Cruisers Forum
 


Join CruisersForum Today

Reply
 
Thread Tools Rate Thread Display Modes
Old 20-12-2009, 17:04   #1
Registered User

Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: Hampton, VA
Boat: 45'=not anymore
Posts: 326
Send a message via Skype™ to xxuxx
Hunter 450 Passage...A World Cruiser?

This boat is certified CE A-Ocean. Hull has kevlar stringers. Should I???

Could I????
__________________

__________________
xxuxx is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 20-12-2009, 18:04   #2
Long Range Cruiser
 
MarkJ's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Australian living on "Sea Life" currently in England.
Boat: Beneteau 393 "Sea Life"
Posts: 12,828
Images: 25
We have been on a Hunter 47... I think it was a 47... somewhere in the Pacific and the owners had been having a great cruising life.

They were doing the tropical circumnavigation, like most circumnavigators, and not the 3 capes of fear, cold and big waves.

The boat was quite luxurious... the Yanks do make soft coushions for their fat bums. (Is this a go at a nationality? )

Comfort is a pretty high priority on our list.

Mark
__________________

__________________
Notes on a Circumnavigation.
OurLifeAtSea.com

Somalia Pirates and our Convoy
MarkJ is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 20-12-2009, 19:26   #3
Senior Cruiser

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: between the devil and the deep blue sea
Boat: a sailing boat
Posts: 17,314
Kevlar or no kevlar CE-A or Z won't help much.

Probably have a close look, sail her, read up the specs carefully. Then jump, or not.

b.
__________________
barnakiel is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 21-12-2009, 06:03   #4
Registered User

Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: Currently based near Jacksonville FL; WHOOSH's homeport is St. Pete, FL USA
Boat: WHOOSH, Pearson 424 Ketch
Posts: 591
The EU's Recreational Craft Directive (RCD) that creates the A thru E classification system was drafted up by a Committee well populated with boat manufacturers, a process that has been likened to inviting the foxes to help design the hen house. An 'A' rating is one (partial) demonstration of suitability for extended ocean sailing but keep in mind it doesn't e.g. stipulate safety or suitability in seas over 4m (~13'). Capable ocean sailing boats may not have an A rating for reasons ranging from the builder not seeking it from the EU (lack of ability to support sales there) to details such as the boat has LPG hose delivering propane to the stove rather than copper tubing. Bottom line: Don't hang your hat exclusively on that rating.

I don't know how Hunter is building this particular boat but one thing you might want to look at is the immense above-waterline volume of the hull/deck structure vs. the location of the boat's CG and the hull volume below the waterline. It's pretty rare to find boats that handle a variety of offshore conditions well with that kind of distribution. I recall several of the participants in the last Blue Water Rally (a 22 month circumnavigation rally, from Gib to Gib) commenting about the Hunter 40-ish footer in their rally struggling with some of the conditions they faced for this reason). That issue would be the first one I'd put to bed...

Jack
__________________
WHOOSH, Pearson 424 Ketch
http://www.svsarah.com/Whoosh/WhooshSection.htm
Euro Cruiser is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 21-12-2009, 08:18   #5
Registered User

Join Date: Aug 2008
Boat: Trident marine Voyager 30
Posts: 98
Quote:
Originally Posted by Euro Cruiser View Post
An 'A' rating is one (partial) demonstration of suitability for extended ocean sailing but keep in mind it doesn't e.g. stipulate safety or suitability in seas over 4m (~13').
That is a misunderstanding since class A is for waves exceeding 4 meters and wind exceeding F8.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Euro Cruiser View Post
Capable ocean sailing boats may not have an A rating for reasons ranging from the builder not seeking it from the EU
The builders don't have to seek any rating from the EU. They have to design the boat according to RCD and in many cases the design has to be verified by a third party.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Euro Cruiser View Post
to details such as the boat has LPG hose delivering propane to the stove rather than copper tubing.
I can't imagine that there is any boat builder today that would use hose all the way from the LPG tank to the stove. Is there any such boat builders?
__________________
Anders is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 21-12-2009, 14:33   #6
Registered User

Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: Currently based near Jacksonville FL; WHOOSH's homeport is St. Pete, FL USA
Boat: WHOOSH, Pearson 424 Ketch
Posts: 591
Thanks for the clarification, Anders. What I was trying to say - but didn't - is that a 'rating' that says the boat is suitable for any sea conditions above 4m seas is over-promising.

I don't think I said ratings come from the EU. The RCD 'created' the rating system (well, the Committee established by the EU that drafted the RCD) and it is that system to which mfgrs. choose to build - or not.

Yes, copper tubing is in fact not routinely used by some builders. As one example, a Spanish chap that bought an Island Packet direct from the USA (vs. joining a 2-year waiting list with his local Spanish dealer) mentioned that changing out the propane system (tubing for hose) was one of the changes forced on him by the Spanish inspectors.

Jack
__________________
WHOOSH, Pearson 424 Ketch
http://www.svsarah.com/Whoosh/WhooshSection.htm
Euro Cruiser is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 21-12-2009, 15:15   #7
Senior Cruiser

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: between the devil and the deep blue sea
Boat: a sailing boat
Posts: 17,314
Euro Category A - Ocean capable (?)

Well,

Not to criticize things, but I have seen Category A boats, brand new from the shop, that I would not dare to sail across the ocean.

Sort of like someone out there in the EU government thought a boat crosses an ocean just once ...

Probably OK from some manufacturers' point of view. Much less so from a serious cruisers' perspective.

b.
__________________
barnakiel is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 21-12-2009, 15:28   #8
Senior Cruiser

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: Tasmania
Boat: VandeStadt IOR 40' - Insatiable
Posts: 2,317
Images: 91
Quote:
Originally Posted by xxuxx View Post
This boat is certified CE A-Ocean. Hull has kevlar stringers. Should I???

Could I????
This may sound harsh, but this is one of those questions where if you need to ask the question, then the answer is no.

You can sail around the world in pretty much anything. The limiting factor is not the boat, the boat design, or the boat manufacture, but the sailor. If you understand the limitations of your boat and the limitations of your sailing ability then you can sail around the world in almost any boat. If you don't then there isn't a boat in the world that is good enough.
__________________
Weyalan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 21-12-2009, 16:43   #9
CF Adviser
 
Bash's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: sausalito
Boat: 14 meter sloop
Posts: 7,260
I have the aft-cockpit version of that same hull. They were built like tanks. And it wasn't just the stringers that were kevlar reinforced--it's also the entire bow and the keel joint. Indeed, there's kevlar reinforcement all the way from bow to stern running down the centerline of the boat. Whatever problems you might have, they won't be with stiffness.
__________________
cruising is entirely about showing up--in boat shoes.
Bash is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 21-12-2009, 16:54   #10
Registered User

Join Date: Jan 2007
Posts: 497
Images: 1
And the problem with high quality propane hose properly run and supported is what compared to copper pipe that will corrode away in a salt marine environment?
__________________
jdoe71 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 21-12-2009, 17:30   #11
Senior Cruiser
 
Sailmonkey's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: Houston
Boat: '76 Allied Seawind II, 32'
Posts: 5,775
FWIW, I've sailed a passage 42 offshore GOM. While the ride was less than spectacular in steep confused seas, the boat is more capable than the crew.......
My biggest complaint about the boat is the huge salon. I'm not tall, and cannot reach the handholds on the roof, nor am I able to brace on anything on the other side of the boat a good 12 feet away. There is only one good seaberth on the 42 also.....keeps everyone else sleeping on the sole next to the huge queen in the aft master.
__________________
Sailmonkey is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 22-12-2009, 05:09   #12
Registered User

Join Date: Aug 2008
Boat: Trident marine Voyager 30
Posts: 98
Quote:
Originally Posted by Euro Cruiser View Post
Thanks for the clarification, Anders. What I was trying to say - but didn't - is that a 'rating' that says the boat is suitable for any sea conditions above 4m seas is over-promising.
I agree but class A excludes "abnormal conditions" but I don't think they define what abnormal conditions is.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Euro Cruiser View Post
Yes, copper tubing is in fact not routinely used by some builders. As one example, a Spanish chap that bought an Island Packet direct from the USA (vs. joining a 2-year waiting list with his local Spanish dealer) mentioned that changing out the propane system (tubing for hose) was one of the changes forced on him by the Spanish inspectors.
Jack
There should not be any need for him to do anything since Island Packet states "Every Island Packet model built since the introduction of these CE standards complies with and is certified to the highest rating available, Category A-Ocean."
Island Packet Yachts
__________________

__________________
Anders is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Tags
hunter

Thread Tools
Display Modes Rate This Thread
Rate This Thread:

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Best Cruiser Bars Around the World ? Wahoo Fishing, Recreation & Fun 91 15-04-2012 13:54
Jennybug's Hunter 45 Passage Jennybug Monohull Sailboats 12 13-11-2009 08:06
Hunter 450 Passage Hard Steering mikepremiere Monohull Sailboats 0 01-06-2009 17:41
Best Cruiser: Endeavour VS Hunter (Opinions???) wisenomad Meets & Greets 3 16-09-2008 17:27
World Cruiser aroundtheworldsoon General Sailing Forum 17 31-01-2007 10:57



Copyright 2002- Social Knowledge, LLC All Rights Reserved.

All times are GMT -7. The time now is 03:33.


Google+
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Social Knowledge Networks
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.

ShowCase vBulletin Plugins by Drive Thru Online, Inc.