally involved in the management of a couple yacht projects. Basically it involves co-ordinating work with various contractors and keeping tabs on yard bills (that they remain honest)

[QUOTE=sailvayu;
If you have not done this type of project before hire a project manager (this almost nobody does but will save you lots of money and wasted time, my guess is you will think back on this and wish you had

)

Good luck

Wayne Canning. AMS
projectboatzen.com[/QUOTE]

mike d. · 29-10-2009, 15:18

the systems are all the things the boat cannot function with out extraneous electronics and such are not part of a boat only additions to make handling a boat easier. fuel, engine, electrical, water systems, head systems, steering gear, bilge pumps, through hulls, prop shaft and prop., mast, standing/running rigging, winches, sails, ports, fixed windows, ventilation, hatches, etc. these are the bones of the boat.

Cheechako · 29-10-2009, 15:18

Good advice from Sailvayu... except, look for prices on other of the same boat deduct 30% from asking price, then deduct another 20% for this particular boat!

.....as far as the enigne goes....one option.... look at everything on the boat and decide "other than the engine" if you want it. If you do and can decide on a price, then just deduct $10k for the engine. Not a bad place to be .... you never know with a boat that's been sitting that long.... a quick sale for $25k might sound pretty good to the disillusioned owner right now.....

jm21 · 29-10-2009, 15:43

That was great Sailvayu, thank you very much!

They said the masts and rigging have been stored in a barn and there are sails in decent shape. I'd bet on the running rigging should to be replaced but that's pretty common on a boat that old.

I'm fine with replacing some hoses, greasing up winches, etc....but working on a diesel sounds like it's probably over my head. And I know a lot of things that seem like they shouldn't cost a whole lot like props and dodgers can be remarkably expensive.

I'm guessing they've done some work on it...they say it has GPS and those weren't all that common 9+ years ago from what I remember. I'm looking at the pictures and see what's probably the 100' power cord lying in the yard, so maybe it was hooked up to power too....maybe someone living aboard in the yard?

The wife urging a quick sale to get that damn boat out of the yard would be helpful, heh.

Cheechako · 29-10-2009, 16:02

Boy, just from what I'm reading it sounds like there might be a lot of stuff that goes with it. But also reading between the lines... maybe you dont want to be too much of a boat mechanic...? That is a big boat and even one that has been used will be a lot of work.
Unless the engine was heavily fogged and maybe refogged yearly... If I bought that boat I might not even turn the engine over.... remove the head ...look for rust etc on the cylinders and clean it up if there is light rust. Just might save it if you do it right... Heavily rusted... overhaul it.

jm21 · 29-10-2009, 16:49

Well turns out they just trucked the boat up there and then haven't touched it since. Seems crazy to me...maybe it's more of a project than they're letting on.

I'd like to learn a bit more about diesels, but I've never had one before and don't know a whole lot about them. My uncle is a retired machinist though and has worked on the diesel engines in his boats a lot though, might be willing to help out or at least give me some advice.

I need some new hobbies but boat restoration seems to be an awfully expensive one.

sailvayu · 29-10-2009, 17:03

"I need some new hobbies but boat restoration seems to be an awfully expensive one."

HA! it aint a hobby it is a lifestyle! lol and yes it is expensive and not for the faint of heart, but it is doable. But make sure you are committed or you will be selling this boat just like this guy is.....dreams gone bust!

Don't mean to be hard but make sure this is what you want and you are willing to work for it. The rewards are great but you pay in all your free time and money.

Oh and if you go ahead and the hull survey is good think about an engine survey. See.... the money spending starts before you even own it lol.

Wayne Canning, AMS
projectboatzen.com

Cheechako · 29-10-2009, 16:59

Regardless of restoring anything, just putting what's there back together and getting it working will require a big committment. You need to really want to go sailing and live aboard for that committment. Otherwise a nice little 30 footer will give you the same pleasure....

Solitude · 29-10-2009, 17:10

Just jumping in and the others have vastly more knowledge than me but I have to ask after briefly reading through the posts.

Have you had a boat...a big sailboat before. There could be a huge amount of small issues with it and some big ones too.

Don’t buy someone else’s problems!

If you are very experienced or are willing to potentially spend double the purchase price in work ok. Believe me you will have enough of a hobby with just doing maintenance on a smaller good boat

It is expensive!

Why didn't this guy have it in the water sailing.

Kimarah · 29-10-2009, 17:20

Something else to remember, rubber goes hard with age, and it then may fail under use. Other components may also appear to be working and then subsequently fail.

Our first boat was a Catalina 27 that had sat idle (in the water, not on the hard) for some long period before we bought her. I think things started to fail the second weekend we took her out- stove, head, water pump, port seals... you get the idea.

Having said that, after some unexpected start up costs, she turned into a terrific boat, with a lot less wear and tear in most areas than others of the same vintage. When we bought the new boat, we just expected the same types of failures to happen. We weren't disappointed.:-) (Along with the engine, I would suggest paying particular attention to hoses, since they can be critical.)

Carrie

Cherp · 29-10-2009, 19:31

Looks a lovely type of boat. Go and have a good poke about in her. If she's been covered, rot from fresh water should not be too much of a problem. She may be a bit mouldy here and there, but you can get rid of that fairly easily. Things with rubber in them may need to be replaced as it will have gone hard from lack of use. But she definitely looks worth a close look to me. If she looks OK to you, hire a surveyor and brief him well. Good luck.

29-10-2009, 18:35	#2
MarkJ Registered User Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: Asia - on Sea Life Boat: Beneteau 393 "Sea Life" Posts: 3,025	I think it really depends on your goal in life. Do you want to go cruising the tropical circumnavigation? Or do you want to work as a boat builder? For the price you pay for the boat (not including what you wouold have to spend extra) you can afford a ready to go, low maintenance, ex-charter boat... buy in the BVI's today and sail away tomorrow. Its your choice. __________________ Malaysia... near Singapore If you are going up G.O.A 2010 PM me. OurLifeAtSea.com

29-10-2009, 21:58	#5
Chief Engineer Registered User Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: North of Baltimore Boat: Ericson 27 & 18' Herrmann Catboat Posts: 2,007	You are right here!!!!!! I have been personally involved in the management of a couple yacht projects. Basically it involves co-ordinating work with various contractors and keeping tabs on yard bills (that they remain honest) [QUOTE=sailvayu; If you have not done this type of project before hire a project manager (this almost nobody does but will save you lots of money and wasted time, my guess is you will think back on this and wish you had ) Good luck Wayne Canning. AMS projectboatzen.com[/QUOTE]

29-10-2009, 17:10	#13
Solitude Registered User Join Date: Nov 2008 Location: West Coast, BC , Canada Boat: Cascade Posts: 374	Just jumping in and the others have vastly more knowledge than me but I have to ask after briefly reading through the posts. Have you had a boat...a big sailboat before. There could be a huge amount of small issues with it and some big ones too. Don’t buy someone else’s problems! If you are very experienced or are willing to potentially spend double the purchase price in work ok. Believe me you will have enough of a hobby with just doing maintenance on a smaller good boat It is expensive! Why didn't this guy have it in the water sailing. __________________ Go outside and PLAY!

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29-10-2009, 17:37	#1
michaeldsusa Registered User Join Date: Aug 2006 Boat: Pilothouse Pan Oceanic 46' S/V Soon to be Renamed Posts: 73	disuse is certainly a problem but looks like they went to a certain amount of trouble to put her in a tent and cared for her. as far as drug up the hill and forgot about her .... well I drove my '47 CJ-2 in nice shape back outa the way in the field and then life happened and there she sat for 30 yrs. so I understand how she could be forgotten.. whatever you do do it based on your own due diligence - don't walk away from what could be a great boat based on opinion of people who haven't seen her. no one on ebay expects to et full asking price either. this opinion worth exactly what you paid for it

29-10-2009, 15:18	#6
mike d. Registered User Join Date: Jun 2006 Posts: 180	the systems are all the things the boat cannot function with out extraneous electronics and such are not part of a boat only additions to make handling a boat easier. fuel, engine, electrical, water systems, head systems, steering gear, bilge pumps, through hulls, prop shaft and prop., mast, standing/running rigging, winches, sails, ports, fixed windows, ventilation, hatches, etc. these are the bones of the boat.

29-10-2009, 15:18	#7
Cheechako Registered User Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: Skagit City, WA Boat: Fellippi 32 Posts: 2,205	Good advice from Sailvayu... except, look for prices on other of the same boat deduct 30% from asking price, then deduct another 20% for this particular boat! .....as far as the enigne goes....one option.... look at everything on the boat and decide "other than the engine" if you want it. If you do and can decide on a price, then just deduct $10k for the engine. Not a bad place to be .... you never know with a boat that's been sitting that long.... a quick sale for $25k might sound pretty good to the disillusioned owner right now.....

29-10-2009, 15:43	#8
jm21 Registered User Join Date: Sep 2009 Location: Washington, USA Posts: 73	That was great Sailvayu, thank you very much! They said the masts and rigging have been stored in a barn and there are sails in decent shape. I'd bet on the running rigging should to be replaced but that's pretty common on a boat that old. I'm fine with replacing some hoses, greasing up winches, etc....but working on a diesel sounds like it's probably over my head. And I know a lot of things that seem like they shouldn't cost a whole lot like props and dodgers can be remarkably expensive. I'm guessing they've done some work on it...they say it has GPS and those weren't all that common 9+ years ago from what I remember. I'm looking at the pictures and see what's probably the 100' power cord lying in the yard, so maybe it was hooked up to power too....maybe someone living aboard in the yard? The wife urging a quick sale to get that damn boat out of the yard would be helpful, heh.

29-10-2009, 16:02	#9
Cheechako Registered User Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: Skagit City, WA Boat: Fellippi 32 Posts: 2,205	Boy, just from what I'm reading it sounds like there might be a lot of stuff that goes with it. But also reading between the lines... maybe you dont want to be too much of a boat mechanic...? That is a big boat and even one that has been used will be a lot of work. Unless the engine was heavily fogged and maybe refogged yearly... If I bought that boat I might not even turn the engine over.... remove the head ...look for rust etc on the cylinders and clean it up if there is light rust. Just might save it if you do it right... Heavily rusted... overhaul it.

29-10-2009, 16:49	#10
jm21 Registered User Join Date: Sep 2009 Location: Washington, USA Posts: 73	Well turns out they just trucked the boat up there and then haven't touched it since. Seems crazy to me...maybe it's more of a project than they're letting on. I'd like to learn a bit more about diesels, but I've never had one before and don't know a whole lot about them. My uncle is a retired machinist though and has worked on the diesel engines in his boats a lot though, might be willing to help out or at least give me some advice. I need some new hobbies but boat restoration seems to be an awfully expensive one.

29-10-2009, 17:03	#11
sailvayu Registered User Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Wilmington, NC Boat: Irwin 40 Posts: 98	"I need some new hobbies but boat restoration seems to be an awfully expensive one." HA! it aint a hobby it is a lifestyle! lol and yes it is expensive and not for the faint of heart, but it is doable. But make sure you are committed or you will be selling this boat just like this guy is.....dreams gone bust! Don't mean to be hard but make sure this is what you want and you are willing to work for it. The rewards are great but you pay in all your free time and money. Oh and if you go ahead and the hull survey is good think about an engine survey. See.... the money spending starts before you even own it lol. Wayne Canning, AMS projectboatzen.com

29-10-2009, 16:59	#12
Cheechako Registered User Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: Skagit City, WA Boat: Fellippi 32 Posts: 2,205	Regardless of restoring anything, just putting what's there back together and getting it working will require a big committment. You need to really want to go sailing and live aboard for that committment. Otherwise a nice little 30 footer will give you the same pleasure....

29-10-2009, 17:20	#14
Kimarah Registered User Join Date: Sep 2009 Location: Solomons, MD Boat: Prout Manta 38 Posts: 7	Something else to remember, rubber goes hard with age, and it then may fail under use. Other components may also appear to be working and then subsequently fail. Our first boat was a Catalina 27 that had sat idle (in the water, not on the hard) for some long period before we bought her. I think things started to fail the second weekend we took her out- stove, head, water pump, port seals... you get the idea. Having said that, after some unexpected start up costs, she turned into a terrific boat, with a lot less wear and tear in most areas than others of the same vintage. When we bought the new boat, we just expected the same types of failures to happen. We weren't disappointed.:-) (Along with the engine, I would suggest paying particular attention to hoses, since they can be critical.) Carrie

29-10-2009, 19:31	#15
Cherp Registered User Join Date: Nov 2008 Boat: Swanson 36 cutter Posts: 49	Looks a lovely type of boat. Go and have a good poke about in her. If she's been covered, rot from fresh water should not be too much of a problem. She may be a bit mouldy here and there, but you can get rid of that fairly easily. Things with rubber in them may need to be replaced as it will have gone hard from lack of use. But she definitely looks worth a close look to me. If she looks OK to you, hire a surveyor and brief him well. Good luck.