Cruisers Forum
 


Join CruisersForum Today

Reply
 
Thread Tools Rate Thread Display Modes
Old 04-03-2011, 20:08   #1
Registered User
 
betachz's Avatar

Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: TX
Boat: Morgan 45 CC
Posts: 56
Send a message via MSN to betachz Send a message via Yahoo to betachz
Morgan 44 Center Cockpit Nelson / Marek ?

My wife and I are considering putting an offer down on this Morgan 44 Center Cockpit: http://www.boats.com/boat-details/Morgan-44-Center-Cockpit/117915451 I'd really like to hear some feedback of what you guys think.

My wife and are looking for a boat that can take us coastal cruising and for longer hauls when we want to. Here are my pros and cons as I see it. Would love some feedback:


Pros:
  1. 44ft. and 23,500lbs - medium displacement
  2. Solid hand-laid FRP
  3. 5ft draft for going up and down East Coast and Bahamas (where we're starting)
  4. Separate Shower Stall
  5. 66hsp
  6. 215 gallons water storage (intend to stay out more than in marinas)
  7. Aft State room with nice center-line mattress
  8. Chart plotters in cockpit and at nav station
  9. Pretty clean inside and out... looks to have been taken care of.
  10. Dingy Davits
  11. 2x 20k BTU a/c units... not sure this is a pro for us.
  12. New heads
  13. New Fuel Tank
  14. Simple systems setup... not so much to take care of.
  15. Looks nice
  16. Nice space out back for fishing and working on the boat
  17. Good engine access.
  18. Partial Skeg hung Rudder
  19. Roller-furling Genoa
  20. Adler Barbour refrigeration
  21. Designer: Nelson / Marek
Cons:
  1. No Windlass? Yikes (will need to put this in definitely)
  2. Smallish battery bank and charging capability. Probably need high output alternator and 400+ah (will need to upgrade power grid)
  3. U-shaped Galley
  4. No Solar or Wind generators
  5. Feel a bit like systems are setup for a marina hopper more than cruiser?
  6. No extra sails... but the ones on her are in good shape.
  7. Nav station is a bit small, but has swing out chair to optimize space in hall.
  8. No easy access to water via Sugar Scoops etc... but i can live with that.
  9. Dingy doesn't come with the boat (so i get choose mine)
  10. No storm sails only that 135% Genoa. Would need to buy a good storm sail.
We expect to start on the East Coast and work our way up and down during the seasons and over to the Bahamas... but then eventually would like to move out to the Caribbean and to the west coast and we dream about one day working our way out to the south pacific. We'll be staying out away from marinas anchoring out more to save money and be in nature. I know not all boats can do everything, but we'd like to get as far as we can in 1 boat instead of buying many over the years. This boat seems solidly constructed and I feel she's seaworthy but I suppose the survey will tell me the rest.

Any input would be greatly appreciated!

Thanks.
__________________

__________________
betachz is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-03-2011, 20:56   #2
Registered User
 
Unicorn Dreams's Avatar

Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Clear Lake Marine Services - Seabrook, Texas
Boat: Gulfstar, Mark II Ketch, 43'
Posts: 2,359
Re: Morgan 44 Center Cockpit Nelson/Marek?

Don't know why u shape galley is a con. Puts everything in reach and convenient. Able to brace yourself when necessary.

Boat looks pretty nice.

Battery bank's know big deal, I would have updated someones old bank anyway.
__________________

__________________
Formerly Santana
The winds blow true,The skies stay blue,
Everyday is a good day for SAILING!!!!
Unicorn Dreams is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-03-2011, 21:05   #3
Registered User
 
betachz's Avatar

Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: TX
Boat: Morgan 45 CC
Posts: 56
Send a message via MSN to betachz Send a message via Yahoo to betachz
Re: Morgan 44 Center Cockpit Nelson/Marek?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Unicorn Dreams View Post
Don't know why u shape galley is a con. Puts everything in reach and convenient. Able to brace yourself when necessary.

Boat looks pretty nice.

Battery bank's know big deal, I would have updated someones old bank anyway.

Good point... put that in the wrong list Agreed on teh Battery bank.
__________________
betachz is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 04-03-2011, 21:11   #4
Moderator Emeritus
 
hummingway's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Gabriola Island & Victoria, British Columbia
Boat: Cooper 416 Honeysuckle
Posts: 6,933
Images: 5
Re: Morgan 44 Center Cockpit Nelson/Marek?

The water tankage is nice as long as it's balanced. The head with the shower is a nice size and I love the stern stateroom. You don't mention a generator so I don't suppose the AC is going to provide much value. It looks really clean.
__________________
“We are the universe contemplating itself” - Carl Sagan

hummingway is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-03-2011, 06:03   #5
Don't ask if you can't handle it
 
sailorboy1's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: On the boat somewhere
Boat: Hunter 410
Posts: 12,326
Re: Morgan 44 Center Cockpit Nelson/Marek?

I did a lot of research on the Morgan 44 recently. And thought is was as close as a perfect cruiser/live aboard boat around. It is even a fast cruiser a good sail area ratio. I though the only downside was the fuel capacity, but there is so much water capactity that a tank can be redone. If you use some "perfect" cruiser boat checklist the M-44 will pretty much meet all the check points.

So if you feel the boat is good buy get it and stop making yourself crazy!
__________________
sailorboy1 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-03-2011, 12:48   #6
Registered User

Join Date: Jul 2009
Boat: Nassau 42 SV Ceol Mor
Posts: 789
Re: Morgan 44 Center Cockpit Nelson/Marek?

We looked at one seriously enough to have a survey and sea trial. Make sure you sail it in less than perfect weather. Lots of room below and yes, it would make a great liveaboard. Its just maybe not the most secure feeling boat in weather. I never felt unsafe or anything of the like, it just surprised me that it felt as tender as it did.
__________________
S/V Ceol Mor
42 Nassau Undergoing refit in Kemah, Tx
Our little blog has moved: www.theceolmors.blogspot.com
Mimsy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-03-2011, 13:02   #7
Senior Cruiser
 
Jim Cate's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: May 2008
Location: cruising SW Pacific
Boat: Jon Sayer 1-off 46 ft fract rig sloop strip plank in W Red Cedar
Posts: 11,468
Re: Morgan 44 Center Cockpit Nelson/Marek?

G'Day mate,

I can't comment on the sailing characteristics of this yacht, but do notice that from its equipment list it seems to have been a "marina queen". That is, it is equipped to be lived aboard whilst alongside rather than at anchor.

If you do intend to live on the hook, there will be extensive and expensive alterations to make. You may well have factored this into your consideration, but thought that I would make note of it.

It should sail well from the numbers, and from the N/M heritage. Hope that it turns out well for you.

Cheers,

Jim and Ann s/v Insatiable II lying Morning Cove, NSW, Oz
__________________
Jim and Ann s/v Insatiable II , lying Port Cygnet, Tasmania once again
Jim Cate is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-03-2011, 13:21   #8
Registered User
 
s/v Moondancer's Avatar

Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: Fiji but heading for Alaska
Boat: Tayana 55
Posts: 1,226
Re: Morgan 44 Center Cockpit Nelson/Marek?

That boat is a much better sailor than most people think. It is a very good boat for the Islands but it needs a second big anchor and windlass. Also the standing rigging is 21 yrs old and if the headstay and backstay have been replaced the rest is due.

If the engine is original it might be high hours and close to a rebuild.

It is poorly equipped for cruising, you need to price the necessary additions...you might find a fully equipped boat more cost efficient. Check all the ones on Yachtworld and set up a spread sheet to accurately compare values.

Also remember that the value of old electronics is a negative number...what it will cost to rip them out!

Remember it is very easy to buy a $99,999 boat, spend $30,000 and finish up with a $100,000 boat.

The price has already been dropped $25,000! It was priced in Euros which is very unusual in a US boat. If the owners cash basis is in Euros the low dollar might be inflating what the owner is trying to recoup. They have spent money making it cosmetically very nice but a new paint job does very little to improve safety unlike a SSB, EPIRB and liferaft which together equal the cost of a new paint job.

Morgan - 44 Center Cockpit - Cruising sailboat <*50' - Free classified ads - Used boats
__________________
Phil

"Remember, experience only means that you screw-up less often."
s/v Moondancer is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-03-2011, 13:39   #9
Registered User
 
betachz's Avatar

Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: TX
Boat: Morgan 45 CC
Posts: 56
Send a message via MSN to betachz Send a message via Yahoo to betachz
Re: Morgan 44 Center Cockpit Nelson/Marek?

Yeah, I think this is a GREAT CRUISER boat... however it's not equipped for such journeys. My current thought is to wait until we find another or something similar with a better equipment list. I feel I'm going to spend about $30-40k to get this boat to be what i want. I'm not really wanting lots of systems to take care of, i just want a boat that fits our needs more closely. I feel this boat has great bones and could be a great platform but if I’m going to sink $100k into a boat, I'd like to have some extra gear and have it at least 70% on the way to being a boat we could use for the job we will expect from it. "Marina Queen" is the only thing that makes sense to me... It's a capable boat that's been sitting around in marinas all its life. It's probably in good condition even more because of that, however I just can't find it in myself to endeavor on such a huge refit on our first big boat purchase.

Here's a list of what I think the boat needs:
  1. Dingy: $1500
  2. Outboard: $1500
  3. Windlass: $2500
  4. Solar Panels: $2500
  5. Rear dimini or arch for Solar: $4000
  6. Storm Sails: $2000
  7. Anchors and Rode: $1500
  8. High output Alternator: $1500
  9. New Battery Bank: $1000
  10. Survey/Haul out: $1500
  11. Inverter: $2000
  12. WiFi booster: $300
  13. Tool & Equipment: $1500
TOTAL: $23,000 just for what I know now... i'm sure another $10k is to be expected. Then i'm looking at a $130k boat that's probably now worth $110k.
__________________
betachz is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-03-2011, 14:55   #10
Moderator
 
Boracay's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Feb 2004
Location: Pelican Bay, Great Sandy National Park
Boat: Steel Roberts Offshore 44
Posts: 5,175
Images: 18
Check turbo, taking it easy?

This may be OK if you are planning on taking it easy at first.

A boat this size is deceptive in planning how long upgrades and refitting will take. It's not just the actual work time; every job has to be learned first, and then planned. The list above may look short but on my current slow progress I'd be looking at 2 years to complete it. Some bits might never be completed.

I'd also get a competent Yanmar mechanic to have a good look at the engine/transmission/fuel system. It can be another 6 months if this isn't right. Same goes for the rigging and sails - do this before the survey (could save on a survey...).

I can't see this boat as being that cheap. A 6 year old Beneteau 423 can list for $135k, and ought to be in way better condition than this boat.

If I were buying another boat a sugar scoop stern would be on top of my list.
__________________
Rust never sleeps
Boracay Blog.
Boracay is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-03-2011, 17:13   #11
Registered User
 
Unicorn Dreams's Avatar

Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Clear Lake Marine Services - Seabrook, Texas
Boat: Gulfstar, Mark II Ketch, 43'
Posts: 2,359
Re: Morgan 44 Center Cockpit Nelson/Marek?

About your second list,

4. 2-215 watt Kyocera panels $1100

5. Build brackets on top of davits $2-300

8. With solar why spend that much on an alternator 70-100 amp should be plenty couple of hundred $

9. price is about right for a900 AH bank.

That's what I'd do. IMO you don't need to add extre weight at the stern if you can adapt the davits to hold your panels.

try http://www.windsun.com/
__________________
Formerly Santana
The winds blow true,The skies stay blue,
Everyday is a good day for SAILING!!!!
Unicorn Dreams is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-03-2011, 08:48   #12
Registered User
 
betachz's Avatar

Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: TX
Boat: Morgan 45 CC
Posts: 56
Send a message via MSN to betachz Send a message via Yahoo to betachz
Re: Morgan 44 Center Cockpit Nelson/Marek?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Unicorn Dreams View Post
About your second list,

4. 2-215 watt Kyocera panels $1100

5. Build brackets on top of davits $2-300

8. With solar why spend that much on an alternator 70-100 amp should be plenty couple of hundred $

9. price is about right for a900 AH bank.

That's what I'd do. IMO you don't need to add extre weight at the stern if you can adapt the davits to hold your panels.

try Solar electric power components and solar panels
Thanks for your input... loved teh windsun.com link!

Solar: Nice price on those solar panels.. where did you find those for that price?

Batteries: "prince is about rigth for 900AH bank?" are you serious? I can find 6V 395s for $309 each and I would need 4 of those to get less than 800AH... Where do you price your batteries and what kind do you use/think are best?
__________________
betachz is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-03-2011, 12:56   #13
Registered User
 
Unicorn Dreams's Avatar

Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Clear Lake Marine Services - Seabrook, Texas
Boat: Gulfstar, Mark II Ketch, 43'
Posts: 2,359
Re: Morgan 44 Center Cockpit Nelson/Marek?

Solar panels at windsun, look around the site, they are $490 and $535 each for 215 watt panels.

Your 4 batteries are only 400 AH @ 12V.

Go to Batteries - Interstate Batteries has every battery for every need and check the prices, get discount for big purchases, each location makes different discounts. Also, I use lead acid batteries.
__________________
Formerly Santana
The winds blow true,The skies stay blue,
Everyday is a good day for SAILING!!!!
Unicorn Dreams is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-03-2011, 13:06   #14
Registered User
 
betachz's Avatar

Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: TX
Boat: Morgan 45 CC
Posts: 56
Send a message via MSN to betachz Send a message via Yahoo to betachz
Re: Morgan 44 Center Cockpit Nelson/Marek?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Unicorn Dreams View Post
Solar panels at windsun, look around the site, they are $490 and $535 each for 215 watt panels.

Your 4 batteries are only 400 AH @ 12V.

Go to Batteries - Interstate Batteries has every battery for every need and check the prices, get discount for big purchases, each location makes different discounts. Also, I use lead acid batteries.

How is 4x 385ha 6volt batteries only 400ah? 2 would be that, bringing 385 up to 12 v. 4 would be 385 at 24v. Am i missing something?

thanks for all yoru help
__________________
betachz is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-03-2011, 17:08   #15
Registered User
 
Unicorn Dreams's Avatar

Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Clear Lake Marine Services - Seabrook, Texas
Boat: Gulfstar, Mark II Ketch, 43'
Posts: 2,359
Re: Morgan 44 Center Cockpit Nelson/Marek?

You're right about that, I was thinking of standard 225AH batteries even though you said 385's. That would be 770AH @ 12V.

My mistake, SORRY
__________________

__________________
Formerly Santana
The winds blow true,The skies stay blue,
Everyday is a good day for SAILING!!!!
Unicorn Dreams is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Tags
center cockpit, cockpit, morgan, Nelson

Thread Tools
Display Modes Rate This Thread
Rate This Thread:

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Center Cockpit vs Aft Cockpit MaDouleur Monohull Sailboats 48 12-08-2017 06:56
Center or Aft Cockpit ? Searanger50 Monohull Sailboats 39 27-12-2010 09:38
Freedom 45 Center Cockpit Tayzach Monohull Sailboats 7 09-05-2010 19:34
Center cockpit vrs aft cockpit Panamajames Monohull Sailboats 54 24-03-2009 16:00
1985 Morgan 43 Center Cockpit for sale bdcruzer Classifieds Archive 0 26-03-2008 11:17



Copyright 2002- Social Knowledge, LLC All Rights Reserved.

All times are GMT -7. The time now is 20:35.


Google+
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Social Knowledge Networks
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.

ShowCase vBulletin Plugins by Drive Thru Online, Inc.