Cruisers Forum
 


Join CruisersForum Today

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Rate Thread Display Modes
Old 17-01-2019, 04:07   #1
Registered User

Join Date: Nov 2018
Posts: 106
Images: 56
Low Freeboard on Adams 45

Ok folks in my usual style I never give up. I have located an Adams 45 steel hull round bilge yacht and I quite like it. I was considering all things when one of the consultees pointed out that he didn't like low freeboard on the Adams series and considered them a coastal cruiser not a blue water boat becuase of this. Unfortunately I do not have photos of the actual boat out of the water but I do have photos of another adams 45 and I assume they will have the same keel shape







Ok these are the photos of the actual boat




I would greatly appreciate any comments on this hull shape and its seaworthiness and also some of that timely but harsh advice I get around here. Would love to hear from someone who has sailed this hullshape,


cheers


Metal Boat
__________________

Metal Boat is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 17-01-2019, 04:50   #2
Registered User

Join Date: Dec 2016
Location: Brazil
Boat: Custom Swedish Vindö 50 (35 ft)
Posts: 468
Re: Low Freeboard on Adams 45

Nothing inherently "unseaworthy" about low freeboard, but it will mean taking more water over the side decks.

It looks like a nice design, but, once again, another big project...
__________________

Copacabana is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 17-01-2019, 05:09   #3
Registered User

Join Date: Nov 2018
Posts: 106
Images: 56
Re: Low Freeboard on Adams 45

Thanks Copa



I thought that as long as the decks were watertight at lower deck heights that would mean the boat got bashed around less by the waves (flush decks) but would not leak water.


Adams has quite a few boats to his design here in Australia and they are purported to sail quite well.


Yes I know its another project but I actually like doing that work, it calms me and I enjoy it. The best bit is testing your own work and being as self sufficient as possible.
Metal Boat is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 17-01-2019, 05:18   #4
Senior Cruiser
 
hpeer's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: Philadelphia
Boat: Murray 33-Chouette & Pape Steelmaid-44-Safara-both steel cutters
Posts: 4,890
Re: Low Freeboard on Adams 45

Always more than one way to look at things. Low freeboard, lower center of gravity, less windage, less surface area for the boarding sea to grab ahold of.

Submarines have very low freeboard. I really dislike center cockpits where you are really high up. The Wife gets sea sick and there is more motion “up there.”

How’s the head room below?

That’s how it works with steel boats, high displacement so you sit “in” the water compAred to fog boats. They have to build “up” to maintain headroom below. Because they are so common our view of what a boatnshould look like gets skewed.

Personally I like being tucked in down low.

To each his own.
hpeer is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 17-01-2019, 05:23   #5
Registered User

Join Date: Nov 2018
Posts: 106
Images: 56
Re: Low Freeboard on Adams 45

Hi Hpeer,


I agree with you on the small target theory that is where I was going with my arguement, but I am concerned how much headrooom there will be forward in the boat, I can crouch but from the photos it almost looks child height. If the boss can get in and out comfortably that will be ok. Its just that little bit small to have full headroom but I am heeding the arguements about size and cost.
Metal Boat is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 17-01-2019, 05:29   #6
Senior Cruiser
 
hpeer's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: Philadelphia
Boat: Murray 33-Chouette & Pape Steelmaid-44-Safara-both steel cutters
Posts: 4,890
Re: Low Freeboard on Adams 45

A few comments.

It is a much more reasonable boat than that 65’Er you started with. You are learning.

You can obviously find other samples to look at and copy from as needed.

From this distance the big glass ports look like the are actually marine grade stuff. It’s important that they be strong enough to not break in a bad blow. Try to find manufacturer if them and ratings.

Looking at the very last photo with the anchor chain spilling out (what’s that other pile of stuff?) makes me thing the anchor locker is too small. You may have problems with that much chain “casteling” and jamming. Then you need to open the locker door to flatten it. If it’s so full it spills out at you, well that’s not good.

You absolutely, positively, with NO doubt, need an out of water survey. Do it yourself, hammer, flashlight, screwdriver, BAD attitude. 2 days minimum. It was once a nice boat, it may be again, but you need to find the condition of the hull.

Good luck, your moving forward.

PS Here is a profile of our Allan Pape 45’ cutter.
Attached Thumbnails
Click image for larger version

Name:	40A904BE-44DD-4B0A-959D-A0B7D06BD3EF.jpg
Views:	195
Size:	413.6 KB
ID:	183968  
hpeer is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 17-01-2019, 05:47   #7
Registered User

Join Date: Nov 2018
Posts: 106
Images: 56
Re: Low Freeboard on Adams 45

I have a surveyor lined up who is ruthless. He is going to do a full ultrasound on the hull after I have spent two days picking apart every crevice for corrosion.


I am going to pull out all that chain and see what is under it, and measure its length. I think he said he had a longer than usual anchor.



I have even made sure of my dates on the hard if it goes ahead.



P>S That yacht is purdy I like the decks, like water of a ducks back.




I have thought carefully about the windows, in the back of my mind I can see them getting blown in and the yacht filling with water. I assume some of them may be cracked or UV damaged. We will see.


100% agree this deal is all about the hull. If its Ok I will score a cheap, untidy boat that needs a lot of work, but if that hull is full of Cancer, it will go straight back to the owner.


Thanks for the sage advice Im trying to learn and I am enjoying the challenge. Made so many phone calls and have picked up much info in the last four months. I certainly have had a taste of what I dont want with that Tiawanese Perry, the decay was verbatim to the warnings I got in the thread. Tis a shame though It would have been a lovely yacht once.
Metal Boat is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 17-01-2019, 05:54   #8
Senior Cruiser
 
delmarrey's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: Philippines until May
Boat: Boatless Now
Posts: 10,886
Images: 122
Re: Low Freeboard on Adams 45

I agree with hpeer too.
I had a 40' Choate sloop with a 2' freeboard at midships. It sailed great and pointed higher then most boats, I'm sure due to less freeboard (windage). With an aft cockpit most of the beam waves rolled right off. Just an occasional following wave got into the cockpit. But the rail always seem to be a few inches above the water.
It did like to submarine a lot into the oncoming waves. But if your deck hatches and fittings are sealed, no problem. I was tempted to build a Viking bow onto it.

One advantage is it was easy getting from the inflatable onto the boat in one giant step. Plus if anything floatable went into the water, it was easy to retrieve.

While sailing heeled over the typical oncoming waves were not able to crash over the high side and usually bounced off the bulge.
__________________
Faithful are the Wounds of a Friend, but the Kisses of the Enemy are Deceitful! ........
The measure of a man is how he navigates to a proper shore in the mist of a storm!
delmarrey is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 17-01-2019, 09:58   #9
Registered User

Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 69
Re: Low Freeboard on Adams 45

We had some friends from Australia who circumnavigated the world on an Adams (I think) 47 or so. Low freeboard, very fast, pointed high, carried a good cruising load of gear.
My wife and I joined them sailing in Norway and Sweden and slept in the very cosy V-berth, but otherwise very comfortable boat. They really liked it.
Paul Howard is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 17-01-2019, 10:10   #10
Registered User

Join Date: Sep 2014
Location: Manila, California
Boat: Cape George pilothouse 36 and a Cape Dory 25
Posts: 439
Re: Low Freeboard on Adams 45

My Cape George does not have really low freeboard, but lower than the boats I will now tell about. A few years ago we were struck by a Coromel in Balandra Bay in Mexico. Balandra is very shallow and we were far inside of a bunch of 50 to maybe 80 foot sport fishers with a lot of freeboard. Every one of them dragged anchor during the night. We did not move an inch with 3 foot waves breaking on our bow. Maybe our superior anchor and technique, maybe our low freeboard compared with those other boats. Last year we were in 55 kt. winds with, what the weather service said were, 19 foot breaking seas right on the bow. Next morning in Santa Cruz Harbor we met some of the professional crew of a 80 foot power boat who were jumping ship due to blue water over their bridge. That bridge was about half way up our mast. We never had significant water on deck all night. Of course Mana is like a duck made out of cork. That Adams looks very seaworthy. Looks like if you had a( seemingly) crazy Frenchman with a scraper, wire brush and some paint you would be set to go. Sorry that was a Bernard Moitessier reference.
fatherchronica is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 17-01-2019, 10:53   #11
Registered User

Join Date: Sep 2013
Location: Alert Bay, Vancouver Island
Boat: 35ft classic ketch/yawl.
Posts: 1,389
Images: 4
Send a message via Skype™ to roland stockham
Re: Low Freeboard on Adams 45

Yep this would tick most of my boxes as a 'blue water boat. I also have low freeboard, 3ft, and it is not a problem. Also does not lead to excess water on the deck. Taking water over the deck in my experience can be a problem if the bow is low combined with fine entry and low bow buoyancy. This can stop the bow rising and make the boat punch through waves rather than ride over them. It can be made worse when combined with a broad stern. In fact having once gone overboard on a tether I was very thankful for low freeboard as I was able to roll back on board before the crew even realised there was a problem'
My only concern would be that the helm sea looks pretty exposed and could lack protection for the helmsman in a big following sea. Canvas dodgers can easily be swept away so you may want to think about a bulwark of some sort.
roland stockham is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 17-01-2019, 11:39   #12
Registered User
 
S/V Alchemy's Avatar

Join Date: May 2008
Location: Toronto
Boat: Custom 41' Steel Pilothouse Cutter
Posts: 4,898
Re: Low Freeboard on Adams 45

Quote:
Originally Posted by hpeer View Post
A few comments.

It is a much more reasonable boat than that 65’Er you started with. You are learning.

You can obviously find other samples to look at and copy from as needed.

From this distance the big glass ports look like the are actually marine grade stuff. It’s important that they be strong enough to not break in a bad blow. Try to find manufacturer if them and ratings.

Looking at the very last photo with the anchor chain spilling out (what’s that other pile of stuff?) makes me thing the anchor locker is too small. You may have problems with that much chain “casteling” and jamming. Then you need to open the locker door to flatten it. If it’s so full it spills out at you, well that’s not good.

You absolutely, positively, with NO doubt, need an out of water survey. Do it yourself, hammer, flashlight, screwdriver, BAD attitude. 2 days minimum. It was once a nice boat, it may be again, but you need to find the condition of the hull.

Good luck, your moving forward.

PS Here is a profile of our Allan Pape 45’ cutter.

This is good advice. Pay for a proper survey, meaning sounding of the plates, hammers, open up all the bilges to see what's going on down there. Steel boats can look cosmetically terrible but remain structurally sound...and vice-versa. Learn the difference. As for the freeboard, I don't see portlights in the hull, so no worries as long as the hatches are sound and the portlights and pilothouse windows are strong or can be made strong and there are freeing ports or a way for water taken aboard to drain off (deck camber, fairleads, etc.)
__________________
Can't sleep? Read www.alchemy2009.blogspot.com for fast relief. Can't read? Avoid www.volumesofsalt.blogspot.com, because it's just personal reviews of sea books.
S/V Alchemy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 17-01-2019, 12:55   #13
Registered User
 
picklesandjesse's Avatar

Join Date: Apr 2014
Location: Northern NSW Australia
Boat: Cold Molded Davidson 32 Built NZ
Posts: 329
Re: Low Freeboard on Adams 45

Nothing wrong with low freeboard. Just means a bit wet at times. Vic Meyer's Solo had very low freeboard and won Sydney Hobart races , circumnavigated 3 times and did trips to Antarctica. Has a Wiki page on her. She was/is a legendary heavy weather boat. Alan Payne designed many boats with low freeboard. Solo makes Adams boats look like they have too much freeboard.
picklesandjesse is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 17-01-2019, 13:10   #14
Registered User

Join Date: Jul 2016
Location: Alameda, California
Boat: Islander 36
Posts: 59
Re: Low Freeboard on Adams 45

i've found that low freeboard makes it too easy for pirates to climb up over the rail...
smith8273 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 17-01-2019, 13:36   #15
Registered User

Join Date: Jan 2013
Posts: 69
Re: Low Freeboard on Adams 45

Joe Adams was a very short guy who thought headroom was a waste of space and for the birds. Typically his boats go to windward very well and are fast.

Many of his boats were built by home builders and this is where things get tricky.... some of the home builds are fantastic and others very poor.

We buddy boated with an Adams 40 up the Red Sea and the lack of freeboard never seemed to be a problem, its performance was excellent in spite of being significantly shorter. I have also raced the FRP Adams 10 which used to have a whole fleet sailing out of Middle Harbour Sydney.... same design philosophy and again a great sea boat.

Your surveyor will be your friend and hope it is a good one.
__________________

yachtgemini is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Tags
adams

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes Rate This Thread
Rate This Thread:

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Blistering paint on freeboard of Aluminium hull looking for a remedy/solution. kryg Construction, Maintenance & Refit 17 15-12-2017 21:56
Adams low profile pigment dyed hats are in the Chandlery Schooner Chandlery Vendor Spotlight - Great Deals for CF Members! 0 05-09-2015 20:32
Open source FreeBoard nav instruments motu42 Marine Electronics 13 28-11-2013 20:34
Removing Brown Tannin Freeboard Stains Hudson Force Construction, Maintenance & Refit 12 04-12-2012 02:30
Need Advice About Raising Deck ( via Adding to Freeboard ) STG Monohull Sailboats 34 12-05-2011 21:22



Copyright 2002- Social Knowledge, LLC All Rights Reserved.

All times are GMT -7. The time now is 16:43.


Google+
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2019, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Social Knowledge Networks
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2019, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.

ShowCase vBulletin Plugins by Drive Thru Online, Inc.