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Old 26-07-2016, 11:40   #1
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Is this the diamond in the rough?

Looking for some input. This boat is a 1978 Formosa 46 currently wallowing away in Puerto Penasco. Have checked her out thoroughly and it would be a
major project to restore her. We have skilled high quality marine labor available here.

What would have to be done:
1. Remove the deck and reglass underneath
2. Rebuild the cabintop (maybe new portlights)
3. Repair a leak in the stuffing box
4. New tanks
5. New wiring
6. Newer sails
7. New running rigging.

There are currently 6 other Formosa 46's for sale on YachtWorld--all LISTED around 100K. Owner wants for 14 for this boat and I'd offer 7 and wouldn't pay more than 10. We have rehab'd boats before (new motors, transoms etc) but this would be the largest project we've undertaken.

So knowing the risks, what do you think??? More info and photos can be found in this thread:

Some Help Identifying this Boat PLZ!

I am currently 50/50. The Admiral is 70/30 yes.

Truly appreciate your opinions!

Thanks!
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Old 26-07-2016, 11:48   #2
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Re: Is this the diamond in the rough?

It sounds like a joke but there's more truth in this saying than humor.

Any boat project will take twice as long and cost twice as much as you estimate.

Just finished a project not quite as extensive on a 1984 Pearson 42. I was working full time and dealing with a number of family responsibilities at the time but it took me seven years to get the boat back in the water. Just got the engine going this week.

Have you calculated how much it will cost you to live where you will work on the boat? How much to store the boat while you're working on it? Is this your dream boat?
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Old 26-07-2016, 12:06   #3
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Re: Is this the diamond in the rough?

i'll take it for 20 when you are finished so you can pick up the next project
for you must love restoring boats way more than sailing them ,)
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Old 26-07-2016, 12:12   #4
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Re: Is this the diamond in the rough?

Diamond in the rough?

It sounds more like you'd be polishing a turd. IMHO.



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Old 26-07-2016, 12:59   #5
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Re: Is this the diamond in the rough?

Quote:
Originally Posted by skipmac View Post
It sounds like a joke but there's more truth in this saying than humor.

Any boat project will take twice as long and cost twice as much as you estimate.

Just finished a project not quite as extensive on a 1984 Pearson 42. I was working full time and dealing with a number of family responsibilities at the time but it took me seven years to get the boat back in the water. Just got the engine going this week.

Have you calculated how much it will cost you to live where you will work on the boat? How much to store the boat while you're working on it? Is this your dream boat?
Oh yes, that has been our experience as well. Always cost more. We are professional project managers so we live the "cost benefit analysis" everyday....

We have a condo here in Penasco about 5 mins from the boatyard. So no issues on where to stay.

It checks some thins off the dream boat list: size, layout, off shore capability. On the other hand, it draws more than I'd like (we are more coastal cruisers) and is "a lot" of boat.

As for "is it a dream boat?" I don't know. Sometimes opportunities present themselves and you have to take a leap of faith. Just not sure I want to take THIS BIG a leap.
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Old 26-07-2016, 13:00   #6
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Re: Is this the diamond in the rough?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kenomac View Post
Diamond in the rough?

It sounds more like you'd be polishing a turd. IMHO.



Thank you sir. I've read many of your posts and I respect your opinion. I've also seen that episode of Mythbusters....
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Old 26-07-2016, 13:02   #7
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Re: Is this the diamond in the rough?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Simonsays View Post
i'll take it for 20 when you are finished so you can pick up the next project
for you must love restoring boats way more than sailing them ,)
No, I've just always found that it usually costs less to put into what you REALLY want. Every boat is a compromise.
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Old 26-07-2016, 13:26   #8
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Re: Is this the diamond in the rough?

So how much money and time do you estimate to get the boat to the standards of the 100k ones on yachtworld?
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Old 26-07-2016, 13:32   #9
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Re: Is this the diamond in the rough?

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So how much money and time do you estimate to get the boat to the standards of the 100k ones on yachtworld?
25 plus an additional 10 in contingency.
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Old 26-07-2016, 13:46   #10
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Re: Is this the diamond in the rough?

Quote:
Originally Posted by AZ Parothead View Post
Oh yes, that has been our experience as well. Always cost more. We are professional project managers so we live the "cost benefit analysis" everyday....

We have a condo here in Penasco about 5 mins from the boatyard. So no issues on where to stay.

It checks some thins off the dream boat list: size, layout, off shore capability. On the other hand, it draws more than I'd like (we are more coastal cruisers) and is "a lot" of boat.

As for "is it a dream boat?" I don't know. Sometimes opportunities present themselves and you have to take a leap of faith. Just not sure I want to take THIS BIG a leap.

If you are having doubts now, before you have even purchased, you probably have the answer.

The biggest thing (IMHO) you need before embarking on any big project is a belief that it is the right thing for you. Without that belief, motivation becomes hard to find. We have all seen project boats where the owner looses motivation.
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Old 26-07-2016, 13:49   #11
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Re: Is this the diamond in the rough?

Quote:
Originally Posted by AZ Parothead View Post
Looking for some input. This boat is a 1978 Formosa 46 currently wallowing away in Puerto Penasco. Have checked her out thoroughly and it would be a
major project to restore her. We have skilled high quality marine labor available here.

What would have to be done:
1. Remove the deck and reglass underneath
2. Rebuild the cabintop (maybe new portlights)
3. Repair a leak in the stuffing box
4. New tanks
5. New wiring
6. Newer sails
7. New running rigging.


Thanks!
There's one thing you left off your list, re-doing the standing rigging. For doing your tanks, you'll be destroying furniture, which will then require some work to get back to habitable.

I think the hardest part for me to evaluate this project for someone else is that I know you're going to find lots of doggy bon bons with projects 1, 2, 4, & 5 at least, and maybe with the standing rigging, as well, and what you're going to have left at the end is a 40 plus year old Taiwan built boat. Projects 1 & 2 are ginormous in themselves, and you're likely to find a lot more rot than you can see at this time. Talk about a hole in the water you pour money into! And hours of physically taxing labor, too. I sure hope the engine's good. Not attractive to me, but if it's something both of you will enjoy doing, then why not? It's your time and effort! And, any boat of that age will have some things you want to change, although maybe not $93,000 worth.

Maybe take a look at minaret's thread, "Nauticat 52 refit", and Rich Boren's new on about the deck job on his boat that he started with the help of his 17 yr. old son that has been running in the northern hemisphere summer, not finished yet, and the boy'll be back in school in about a month.....

Good luck with it.

Ann
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Old 26-07-2016, 15:35   #12
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Re: Is this the diamond in the rough?

Quote:
Originally Posted by SthnJeff View Post
If you are having doubts now, before you have even purchased, you probably have the answer.

The biggest thing (IMHO) you need before embarking on any big project is a belief that it is the right thing for you. Without that belief, motivation becomes hard to find. We have all seen project boats where the owner looses motivation.
Yes, I agree. I REALLY like the boat and I can see the potential. It's not a matter of losing motivation-we'd finish it. Just a matter of wanting to do THAT much work.
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Old 26-07-2016, 15:39   #13
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Re: Is this the diamond in the rough?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ann T. Cate View Post
There's one thing you left off your list, re-doing the standing rigging. For doing your tanks, you'll be destroying furniture, which will then require some work to get back to habitable.

I think the hardest part for me to evaluate this project for someone else is that I know you're going to find lots of doggy bon bons with projects 1, 2, 4, & 5 at least, and maybe with the standing rigging, as well, and what you're going to have left at the end is a 40 plus year old Taiwan built boat. Projects 1 & 2 are ginormous in themselves, and you're likely to find a lot more rot than you can see at this time. Talk about a hole in the water you pour money into! And hours of physically taxing labor, too. I sure hope the engine's good. Not attractive to me, but if it's something both of you will enjoy doing, then why not? It's your time and effort! And, any boat of that age will have some things you want to change, although maybe not $93,000 worth.

Maybe take a look at minaret's thread, "Nauticat 52 refit", and Rich Boren's new on about the deck job on his boat that he started with the help of his 17 yr. old son that has been running in the northern hemisphere summer, not finished yet, and the boy'll be back in school in about a month.....

Good luck with it.

Ann
Hi Ann,

Thanks for your opinion. Actually the boat has new-ish standing rigging. It was redone 3 years ago and it's in good-great condition. I've been trying to figure out exactly where the tanks are located. The interior is beautiful and I'd like to preserve as much as possible.

I read the Nauticat thread all the way through--it has added to my apprehension. I'll look for the other thread you mention.
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Old 26-07-2016, 15:46   #14
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Re: Is this the diamond in the rough?

Also, to be clear, we intend to supervise most of the work. We have excellent skilled craftsmen in our community who work for about 5-10/hour for fiberglass work. Marine mechanic labor is 10-12/hr.
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Old 26-07-2016, 15:51   #15
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Re: Is this the diamond in the rough?

Hi Parothead, I have always loved the Formosas and was going to buy one. Ended up with a custom 52 Vagabond schooner. Also from Tiawan. I love these boats and they are comfortable and tough and plod along pretty well, but if you dont love this boat keep looking. If its been neglected it may not be worth it and it will be a huge investment of time and money I bought mine for 100k It had new rigging, new hull, new engine and electronics and sails in 98. I spent 9 months in a yard in the Chesapeake and another 100k and have cruised far and wide in the last 8 years but still spend a lot on maintenence. Still love the boat but its love not smarts. All the best
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