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Old 03-01-2013, 21:09   #46
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Re: Jacklines

1] Bernard Moitessier never used a harness or jacklines. He believed in clinging like a monkey: one hand for the boat, one for the banana.

2] I'm not Bernard Moitessier. Neither are you
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Old 03-01-2013, 21:31   #47
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Re: Jacklines

I use a tether when I am solo, or with only novice sailors. I rig jack lines at the dock, and clip in when I leave. Seems extreme? Not to me. All hands clip in when on deck (out of the cockpit) in winds over 25 knots (or if the sea state is ugly - my call). We usually just leave the clips on when in the cockpit. If someone unclips to do some task, they tell someone else. At night everyone clips on if they are out of the cabin. I don't have statistics to back up my procedures, but I've been doing so since I was a teenager in the early 60's sailing CCA races out of San Francisco. I've never gone over the side, but have slipped pretty badly in heavy seas, and the tether seemed to catch me up.

I use jack lines on both port and starboard. They may or may not be tight enough to keep me on the boat, but they will help to do so. If I go over and there is crew aboard, they can get me back on. I hope to never watch the boat leaving me in the water as it sails away!! If I'm solo (which I often am), I have several stirrups I tie towards the stern to give me a fighting chance to make it back aboard. I never trust the jack line, but I use it because it stacks the deck (little sailing pun, get it?) in my favor. I know from personal experience how hard it is to get back onboard a boat from the water, or to get someone else back. My boat has a swim deck stern and a ladder accessible from the water, which could be used by unclipping from the tether. I also added a motor lift (just got it for my birthday this year!) with a snatch block to help get someone out of the water. Going overboard is a deadly experience. You can take steps to make it less likely, and more survivable. and yeah, if I died, it would be good for my family if my body was found. Jack lines, life jackets, pay attention. One hand for the ship, one hand for yourself.
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Old 03-01-2013, 22:55   #48
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Re: Jacklines

Peggy Slater who owned a red Kettenburg 43 famously fell overboard on her solo sail in a race to Hawaii. I have her autobiography which was published but never released, as she passed away before it could be.

It is a fascinating story where she got caught in a foresail over the side for a day or two and the boat continued to sail past the island. She started hallucinating while overboard. The race committee sent out a search. I can't remember how she got back aboard. I'll have to reread it and get back to you on that.

She was an amazing woman. We bought our K41 through her brokerage in Marina Del Rey.
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Old 03-01-2013, 23:04   #49
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Re: Jacklines

Well, lookey there. I just googled Peggy Slater and her book is available on Amazon. I am glad. When we heard that it wasn't going to be sold, 20 years ago, we begged for one from the publisher.

Peggy: An Affair With the Sea

I highly recommend it to anybody interested in sailing. Did I say 'highly'?

At least go look at the cover. She was intense.
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Old 03-01-2013, 23:38   #50
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Re: Jacklines

I like to rig up a second line of defence when sailing solo. I don't find it makes me any more careless about hooking in and moving about the boat, but it helps me feel I've covered a realistic number of bases.

Here's one example of a workable rig I've used.

Tow a long floating line with periodic knots and a waterski handle at the end. The end is attached to the boat in such a way that when pulled, it flips the tillerpilot up off the tiller and slews the tiller in the heave to direction.

There are as many solutions as boats but this is an easy one if you use a tillerpilot.
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Old 03-01-2013, 23:49   #51
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Re: Jacklines

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I love these threads. 38 replies, and not ONE of these answered the OP's question. Doesn't that make anyone feel funny, responses based upon nothing more than opinion, when he specifically asked about actual expereince?
I was thinking the exact same thing. 90% of the threads here follow that theme.
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Old 03-01-2013, 23:54   #52
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Re: Jacklines

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More fit than most sailors, wow....is based on speculation, judgement or fact? how would you know this?
Just a guess but if I were on who wants to be a millionaire I would answer 5% for the amount of skippers who can do more than three chin ups and less than 1% who could do two chin ups wearing 60#'s of soaking wet clothes and shoes.
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Old 04-01-2013, 01:15   #53
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Re: Jacklines

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Originally Posted by thinwater View Post
I love these threads. 38 replies, and not ONE of these answered the OP's question. Doesn't that make anyone feel funny, responses based upon nothing more than opinion, when he specifically asked about actual expereince?.......
Yeah. makes me feel kind of funny. Out of 38 responses only one seems to be unable to think outside the box.
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Old 04-01-2013, 02:33   #54
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Re: Jacklines

Actual experience: I fell in once while racing. The lifeline hook popped open and over I went. On the way in I grabbed the pelican hook and proceeded to surf along back next to the rudder. The crew slowed the boat and this guy with superhuman strength yanked me aboard like a 220 pound wet fish. Won the race by a minute.

I have jumped in many times. Sometimes without putting the ladder down first. In a marina I have always been able to climb out on the dock. At anchor on the old boat climbing aboard via the anchor rode was a challenge. The current boat is easy because the transom has some handy ports to grab.

I'm am in better shape than the average cruiser. But nothing special. It's good to practice re-entry.
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Old 04-01-2013, 03:44   #55
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Re: Jacklines

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Has anyone out there ever reentered their boat after falling overboard while under way? Or jumped in on purpose and reentered?

I'm a solo sailor, and it has always been a concern........my boat is hard enough to reenter even when it is not moving.
I use a grigri - similar to this but without the lanyard , i made a lanyard up out of some abseiling dynemma.

Works a treat, used it for 15,000 miles solo mostly offshore. Instantly adjustable. I use a lightweight climbing harness which is worn all the time in any kind of weather, awake and asleep. The grigri is very good for reefing, clip onto the mast, take tension out of the lanyard through the grigri and lean back into the harness leaving both hands free.

And as others have said, I work on the principle that overboard is dead, consider the side of the boat to be a 500' drop onto jagged rocks with lions and crocodiles Stay on the boat.
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Old 04-01-2013, 05:08   #56
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Re: Jacklines

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Originally Posted by Nessus View Post
Just a guess but if I were on who wants to be a millionaire I would answer 5% for the amount of skippers who can do more than three chin ups and less than 1% who could do two chin ups wearing 60#'s of soaking wet clothes and shoes.
I'm the Op and another of my concerns is just getting on the boat when secured after falling in which is one of the reasons I haven't been wearing my harness. I have trouble getting on when the darn thing is anchored, and I can do about 7 pullups/chin ups on a good day with my hiking boats on (did 5 yesterday). We have a pullup bar at work. Actually, lots of them. I work on a military base.

A quick story here: Last year while anchored off Kiptopeke State Park, I came ashore in my kayak and went for a hike. The winds were gusting to near 30 knots by the Bridge so I thought I'd take a hike until it laid down some so I could recross. Upon reaching shore, I pulled the kayak back toward the water so I could lean on it to wash the sand off my feet and put my hiking boots on. (Also, on this day, there was a kayak class going on in the same general area ..................probably 35 kayakers.)

After getting my boots on, I climbed the sand hill there and hiked out through the woods to the highway which took about 45 minutes to an hour. While hiking back and looking through the trees at the waves (which hadn't laid down) I noticed that a some moron had let his kayak get taken out by the tide. The tide rips pretty good in this part of the bay.

I continue on to the cliff edge then realized..................hey, I'm the moron and I need that damn kayak just to get back on the boat. Luckily for me, the wind was against the current and the kayak was only about 150 yards offshore. So I run down to the beach ripping off clothes in the process and started my chronometer. (the fishermen on the beach were happy for some sort of action) I gave myself 10-12 minutes to get to the kayak after which I'd have to turn back.

I made it but was so tired I had to rest for a while before entering the kayak. This was in late October too and it was quite chilly (before my swim that is!)

Yeah, I know now to get a better ladder than the strap ladder I have now which sits on the aft lazerette locker where I can reach it.
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Old 04-01-2013, 06:00   #57
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Re: Jacklines

It would seem to me we can break this problem down into 3 parts
1. Staying on the boat or not falling in the water
2. Staying connected to the boat should you go in the water.
3. Getting back onboard should you fail #1 and succeed with #2
Every boat is different and every owner is different so the methods may be different. But each key step should be carefully considered. I agree staying on the boat and not going over the side is your first defense. Staying attached is you second and getting back onboard the final. Anyone that thinks they can catch and hold onto a line with knots in it is fooling themselves and anyone who thinks they can climb back onboard without a proper ladder is equally kidding themselves. I personally know of at least 3 cases where a person fell in at the dock and drowned because they could not get out of the water on their own. At least one was fit and in good shape. We should all look at this as a system and not one single solution. Also adding a MOB alarm and wearing a PLB while on deck can add to your chances of surviving. No single solution but a good discussion and something we all should think about.
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Old 04-01-2013, 06:07   #58
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Re: Jacklines

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Originally Posted by sailvayu View Post
It would seem to me we can break this problem down into 3 parts
1. Staying on the boat or not falling in the water
2. Staying connected to the boat should you go in the water.
3. Getting back onboard should you fail #1 and succeed with #2
Every boat is different and every owner is different so the methods may be different. But each key step should be carefully considered. I agree staying on the boat and not going over the side is your first defense. Staying attached is you second and getting back onboard the final. Anyone that thinks they can catch and hold onto a line with knots in it is fooling themselves and anyone who thinks they can climb back onboard without a proper ladder is equally kidding themselves. I personally know of at least 3 cases where a person fell in at the dock and drowned because they could not get out of the water on their own. At least one was fit and in good shape. We should all look at this as a system and not one single solution. Also adding a MOB alarm and wearing a PLB while on deck can add to your chances of surviving. No single solution but a good discussion and something we all should think about.
*
I cant add to this- Your right on the mark- and by the way - this could apply somehow-I like your Style--http://www.projectboatzen.com/forum/content/165-particle-theory-boat-parts.html
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Old 04-01-2013, 06:08   #59
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pirate Re: Jacklines

From the Net: Beautiful but bet it doesn't help much if boat is moving.
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Old 04-01-2013, 06:10   #60
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Re: Jacklines

Let me start by saying I never have and I'm sure I never could(presently), pull myself back on my boat using a jackline . . . probably, even if I had help.

This thread makes me think a little differently about sailing . . . especially SOLO sailing. I know I'd have one heck of a time getting back on my sailboat . . . . my gawd, it would even be a chore if I were swimming at anchor.

Maybe a new forum called something like "Couch-Potato Sailors", could be started and be about all the issues that revolve around those of us(probably a high percentage), that are absolutely and near totally unfit sailors, whence we're no longer comfortably sitting at the helm or the dinner table.

Hauling up an anchor every few days, or setting a mainsail(even once a day), isn't much exercise, and I don't know any sailors that can fit a Nautilus(sp), machine on board.

As a group, we especially need to begin a sailboat-associated regimen to, at the very least, improve our chances of survival if the worse happens and the need to use all those "other" muscles come into play.

A regimen that employs the use of various parts of the sailboat to keep us better fit and more capable of surviving all the accidents that could occur.

I wonder what some of these exercises could be?
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