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Old 09-04-2016, 07:06   #1
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Let me introduce myself and hopefully gain some knowledge from you.


Let me introduce myself, I'm new to this forum, live in Portsmouth UK (for now) but in the next 1-2 years my GF and I hope to be living on a boat, we are moving forward with our plan as we speak. (ie doing the house up for sale, selling off some larger assets and undertaking as much sailing as we can whilst minimising our admin, kit and paperwork trail)

I have been watching and reading this forum for a while before I signed up, there seems to be a lot of broad knowledge on here and everyone has a different take on things, which gives a broad spectrum.

I will have between 270 and 330,000 to spend on a boat, that's not fixed but a ball park figure.

I haven't discounted cats but at the moment it seems I would get a lot more for my money if I went down the mono route.

We will be living on the boat and sailing the world (in time, no rush, we are young) We will be breaking all ties with the UK other than I will be flying back and forth to the North Sea as and when for my work.

My GF (who is Canadian/British) will stay on the boat, it will be moored up either in a marina or on a buoy whilst I'm away (I'm a commercial diver, ex Navy Diver, hence North Sea)

We have a short list of boats (which is not so short atm)

However I would like to put it to this forum, what would you choose to live on and why for that type of money?

Kind Regards


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Old 09-04-2016, 07:56   #2
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Re: Let me introduce myself and hopefully gain some knowledge from you.

Welcome to the forum. Hope you reach your goals and dreams.

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Old 09-04-2016, 08:08   #3
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Re: Let me introduce myself and hopefully gain some knowledge from you.

That's a tough question but I know a several cruisers with Morgan 46 center cockpit boats who have traveled the world. There is a large aft cabin and plenty of space. The keel and rudder configuration is also very sturdy. I'm sure there are dozens of adequate boats out there but this one can usually be purchased at a reasonable price leaving you with money to spend outfitting for your personal preferences and needs.

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Old 09-04-2016, 09:13   #4
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pirate Re: Let me introduce myself and hopefully gain some knowledge from you.

As your in the UK.. here's a couple to chew over.. well built classics Yes, 'Caves'..? kinda.. but all that sun gets wearing on the eyes and somewhere dark and cool to escape the glare..
Westerly Sealord 39 for sale UK, Westerly boats for sale, Westerly used boat sales, Westerly Sailing Yachts For Sale 1984 Westerly Sealord 39 - Apollo Duck

Westerly Oceanlord 40 for sale UK, Westerly boats for sale, Westerly used boat sales, Westerly Sailing Yachts For Sale 1990 WESTERLY 40 OCEANLORD - Apollo Duck

Or.. if you want to venture up tidal rivers in N France with the ability to dry out.. something like this..
Southerly 115 for sale UK, Southerly boats for sale, Southerly used boat sales, Southerly Sailing Yachts For Sale 1990 Southerly 115 - Apollo Duck


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Old 09-04-2016, 09:52   #5
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Re: Let me introduce myself and hopefully gain some knowledge from you.

Welcome... you have enough dosh to get yourselves a good quality boat into the mid 50 feet. Look at Moody 53, Halberg Rassy 53, Amel Super Maramu (what we have...)

Boats do not need to be small... bigger is better at sea and much better at anchor.

GL in your search.
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Old 10-04-2016, 08:48   #6
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Re: Let me introduce myself and hopefully gain some knowledge from you.

Wow, pretty heady post. Your background, experience and intentions probably tend to put most of us out of play when trying to give advice. (The available cash cow for the boat also is significant). That being said and your suggestion that youth is on your side (time not a real factor) I would suggest you make a list of qualities that are necessary to your lifestyle and try to apply them to your new home. Personally I have lived aboard both mono and multis and find sail ability goes to monos while multis provide more comfort. With your bankroll, unless new is a must, look for higher quality older/better made boats of either ilk. Take some time to actually apply your own sail xperience to the final contenders before you do buy and you and your GF will be more likely to find something that fits you. Sweet sailing and fresh breezes whenever and wherever.
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Old 10-04-2016, 08:49   #7
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Re: Let me introduce myself and hopefully gain some knowledge from you.

I would recommend sailing on a few different boats to better understand what is involved. Larger boats have many advantages but also can mean needing more crew and will cost far more in maintenance, time and ongoing needs. I sold everything and decided on a 37 foot cutter that I can singlehand if need to but is great for a few people to venture on. You can charter or arrange with people to do day sails. Cats are a great balance.
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Old 10-04-2016, 08:56   #8
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Re: Let me introduce myself and hopefully gain some knowledge from you.

You're getting some good boat recommendations, I'm sure you'll do your homework when it comes to bluewater boats. Sailing a Passport 37, the only point we disagree with above is the "need" for a 50' + boat. Yes, they are more comfortable however that comes at a cost -- and it's not just the initial purchase cost, everything is significantly more expensive. But if you're at anchor most of the time, this eases the difference (except for maybe the draft of the larger boat).

One thing that comes to mind is to reserve FAR more than you originally thought to equip and customize the boat for YOU and your GF. Since our Passport was daysail equipped, we spent as much equipping her for long distance cruising as we spent on the boat originally.... which we did not anticipate.

Good luck & HAVE FUN!
Cheers! Jan
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Old 10-04-2016, 09:25   #9
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Re: Let me introduce myself and hopefully gain some knowledge from you.

I also would start out on a smaller inexpensive older boat to learn the ropes and figure out what is really important to you. Like everything when you buy something newer and expensive you loose about 30 to 50% of the value as soon as you take possession. Larger is much harder to sell when you find out there is something about it that you really just can't stand. Almost everything that is for sale and used is being sold for a reason, often that reason is not apparent. I decided steel was very important for me, since I expect to spend time in upper latitudes dodging icebergs.
A bad day sailing is 100 times better than a good day at work.
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Old 10-04-2016, 11:04   #10
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Re: Let me introduce myself and hopefully gain some knowledge from you.

Hi AJ,

From your description it sounds like you are well positioned to pick and choose your new lifestyle.

Before researching specific vessels [and I suspect you have done this to some degree already...] I would advocate you instead think of your requirements from the perspective of amenities and lifestyle you would prefer, then seek vessels that match those criteria. [Like when you start searching for or building a new home...]

Much will depend upon where you desire to cruise, your [existing or planned] mutual capabilities and experience, which circumstances you desire to be prepared for (e.g., Warm and/or cool climates; latitudes you desire to visit; independence from civilization for what period of time (hours, days, weeks, months?) your desired level of comfort; your combined tolerance for risk, discomfort, etc.]

I've been through this several times, and each of the 5 vessels I have chosen to cruise over the last 30+ years was a progressive lifestyle refinement over the previous vessels.

As I said in one of my introductory blog posts regarding our current vessel choice:
It still isn't clear if we are acquiescing to age, wisdom, experience, weakness of character, or a combination...
An example of categories of requirements might include: [in very broad terms, and your answers will vary depending upon where in the world you imagine yourself while formulating your responses...]
  • Livability [Defined differently by each of us- includes comfort and lifestyle considerations...]
  • Cruisability [Again, different definitions for everyone- includes safety, stability, proven design, minimum required crew, independence from marinas, number of helms, motoring range, etc.]
  • Visibility [to the outside world while relaxing inside. This was very important to us as we travel to see the scenery while living/relaxing in our boat/home as well as visit new cultures...]
  • Maintainability [Again, different for everyone. What do you need to hire others to do for you with a particular vessel, if anything...]
  • [Re]Salability [Historic for manufacturer and model. Important as you learn and refine your ongoing requirements list to the point you may desire a different vessel in the future.]
  • Insurability [If not self-insuring, have a discussion with a reliable ins. broker, and get an estimate before purchasing your dream vessel to avoid surprises...]
  • Desirability [To you and your GF. No one else matters except perhaps a future buyer...]
  • Affordability [Last but not least... Includes purchase, upgrades, ongoing maintenance, insurance and moorage costs, etc.]

I could go on, and may have missed a few major categories of the top of my head. I could also provide many more details under each major heading [or our 3 page requirements outline...] but doing so might introduce bias to your thinking...

Also, don't think boats as you ponder lifestyle and livability requirements; think what you are used to/prefer on land and would prefer not to do without in your new lifestyle... [e.g. things we might take for granted in land based dwellings include water, sewer, electricity, clothes washer/dryer, dishwasher, etc.] Then prioritize that list to see where you stand.

You might even consider doing this exercise independently, then comparing your lists and refining [and/or negotiating...] from there...

In hopes this helps get you started, and best wishes working through your requirements as you work toward refining your list of vessels that match...


SV Denali Rose

Short on opinions; focused on research, facts & experience [yours and ours...]
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Old 10-04-2016, 11:57   #11
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Re: Let me introduce myself and hopefully gain some knowledge from you.

You said that your girlfriend will be living in the boat more than you. It is typical that the idea to live in a boat and sail with it comes from the men (you). For these reasons it is (maybe) essential that you buy a boat that your girlfriend feels attached to. You sailing future looks better if you both love the boat and living in it.

Women typically put lots of weight on the interior and ability to live a comfortable life in the boat. If that is the case, you should buy a boat with good quality interior and with all the required household items. That target does not conflict with your interest of sailing the world. There are many good quality monohull cruisers that meet both those needs.

Can't say much more since you didn't tell much about your personal preferences. The choice depends on how much weight you want to put on speed, safety, stability, sailing close to equator vs. closer to the poles, sailing also in heavy weather vs. only in the easy trade winds, living long in each place vs. sailing most of the time (once you start moving around), in remote areas vs. from town to town, lots of space vs. small is enough, easy to sail vs. sail handling is the best part of it.

It is also possible that you buy first a living oriented boat and switch to a more cruising oriented boat later. That could make sense if you want to buy first a spacious boat that is not too expensive, and want to emphasise seaworthiness only later. But you can do it also at one go, especially if you are are happy with a good quality but that need not be "as big as you can afford".
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Old 10-04-2016, 15:10   #12
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Re: Let me introduce myself and hopefully gain some knowledge from you.


Welcome, and congratulations to your decision to live your dream.

Your own mooring - is your initial cost of making one and getting to your choice spot or simply buy an existing one.

No much difference for small or big boat.

Marina - charges by the foot. Then the shorter the length, the less you pay the better.

I was invited to have a look at a friend's cat, Antares 44 - nice, very nice but that is 2 boats vs 1 boat,
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Old 10-04-2016, 15:16   #13
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Re: Let me introduce myself and hopefully gain some knowledge from you.

Hi everyone, wow I wasn't expecting such a varied mix of answers, some really great points, some I had thought about others I hadn't.

I have deliberately kept a open mind, almost forcing myself not to like any one boat, hard though it is.

Choosing the boat will be me and my GF's choice, if she's not happy then I won't be, I need to be happy for a easy life, you know how it is!

Our plan is to start somewhere like the Med or Caribbean, easier sailing, lots of marinas, moorings, other sailors and chandlers/boat repairers. Get to know the boat and iron out the niggles, become settled and at one with the boat, get her squared away for every eventuality and make sure we are drilled to perfection for whatever may arise. (plan for the worst, hope for the best and all that)

We plan to travel the world, cross most major oceans in time but not straight away. Probably won't be venturing to colder climes if it can be helped. I'm fed up of the cold!

We will require a boat that can stay at sea for longish periods of time, Atlantic crossing is about 18-20 odd days so, water maker, solar panels, genset, large fridge/freezer/storage some sort of washing facility would be ideal.

Guests would be a max of 6, inc us.

I like the idea of a older vessel like a Halberg Rassey 53 which is set up for blue water cruising or maybe a Beneteau 57 - I heard they are the last of the Beneteau's before they went full plastic and poorer workmanship? Is that true?

Obviously this is going to be our only home, so I don't mind spending money on it, I live in a chamber when I'm offshore (no sunlight) so I don't want to get home and be stuck inside a pokey boat that reminds me of where I just came from. I am mechanically minded and will give anything a go, I also know my limitations that's when I don't mind paying a professional to do a proper job.

Sailing dynamics are important but it doesn't need to be world class. Obviously it would be nice to know that the boat could handle bad weather and be able to get us out of trouble or out run a approaching storm if need be. I won't be intentionally sailing in to bad weather if I can help it but as we are all aware weather changes quickly.

I have been in 11m waves in the North Sea and seen metal Gunwhales flattened on a DSV, obviously no sailing vessel could withstand that, so I have to be realistic with my expectations and I am.

I did initially start looking at the newer stuff, Hanse, Moody, Beneteau Sense, Dufour etc. The Southampton boat show drew me in like a sucker, everything was shiny and new, its a trap there!

But like said above the loss can be horrific, I'm not really prepared to throw that sort of money away just to own new, hence why I thought I'd ask on here giving very little away as to get a unbiased answer on what you guys would choose.

We do plan to charter once the list is down to the final 2 or 3 selected boats, I would never just rock up at a marina and lay down my hard earned cash.

Thanks for all your advice, friendly lot on here, I hope to contribute one day like you have for me. Cheers.
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Old 10-04-2016, 16:03   #14
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Re: Let me introduce myself and hopefully gain some knowledge from you.

Originally Posted by AJPT View Post
Hi everyone, ...
What I read from that mail is that ...

Warm waters, nice trade winds, lots of miles eventually, including long passages. Yes, plenty of that around the globe. No need for an arctic survival boat.

For 6 persons. That should make it also not too cramped for two persons (not chamber like).

You are handy and willing to work with the boat. Older boats would be fine, and cheaper. Usually people however recommend not to buy a "project boat" but a boat that has been lovingly kept in good condition despite of its age. The idea is that you will have plenty to do in any case, and project boats tend to be too much for anyone (and will never sail).

Hallberg-Rassy is one of the well built top brands. Beneteau is more mass production oriented. Two brands from different ends of the scale. Do you want to invest in quality or do you want a bigger boat with less money? Maybe the best 6 person boat you can get with your budget. But save part of the budget for upgrades, maintenance and surprises. (I can't tell which Beneteau models are the best.)

It seems that a cruising oriented boat would be good for you, and there are no special sporty speed requirements. You might aim at a heavy, steady and safe cruiser. (Or you could go light and fast, and that could be cheaper.)
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Old 10-04-2016, 19:02   #15
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Re: Let me introduce myself and hopefully gain some knowledge from you.

Charter in the bvi sail big boats I have been out there you have worked in the North Sea you and I have been in conditions that render a big cargo feel like a small tender. Your plans need a 50 footer you got plenty of excellent world cruising boats in the UK, spend wisely you know the seas innards. Go sailing and enjoy it
Good luck
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