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Old 15-11-2005, 03:33   #16
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Quote:
Weyalan once whispered in the wind:
As far as I know, many of the IOR "1-tonners" (and in Australia probably most of them) were built to challenge for The Admirals Cup. i.e. fully crewed harbor races and some offshore day races and one "long" offshore race (in those days, The Fastnet Race). They were never intended to be single-handed (what boat with runners is?) and are certainly not designed primarily as downhill boats. I could list plenty of 80's built IOR 1-tonners that are still racing competetively at club level today. I am currently crewing on a 1981 Dubois 1-tonner that has 6 or 7 Sydney-Hobarts to its credit that still gets along ok in our local Pennant Series and rates well on IRC.
Weyalan is spot on with this response............and the pictured yacht does look tidy......as they often do

But I've had a quick look at an Ozzie Yacht Sales site - and if the Admas 10 is too rich it may be worth downsizing - for it is possible to locate a cruiser racer close to the Oz$70K mark.

The Farr 1104 is just one to check out - almost as long but with possibly more volume below - a good quick boat and usually equipped for cruising...........

Cheers

JOHN
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Old 15-11-2005, 05:01   #17
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Weyalan, as you can see, one pic generates at least a thousand words...<g>

Discussions of IOR designs and their races aside, let's revisit your goals: you want a cruising boat, you are down in Tasmania where you can get a hatfull of wind, 'cruising' is going to put you in some tropical climes at times, and this boat only offers 30 gals of water & fuel tankage.

If you'll forgive me being negative for a moment, this boat lacks good ventilation and will have a dark forepeake, lacks a roomy interior, most likely has little forward buoyancy and appears to lack even one piece of deck hardware that a cruising guy cares about: no canvas, no anchoring system nor buoyancy to handle a load of chain, no furling headsail, an ice rink for a deck, little protection and little apparent 'comfort' for the crew in the cockpit. And this is before we get to the rig...which can charitably be described as not set up for singlehanding. And finally, it does not seem that the boat's priced cheaply.

To sum it up, there is very little in common between your aspirations and this boats nature other than your willingness to tackle a big project and the allure that you might end up with a different kind of cruising boat. In fact, the more you hear about the inconsistency of your plans with this boat, the more it might spur you on, just for the fun of bucking conventional wisdom. However, I hope you won't let that stir the juices too much.

Lar's caution is exactly on target, I think, and is exactly what I saw happening in the slip next to me with the IOR racer being converted. What I'm left wondering - and which I hope you will consider commenting on - is what's the problem with finding one of those North American (or other) cruising boats that make it Down Under with owners who don't want to buck the trades getting it back home, or are now tired of their cruising affair, and put the boat up for sale. Perhaps you see few of those near Hobart, as that's not where these boats would be congregating...but they abound in places like Sydney and over in NZ. These boats will be properly equipped, will have demonstrated some amount of structural suitability to get down there, and the owners will be facing a $15K+/- Dockwise fee to ship the boat home which can come right off the local value the boat has in the marketplace.

Not that it is a perfect match for your budget (tho' it might have been) and tastes (who knows?), but you can see a good example of what I mean by visiting http://www.ourdotcom.com/AboutRouser/index.htm Note the mods this young couple did before setting out; note how well equipped she was; note the functional layout. She had no problems handling the sailing down to NZ and a sistership - TIGGER, which was the centerboard version of this S&S design - did an 8-year Circle without a hitch. In the end, this couple chose to sell the boat (to someone with NZ dollars) so they could return to N America and do the next thing in their lives.

Another example are Ken & Cath's FELICITY - http://www.svfelicity.com/boat/index.htm Altho' in the end, they shipped her home, an interested buyer down in Oz might have turned their heads. (Note how thoughtfully and well equipped even this 'big' little boat is). Wouldn't investigating these kinds of choices make a bit more sense for you?

Jack
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Old 15-11-2005, 05:05   #18
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As Bob Perry has said "A cruising boat is a boat you go cruising in".

You can read in many sailing mag's Webb Chiles sailing exploits and circumnavigation on a Heritage one ton. That is a very similar boat from an era when IOR designed half way decent boats. It will be quick upwind but load up down wind due to hull form. So back off when sailing downwind.

Bottom line, $40k is cheap and neat. Make sure the hull is sound, look at the hull to deck joint, look at the tabbing of the bulkheads, look at the ring frames and stringers, look at the keel bolts and the attachments, pull the rig down and look at the rod. Get prices for what will be needed to be added for cruising, and be aware the rig will require more TLC to prevent a gravity storm. You could modify the rig if you were uncomfortable with it's height. Stuff can be re-done pretty cheap if you do it yourself.

Final note: Our boat is a retired IOR racer that is quick, tough, comfortable, and a hell of a lot of boat for not a hell of a lot of money. We have upgraded all the systems on the boat with new and still have invested only a fraction of what the boat would cost new.

When the going gets ugly I'll take our old race boat over most any purpose built cruiser out there. A sistership pitchpoled in the Pacific and went on to circumnavigate with a family and today is sailed by a family in Newfoundland. Ours has sailed through a major hurricane but you would never know it other then the stories from those that sailed her during those times.

Good luck

Bryan








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Old 15-11-2005, 13:24   #19
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I paid 25K US for this one, stripped of electronics. But it did have new rigging. The motor had 7000 hours with a rebuilt head and new heat exchanger/exhaust. It runs real good though and it is real clean.

Basiclly it was a sailing core. I've had to install every accessory. The sails were functional but old. It had 14 winches. I reduced that down to 8 and put in organizers and clutches for single handing. She's a fixer-upper that still looks and sails good.

Anyway, I hope you like working on boats and your young and experianced enough to so.




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Old 15-11-2005, 15:12   #20
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More great advice.

Wow, beautiful boats Joli & Delmarrey: I hope mine can end up looking half as good! (whatever I end up buying, heh heh).



I really appreciate everyone's taking the time to offer advice. It is interesting to see all the gamut of opinions.

It seems to me that what I am proposing is rather against the conventional wisdom, but not impossible (as evidenced by the last couple of posters). I appreciate that converting this type of racing boat for comfortable cruising is a big undertaking, and is probably not the easiest or the wisest way to approach the cruising concept. But wisdom was never my strong suit I guess we all do have a tandency to stick with what we know, and most of my sailing experience has been on this type of boat - 1/2 tonners, 1 tonners and even 2 or 3 years crewing an IOR 50 footer - fully crewd racing, short handed racing and cruising. I flatter myself that I know these boats - I certainly love them!

Rest assured, that by Australian standards, this is not an expensive boat. I have spent most of the last year checking broker's web-sites on a daily basis. This is about 20% cheaper than the cheapest 1104 or S&S 36, for example, and a lot cheaper than an Adams 40 (and the cheaper examples of all these boats are in rather poor condition).

I understand the concern vis a vis the rig. On the plus side, the mast and rigging is only 8 years old (compared to the hull's 20 years. I certainly have considered putting in an inner forestay for cutter rigging. I have also considered cutting the mast off at the hounds, removing the jumpers and making is a 58' masthead rig rather than a 66 foot fractional! There is aalso the option of shortening the boom by 8" and making the checkstays "optional" (or even removing them). But in this respect, I am probably getting a little ahead of myself...I think the solution will be gradually synthesised after a couple of hundred hours of sailing time! And anyway, the current rig setup, while not ideal, is perfectly functional...so why hurry the decision?



I appreciate that the tankage is limited for cruising (although, by racing standards, rather larger than normal). However, being a fairly spartan fit-out below decks, there is plent of space for fitting of additional tankage. Here is a piccky of the saloon (and YES, I will be changing the colour scheme!)



Anyway, please keep the opinions and advice coming...I thoroughly appreciate all of it!
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Old 15-11-2005, 19:24   #21
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The interior looks pretty much the same set up as mine. No storage. But that will change.

I also plan to put in a babystay with running backstays for support.
I ran a temporary babystay just to see how she handles in a blow and it did great, except for the pumping of the mast. It took out the weather helm and balanced real good.

If you have the energy, know-how and the funds, buying a old racer is fine IMO. The key it making sure she's got a good hull, like stated way above.

I had to do a lot of work on my deck pulling fasteners and recaulking due to the age and stress on the deck gear. So that's something else you'll need to look at!

Fair winds.........................................._/)
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Old 28-11-2005, 20:09   #22
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Just to update you all

I have decied that I am still young enough and probably stupid enough to run with this project.

I will be flying up to Queensland this weekend to pepare the boat for sailing it down to Tasmania, planning to leave middle of next week (with 4 crew to assist). We will spend a few days preparing the boat for the trip

Its about 1100 Nautical miles from Mooloolaba to Hobart, so it is going to be a fair trip. Its probably only 10 days of conservative sailing, but I figure on 3 or 4 days spent sheltering/hiding from bad weather somewhere along the way.

I am looking ofrward to the trip, but am also nervous too.
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Old 29-11-2005, 17:53   #23
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Sounds like you have decided on an adventure. Good for you and best of luck. Glad to hear you are nervous as well. You seem to have your "balls and brains" in balance. I am sure your crew is experienced, no seasickness problems, and you have the right emergency gear. Ah...youth ! Of you I am a little jealous.

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Old 29-11-2005, 19:50   #24
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Quote:
capt lar once whispered in the wind:
Sounds like you have decided on an adventure. Good for you and best of luck. Glad to hear you are nervous as well. You seem to have your "balls and brains" in balance. I am sure your crew is experienced, no seasickness problems, and you have the right emergency gear. Ah...youth ! Of you I am a little jealous.

capt. lar
Thanks Lar,

I am a bit paranoid about safety gear. Last check I had, not including any safety gear that comes with the boat:

A 10 person liferaft, offshore pack (last serviced 7/05, EPIRB fitted)
7 x harnesses (plus most of the crew have their own)
Inflatable type lifejackets for everyone
Traditional type lifejackets for everyone
3 x GPS
2 x VHF (hand held)
2 x EPIRBs
At least 3 of each parachute, hand and smoke flares
Charts (mostly laminated)
Offshore CAT1 first-aid kit
Comprehensive tool kit

I am scared that I have forgotten something important...but hopefully, the few days spent on the boat prior to departure will give me time to remeber and get hold of anything that I have overlooked.
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Old 29-11-2005, 20:07   #25
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I always forget something. Sounds like you will have enough options to make things work. Worry is good.
I mention the seasick issue because I once set off with a crew of 6 and 4 were useless for a few days during heavy weather. 2 of us swapped off making sail changes when the fresh guy first came back on deck. Fatigue is deadly.
Keep us posted.

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Old 29-11-2005, 20:27   #26
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Seasickness and fatigue

I have a crew of 6. I know that at least 3 of us have plenty of off-shore miles and do not have a problem with seasickness. The same 3 are also well able to sleep while under way and under sail in reasonably windy conditions (frankly, if the forecast gets to be anything over 30 knots, I'm gonna be looking for the closest safe anchorage - after all, 'tis not a race). I have also experienced a delivery where several of the crew became progressively more useless through a combination of sickness and fatigue...not fun.
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Old 30-11-2005, 11:44   #27
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It sounds as though you have made the decision

If I may suggest? Take the boat out for a weekend cruise with all and you'll see what else you'll need. Make a list as things come to mind.

Everytime I take mine out I always come back with a list. Some upgrades, some repairs.

Bring extra alt./pump belts and pump parts. You never know what condition these things are in until they have been run or taken apart.

Make a list of food supplies. I found that each person requires at least 2 lt. of drinking water each day.

Enjoy the trip........................._/)
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Old 18-12-2005, 21:41   #28
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I am pleased to report that My new (old) vessel and crew have safely negotiated the trip from Mooloolaba; Queensland to Hobart; Tasmania. The journey was a real experience, with enough challenging conditions to properly test out the vessel, but not so much that it became a chore. We stopped overnight in Coffs Harbor, Sydney and Eden on the way. The entire trip (approx 1200 Nautical miles) took about 10 days including the abovementioned stops.

I am looking forward to some rather more relaxed cruising down the d'Entrcasteaux Channel for a few days after Christmas.
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Old 18-12-2005, 21:47   #29
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Congratulations on a successful delivery!

I hope mine goes as well, come June.

Regards,

Tim
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Old 19-12-2005, 14:56   #30
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Thumbs up Congrats!

That first trip is always the worst. Until one gets to really know their vessel do they become at ease

Now you can plan for all the up grades
........................................_/)
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