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Old 10-10-2016, 07:37   #31
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Re: Is a 44 Bavaria suitable for sailing in rough seas?

Ok seriously..

I never said anything against Bavarias .. simply tried to illustrate how someone's reasoning is flawed "I see bavarias all around me, they got here sailing ergo they are seaworthy". That's all I am adressing. I don't have an opinion nor tried to give you one on bavarias. You can sail around on a rubber duck for all I care.

Another piece of flawed logic: "X sailed a Bavaria around Cape Horn, ergo they are seaworthy" .. like boatman said: people do all sorts of stuff and some get away with it. Some don't . But that statement doesn't prove anything regarding seaworthiness of a boat.

Has any of you called Bavaria Yachtbau GmbH and asked them what they think if you can take their boat thru the arctic passage? I would start there if I was considering that.. better than asking around in a forum.

Once again, I am not making any statements regarding the build quality of any boat in the market. I am making comments on the bad quality of your deductive logic.

Sheez
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Old 10-10-2016, 07:38   #32
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pirate Re: Is a 44 Bavaria suitable for sailing in rough seas?

Quote:
Originally Posted by double u View Post
't was an Oceanic...Oceanic 30 Catamaran for sale
Damn.. blackholed it.. gonna have to start to Google instead of relying on memory
But it was an O'Brian designed plywood cat like the Bobcat.. and the question is the same.. folk have sailed across the N Atlantic in winter in a 14ft boat and made it.
An exception does not make a rule
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Old 10-10-2016, 07:44   #33
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pirate Re: Is a 44 Bavaria suitable for sailing in rough seas?

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Originally Posted by daletournier View Post
Arent you a fan of small plywood Wharrams?

Sent from my vivo Y35 using Cruisers Sailing Forum mobile app
Yes.. and a 21ftr has circumnavigated via New Zealand.. would I try it..??
Today no.. lack the agility and suppleness I once had.. delivered a Tiki 26 last year and it hurt.. but in my 40's I owned and sailed one around the UK S coast and France semi-live aboard quite happily.
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Old 10-10-2016, 08:06   #34
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Re: Is a 44 Bavaria suitable for sailing in rough seas?

pretty sure it was fibreglass, the Oceanic...
& absolutely true:
"An exception does not make a rule"!!!
I don't think that I stick my neck too far out in stating that the Bavarias were & still are aimed first & foremost at the charter-market!
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Old 10-10-2016, 08:11   #35
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Re: Is a 44 Bavaria suitable for sailing in rough seas?

"...a 21ftr has circumnavigated ...":
"cooking fat" was the name....what's in a name? (in this case: everything!!!)
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Old 10-10-2016, 08:30   #36
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pirate Re: Is a 44 Bavaria suitable for sailing in rough seas?

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Originally Posted by double u View Post
pretty sure it was fibreglass, the Oceanic...
& absolutely true:
"An exception does not make a rule"!!!
I don't think that I stick my neck too far out in stating that the Bavarias were & still are aimed first & foremost at the charter-market!
They were marine ply with a glass/epoxy sheathing like the Wharrams
OCEANIC 30 sailboat specifications and details on sailboatdata.com
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Old 10-10-2016, 08:43   #37
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Re: Is a 44 Bavaria suitable for sailing in rough seas?

"SCAFO: VTR" here Sout coast catamaran
VTR I'd venture meaning "vetroresina"
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Oceanic 30 Catamaran for sale
Oceanic MK II 30' Catamaran for sale, 9.14m (30'0"), 1970 | Boatshed Poole
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Old 10-10-2016, 08:55   #38
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pirate Re: Is a 44 Bavaria suitable for sailing in rough seas?

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Whatever... they were playing with all sorts back then.. and it was external sheeting.. does it really make that much difference.
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Old 10-10-2016, 10:14   #39
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Re: Is a 44 Bavaria suitable for sailing in rough seas?

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Originally Posted by wesevans View Post
The one I helped to deliver from the Bahamas to Norfolk fell apart in rough weather made us put in as Beaufort NC
Can you be more specific ? What happened ? The mast fell down ? You hit a half sunken container ? Unless there was a flaw because of poor maintenance or original defect, the answer to the first question has a lot to do with the experience of the crew if not more PS: Cape Hatteras is well known & even more respected around the world among sailors, with the Gulf Stream flowing over/along shallow water, & I wouldn't even take my mother-in-law sailing there
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Old 10-10-2016, 10:29   #40
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Re: Is a 44 Bavaria suitable for sailing in rough seas?

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Can you be more specific ? What happened ? The mast fell down ? You hit a half sunken container ? Unless there was a flaw because of poor maintenance or original defect, the answer to the first question has a lot to do with the experience of the crew if not more PS: Cape Hatteras is well known & even more respected around the world among sailors, with the Gulf Stream flowing over/along shallow water, & I wouldn't even take my mother-in-law sailing there
Forget it. You'll never get any specifics.
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Old 10-10-2016, 12:10   #41
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Re: Is a 44 Bavaria suitable for sailing in rough seas?

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And in the 70's a woman, her husband and child circumnavigated a 30ft plywood Bobcat including going round Cape Horn..
Would you buy one..??
Thanks a lot for the link

I sent him an email earlier and he responded rather quickly and said that in his opinion, Bavaria boats built up to 2004 are alright, past that, they started to cut costs and workmanship suffered.

He says he sails anywhere in the world with it and there are no issues with the boat, so long as you steer it sensibly. "Against (the wind?) doesn't work at all though."

The only problem is, that you are tied to two sails because of the rolling furling system (I hope I translated that correctly?) and there is no gale sail. He uses a second "Vorstak" (German), a term I'm unfamiliar with, but on Wikipedia, it sounds like something like a small forward sail

Otherwise, he said its a really safe boat, but not the fastest.


He has taken some fantastic voyages, I'm still reading his well written and fascinating accounts...
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Old 10-10-2016, 12:18   #42
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Re: Is a 44 Bavaria suitable for sailing in rough seas?

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And in the 70's a woman, her husband and child circumnavigated a 30ft plywood Bobcat including going round Cape Horn..
Would you buy one..??
I said they should talk with the skipper of that boat, not recommending the boat for sailing on extreme latitudes neither is that what the original poster is asking.

The skipper of that boat got a fair amount of stormy weather (I know that), the boat was sailed by a couple (not some crazy guy in search of an adrenaline or wanting to prove something). It was a boat with around 10 years, a ex charter, that was bought at the end of his life as a charter boat.

What I am saying is that the skipper of that boat has more information than you or me about the seaworthiness and limitations of that particular boat in what regards sailing in nasty weather and that is the one the OP is interested in, so I think it is a good idea to talk with the crew and that is what I counsel him to do.

Actually I think the boat is able to take a fair share of stormy weather. I sailed on one for a week and it looked solid to me.

I know also a guy that circumnavigated twice with a Bavaria 36 from the same vintage (solo), one of them by the horn, getting also a fair share of storms (on one broke the mast and had to jury rig), but I continue to think that in what regard that particular model the owner of one that has circumnavigated by high latitudes can provide a better and more accurate information.
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Old 10-10-2016, 12:25   #43
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Re: Is a 44 Bavaria suitable for sailing in rough seas?

"vorstak" (actually spelled "Vorstag") = forestay
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Old 10-10-2016, 12:28   #44
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Re: Is a 44 Bavaria suitable for sailing in rough seas?

@n13L5:

Quote:
He uses a second "Vorstak" (German), a term I'm unfamiliar with
Vorstag = Forestay

So it seems he basically converted the BAV to be cutter rigged.

Regards,

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Old 10-10-2016, 12:30   #45
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Re: Is a 44 Bavaria suitable for sailing in rough seas?

could be a removable second stay close behind the roller
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