Hunter - Blue-water or not?

[akprb]

Read “Hunter, Really?” at sailingohana

That gives my opinion :-)

If you want to single hand here’s the boat for you! Would be great fun sailing her to Mexico!

http://m.sailboatlistings.com/view/63799

[akprb]

Originally Posted by KadeyKrogen38

I would not wish to be aboard any Hunter in rough conditions. Especially those where you are pounding or dropping off waves.

My same feeling with a Krogen! (Or pretty much any boat!)

[Pizzazz]

One general way to think about the capabilities of a particular boat is to think about the design criteria when the boat was built (this is not necessarily how the boat is marketed). For example, my Hunter 31 is a relatively light boat, optimized for light winds (5-15 knots), upwind sailing and some weekend racing. It was marketed as a bluewater boat and has some desirable features (oversized rigging, for example) but it is far from what is considered a capable bluewater boat (HR and the like).

If you compare the Halberg-Rassy 312 to the Hunter 31 of the same era, you will find the HR to be heavier, D/L 321 vs. 231, with a bigger B/D ratio of 45% vs. 41%. Most other parameters are identical. So, you would expect the HR to be slower in light winds, not to point as well but be more comfortable in big seas. If you sail both, though, you will immediately notice the quality of the HR - it does not creak, it is smooth and relaxed, it feels secure. The Hunter can feel scary in big seas. Both boats will cross oceans OK but the comfort level will be dramatically different.

In your particular case, the H54 is an old, ocean racing design, limited production. It requires a large crew to be sailed well, it is narrow and cramped for a cruiser and it will be a maintenance headache. There is a reason why these boats are so cheap. There is no market for them as racing crews have moved on to better designs.

I think it is OK to take a racing inspired boat and use it as a cruiser, you just have to be aware of the trade-offs. It seems that you will be better served with a smaller boat, 31-37 feet as mentioned above that you maintain to a high standard. If you need the space, you need to go above 42 feet but that becomes a handful. Lastly, I want to caution you about the negatives of a bluewater design. If you want a boat in good shape you need to spend top dollar on it, $200-$300K. If you spend less, there is a high chance you will spend many months fixing the boat instead of sailing. Next, Water boats">blue water boats, especially older ones, do not sail well in light winds. 97% or more of your sailing will be in light to medium winds. You need to decide how important that is vs. the risk of having a very scary experience a couple of times a year when you get caught in a strong gale.

Pizzazz

[bjymd]

I have a Jeanneau DS 54 and have sailed solo in 20 knot winds in the Sir Francis Drake Channel. I have had mishaps and have survived and learned. A 54 foot boat sailed by a single experience captain can survive pretty rough waters, but you need a lot of redundancy in your ability to power your boat on a long voyage. Electric winches are the only way to control the beast under sail in weather. Solar panels, generator and ample battery banks are necessary in a boat that size. I would hope that you have the knowledge to work with diesel engines to problem solve as things go wrong. Best of luck with your quest. Fair winds and following seas.

[Sailmonkey]

Originally Posted by bjymd

I have a Jeanneau DS 54 and have sailed solo in 20 knot winds in the Sir Francis Drake Channel. I have had mishaps and have survived and learned. A 54 foot boat sailed by a single experience captain can survive pretty rough waters, but you need a lot of redundancy in your ability to power your boat on a long voyage. Electric winches are the only way to control the beast under sail in weather. Solar panels, generator and ample battery banks are necessary in a boat that size. I would hope that you have the knowledge to work with diesel engines to problem solve as things go wrong. Best of luck with your quest. Fair winds and following seas.

Important part highlighted.

[Want2cruz]

Originally Posted by akprb

Read “Hunter, Really?” at sailingohana

That gives my opinion :-)

If you want to single hand here’s the boat for you! Would be great fun sailing her to Mexico!

1994 Hunter Legend sailboat for sale in Florida

I very much like the center cockpit - seems like a more-secure location that back on the "fantail".

I am determined to make the passage to Hawaii, though, from California - not via the big ditch. Mexico is out due to certain laws against certain things that go "bang, bang", which I am never without.

Thanks for the input.

[Dougtiff]

Having owned a Cherubini 37 ft. Hunter, i would say it can do blue water sailing for sure, although the fwd. hull will oilcan going to weather in any rough condition's, fiberglassing a bunch of vertical cleats on the inside takes care of this problem and one can add insulation with a ceiling over, reducing noise and condensation, also the plastic windows need replacing with metal port holes, the boat goes to weather very well, a great one or two person cruising boat for sure, at a reasonable price, your thoughts on a 54 footer is not realistic.

[Want2cruz]

Originally Posted by bjymd

I have a Jeanneau DS 54 and have sailed solo in 20 knot winds in the Sir Francis Drake Channel. I have had mishaps and have survived and learned. A 54 foot boat sailed by a single experience captain can survive pretty rough waters, but you need a lot of redundancy in your ability to power your boat on a long voyage. Electric winches are the only way to control the beast under sail in weather. Solar panels, generator and ample battery banks are necessary in a boat that size. I would hope that you have the knowledge to work with diesel engines to problem solve as things go wrong. Best of luck with your quest. Fair winds and following seas.

Thanks for the input. I am not dedicated to a 50+ footer, but that it what I saw online. I can use a smaller boat, but the price point is good, and it is in CA.

Another Hunter 54 is in Marina del Rey in L.A. County (I am in Orange County).

Is the primary issue, as you see it, the effort to set the sails, hence the need for an electric winch, as well as physical effort to manage the sails when reefing, etc.

Here is the listing.


BTW, my only experience with diesels is running heavy equipment, sometimes in cold weather where a Caterpillar needs glow plugs to start.


As an IT person, I solve problems all day long.

[Bacchanal]

I own a 2000 Hunter 380. Part of the reason I chose this model is that I wanted to enter the Bemuda Race and the Marblehead to Halifax Race. I have now completed both and can tell you that we arrived safe and sound both times, if not quickly. My model is a CE-A rated boat, meaning that it is built to cross oceans. It is extremely comfortable and great in a seaway. I have the roller-furling main that allows me to downsize my main to a handkerchief if necessary. (it was!) The down side is that it does not have a staysail and cannot be rigged with one. I would definitely want that on my next blue water voyage. Sounds like the bigger Hunters already have that.

[scotty c-m]

Three points to consider:

1. The "IsHunteraBlueWaterBoat?" topic has been really discussed at length. Look it up and you'll find LOTS of information.

2. A 50' boat is a lot to single-hand, but you didn't mention your crew in the origanal thread. At any rate, the trip to Hawaii is a big jump. Prepair well.

3. In Hawaii selling a boat can be a real challange. If that is one of your options, you might want to research how that would work for you.

At any rate, Live the Dream! Good luck to you on this, or other, adventures. Be safe!!

[Want2cruz]

Originally Posted by Pizzazz

One general way to think about the capabilities of a particular boat is to think about the design criteria when the boat was built (this is not necessarily how the boat is marketed). For example, my Hunter 31 is a relatively light boat, optimized for light winds (5-15 knots), upwind sailing and some weekend racing. It was marketed as a bluewater boat and has some desirable features (oversized rigging, for example) but it is far from what is considered a capable bluewater boat (HR and the like).

If you compare the Halberg-Rassy 312 to the Hunter 31 of the same era, you will find the HR to be heavier, D/L 321 vs. 231, with a bigger B/D ratio of 45% vs. 41%. Most other parameters are identical. So, you would expect the HR to be slower in light winds, not to point as well but be more comfortable in big seas. If you sail both, though, you will immediately notice the quality of the HR - it does not creak, it is smooth and relaxed, it feels secure. The Hunter can feel scary in big seas. Both boats will cross oceans OK but the comfort level will be dramatically different.

In your particular case, the H54 is an old, ocean racing design, limited production. It requires a large crew to be sailed well, it is narrow and cramped for a cruiser and it will be a maintenance headache. There is a reason why these boats are so cheap. There is no market for them as racing crews have moved on to better designs.

I think it is OK to take a racing inspired boat and use it as a cruiser, you just have to be aware of the trade-offs. It seems that you will be better served with a smaller boat, 31-37 feet as mentioned above that you maintain to a high standard. If you need the space, you need to go above 42 feet but that becomes a handful. Lastly, I want to caution you about the negatives of a bluewater design. If you want a boat in good shape you need to spend top dollar on it, $200-$300K. If you spend less, there is a high chance you will spend many months fixing the boat instead of sailing. Next, blue water boats, especially older ones, do not sail well in light winds. 97% or more of your sailing will be in light to medium winds. You need to decide how important that is vs. the risk of having a very scary experience a couple of times a year when you get caught in a strong gale.

Pizzazz

I will scout around for smaller boats. I don't NEED the space, as I will be solo, and eating MRE's. My goal is to make the passage to Hawaii, and perhaps back or to Tahiti. After that, the boat will be sold, and my wife and I will buy an RV and "cruise" terra firma from coast-to-coast, and after that, perhaps, cruise the Caribbean. My wife will run our Amazon/Internet business while I am gone, so I can't be gone too long.

One of the things I have been doing is comparing the ballast to the Displacement, as well as Beam to Overall length. I've notice quite a bit of difference in the ratios, and total displacement with some shorter boats weighing significantly more than the 54s. It would seem that a higher displacement would tend to indicate a stronger, more-durable vessel. Are there any "numbers and ratios" that are routinely examined, and what range might be desirable for a cruising vessel.

I have near-total confidence in my ability to handle the trip UNLESS, the very worst happens. If it does, well I'll do my best and survive, or not.

[Want2cruz]

Originally Posted by scotty c-m

Three points to consider:

1. The "IsHunteraBlueWaterBoat?" topic has been really discussed at length. Look it up and you'll find LOTS of information.

2. A 50' boat is a lot to single-hand, but you didn't mention your crew in the origanal thread. At any rate, the trip to Hawaii is a big jump. Prepair well.

3. In Hawaii selling a boat can be a real challange. If that is one of your options, you might want to research how that would work for you.

At any rate, Live the Dream! Good luck to you on this, or other, adventures. Be safe!!

Yes, I think selling a boat in Hawaii would be my last option. Any thoughts on the market in Tahiti or surrounds?

I might just have to sail her back.

[robert sailor]

With your plans laid out my advice would be to buy a boat that is adequate for the job and second one that has a following so your selling plans will work out for you. I would keep the added equipment to the bare minimum as you'll lose that money when you sell it and because your trip will be short you won't have a chance to amortize any of those costs. You don't need a watermaker, you don't need solar, you don't need radar, you don't need a genset and you don't need a large suit of sails. You can make your trip very easily with a VHF radio, AIS and GPS. The market for selling boats in Hawaii is pretty slim but it does happen. The difficult job is getting a marina birth. Personally I would sail to Hawaii, hang around and have some fun, maybe have a friend join me and sail it back to NA and put it up for sale in Seattle. Good boat market there and higher prices paid compared to many areas in the USA. I have made that trip several times and while the trip back is not as easy as the trip there it's only 20+ days out of your life and the last part of the adventure(selling the boat) will come together much better than Hawaii.

[Want2cruz]

Originally Posted by robert sailor

With your plans laid out my advice would be to buy a boat that is adequate for the job and second one that has a following so your selling plans will work out for you. I would keep the added equipment to the bare minimum as you'll lose that money when you sell it and because your trip will be short you won't have a chance to amortize any of those costs. You don't need a watermaker, you don't need solar, you don't need radar, you don't need a genset and you don't need a large suit of sails. You can make your trip very easily with a VHF radio, AIS and GPS. The market for selling boats in Hawaii is pretty slim but it does happen. The difficult job is getting a marina birth. Personally I would sail to Hawaii, hang around and have some fun, maybe have a friend join me and sail it back to NA and put it up for sale in Seattle. Good boat market there and higher prices paid compared to many areas in the USA. I have made that trip several times and while the trip back is not as easy as the trip there it's only 20+ days out of your life and the last part of the adventure(selling the boat) will come together much better than Hawaii.

Seattle? I've heard of that place before. North of Oregon as I recall!!! Thanks for the advice.

[Want2cruz]

Originally Posted by robert sailor

With your plans laid out my advice would be to buy a boat that is adequate for the job and second one that has a following so your selling plans will work out for you. I would keep the added equipment to the bare minimum as you'll lose that money when you sell it and because your trip will be short you won't have a chance to amortize any of those costs. You don't need a watermaker, you don't need solar, you don't need radar, you don't need a genset and you don't need a large suit of sails. You can make your trip very easily with a VHF radio, AIS and GPS. The market for selling boats in Hawaii is pretty slim but it does happen. The difficult job is getting a marina birth. Personally I would sail to Hawaii, hang around and have some fun, maybe have a friend join me and sail it back to NA and put it up for sale in Seattle. Good boat market there and higher prices paid compared to many areas in the USA. I have made that trip several times and while the trip back is not as easy as the trip there it's only 20+ days out of your life and the last part of the adventure(selling the boat) will come together much better than Hawaii.

As far as a boat with a following, any suggestions - Hans Christian???? Any specifics would be much appreciated!