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Old 03-01-2016, 18:12   #1
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Motor Sailor or Sailboat?

Hi people, would you class this Roberts 38 a Motor sailor or Sailboat?
She has a 50hp Yanmar & 2 Wheel Stations, also, does she appear she
would sail ok without the engine on?
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Old 03-01-2016, 18:24   #2
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Re: Motor Sailor or Sailboat?

Pilothouse sailboat.

Looks like it would sail fine. But my standards are not very high in that department.

But, my standards for cold weather comfort are very high. Looks like just the ticket for that.

I'd probably deep-six most of that crap on the back of the boat, however.

Steve
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Old 03-01-2016, 18:26   #3
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Re: Motor Sailor or Sailboat?

Can't tell much from the pix. You will get much better feedback if you post the specific model.

What YOU need to do, as a major factor in determining how well she will sail, is calculate the sail area to displacement ratio. This ratio is sail area in square feet, counting the area of the main and the area of the foretriangle (for a single master) divided by (displacement in pounds divided by 64), that divisor value to the 2/3 power. SA/D is basically the power to weight ratio of that boat. Motor sailers traditionally have a lower SA/D.
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Old 03-01-2016, 18:40   #4
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Re: Motor Sailor or Sailboat?

Personally, I'd call it a sailboat. With that cutter rig, she won't be a world beater upwind, but I'd be prepared to sail her most places.
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Old 03-01-2016, 19:09   #5
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Re: Motor Sailor or Sailboat?

Pilothouse sailboat.

I like PH sailboats and Motorsailers too, but I don't see them as necessarily the same thing.

I think to change that to a Motorsailer, it would likely have a larger engine, such as 85 hp or larger. Probably would need larger fuel capacity too.

As it is, would it sail well? Always a debatable question, based on expectations and personal preferences.
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Old 03-01-2016, 19:29   #6
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Re: Motor Sailor or Sailboat?

Well, I was confidently assured that our Swanson 42 is a Motor Sailor by someone here on C.F. recently.

Apparently it does not matter if you never need to start the engine, or if the boat in question has sailed the world for 42000 miles without relying on the engine. There is some kind of magic metric that can be applied without even meeting the boat that allows one to declare that it is not a sailboat as all the previous owners thought, but is in fact, a motor sailor. The best bit is even if the owner thinks they have a sailboat, it's actually a motor sailor, they are wrong!

Who would have guessed hey?

Anyway, from the somewhat arbitrary comparisons of sail area vs displacement available on the world-wide-wait I suspect you'd be labelled a motor sailor, as we are. (Actually, we are well South of the magic line) But my response to that is I am pretty sure the Roberts 38 was designed as a sailboat, first and foremost, as was our old Swanson 42. Therefore it will work well as a sailboat. Sure, not as fast as some of the new stuff out there, but perfectly sailable and I would much rather be on your Roberts 38 than some of the modern "non-motor-sailors" in our club when the proverbial pooh hits the air circulatory device.

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Old 04-01-2016, 09:51   #7
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Re: Motor Sailor or Sailboat?

I would tip to the sail boat side with only 50hp and she appears to have relatively fine lines. There are plenty of sail boats out there with lines not near as fine they just don't have a deckhouse so the question does not come up. Morgan OIs come to mind.
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Old 04-01-2016, 09:52   #8
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Re: Motor Sailor or Sailboat?

This Roberts 38 would qualify as a sailboat. It won't perform like an Open 60 around the world racing 'dinghy', but it should sail well in a bit of a breeze and be comfortable when the wind pipes up, too. As pointed out, it's a cutter rig (good for sail plan options when cruising) and appears to be set up for tropical cruising (don't deep six all that crap on the back, as it appears to be removable shades for when you're at anchor and the sun is trying to fry you alive). It appears to be a nice comfortable boat for extended cruising.
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Old 04-01-2016, 09:54   #9
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Re: Motor Sailor or Sailboat?

My 2 cents.

If you can steer & control the engine from that "house", then that "house" would be a pilothouse. Otherwise,it would be some type of deckhouse-you choose the name.

If a sailboat has a motor,it would be a motor sailer or aux sloop,cutter,etc.-as are 99% of what we call sailboats.

If a vessel has mast(s) & sail(s) (other than a small steadying sail) it would be a sailboat.

Now the next question is:

was the hull & rigging designed primarily to sail most of the time with a low HP aux motor for calms & docking?

or was the hull & rigging(smaller sail area) designed primarily for motoring with some sail assist.(extra HP & larger prop to easily surpass hull speed & maneuver like a powerboat) ?

To confuse things more there are many degrees of how much these vessels lean toward "good sailers" and/or good motorboats.

Personally,I call it a pilothouse motorsailer if it has a pilothouse as defined above and enough sail area to reach hull speed,but that's just me

Cheers/ Len
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Old 04-01-2016, 10:00   #10
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Re: Motor Sailor or Sailboat?

The Roberts 38 looks like sailboat hull to me & it has a decent amount of sail area. The HP is a bit low for a motorsailer,but.....
I can't tell what is in the "house".
Nice looking boat!!

Cheers/ Len
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Old 04-01-2016, 10:06   #11
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Re: Motor Sailor or Sailboat?

Quote:
Originally Posted by deblen View Post
My 2 cents.

If you can steer & control the engine from that "house", then that "house" would be a pilothouse. Otherwise,it would be some type of deckhouse-you choose the name.

If a sailboat has a motor,it would be a motor sailer or aux sloop,cutter,etc.-as are 99% of what we call sailboats.

If a vessel has mast(s) & sail(s) (other than a small steadying sail) it would be a sailboat.

Now the next question is:

was the hull & rigging designed primarily to sail most of the time with a low HP aux motor for calms & docking?

or was the hull & rigging(smaller sail area) designed primarily for motoring with some sail assist.(extra HP & larger prop to easily surpass hull speed & maneuver like a powerboat) ?

To confuse things more there are many degrees of how much these vessels lean toward "good sailers" and/or good motorboats.

Personally,I call it a pilothouse motorsailer if it has a pilothouse as defined above and enough sail area to reach hull speed,but that's just me

Cheers/ Len
Semantics semantics, pilot house, wheel house, deck house or dog house. If it has a head up?
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Old 04-01-2016, 13:04   #12
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Re: Motor Sailor or Sailboat?

Quote:
Originally Posted by deblen View Post
The Roberts 38 looks like sailboat hull to me & it has a decent amount of sail area. The HP is a bit low for a motorsailer,but.....
I can't tell what is in the "house".
Nice looking boat!!

Cheers/ Len
There is another Steering wheel, controls,compass etc in the wheelhouse
as well as the Steering wheel in the cockpit.
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Old 04-01-2016, 13:24   #13
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Re: Motor Sailor or Sailboat?

Well, I guess by whatever definition, my Nauticat NC-36 is a motosailer. It is ketch rigged with a fair amount of sail area, but it has a real pilothouse and an 85 HP Perkins diesel with two 80 gallon fuel tanks and weighs around 9 tons. Yes, her upwind sialing ability is rather poor, but she has a lot of windage with the pilothouse and I have gotten 5 knots out of her in a steady 10 knot breeze downwind and 6 knots with the same conditions on a beam reach.
It sure is nice when it is ugly outside to drop or shorten the sails, crank up the big diesel, turn on the autopilot and sit at watch in a warm pilothouse with a cup of tea!

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Old 04-01-2016, 13:32   #14
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Re: Motor Sailor or Sailboat?

Does it really make a difference what she is called? What does Goodson call his design?
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Old 04-01-2016, 14:15   #15
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Re: Motor Sailor or Sailboat?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cadence View Post
Does it really make a difference what she is called? What does Goodson call his design?
No-it doesn't matter as long as the owner is happy.
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