Cruisers Forum
 


Join CruisersForum Today

Reply
 
Thread Tools Rate Thread Display Modes
Old 24-08-2012, 15:06   #121
Senior Cruiser
 
IslandHopper's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: Bundaberg Queensland/Lake Bolac Victoria, Australia
Boat: 45ft Ketch
Posts: 1,196
Re: Hmmmm - Bowthrusters ??

Quote:
Originally Posted by Lagoon4us View Post
That's how i read it... I guess i throw 40 years away now.............

The vast majority of boats in Europe have thrusters thank heavens.

Hey John you never had a boat listed previous have you lashed out recently or were you keeping mum?

Cheers mate the beer here is almost good!!!! Frank
Yep, lashed out again about 8 months ago.......it's only money hey...

I wonder what captainKJ will say when he finds out i am having a bowthruster fitted as we speak, or that all the work boats i drive have at least three thrusters fitted.......no doubt i'm a liability......

Glad to hear the beer is bearable and you are not being subjected to too much hardship......
__________________

__________________
Adventure before Dementia.
John....
IslandHopper is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 24-08-2012, 23:57   #122
Registered User

Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: Fethiye Turkey
Boat: Lagoon 440
Posts: 3,164
Re: Hmmmm - Bowthrusters ??

Quote:
Originally Posted by IslandHopper View Post
Yep, lashed out again about 8 months ago.......it's only money hey...

I wonder what captainKJ will say when he finds out i am having a bowthruster fitted as we speak, or that all the work boats i drive have at least three thrusters fitted.......no doubt i'm a liability......

Glad to hear the beer is bearable and you are not being subjected to too much hardship......
Recently we were manouvreing into a very tight marina berth in MALI LOSINJE and just as we were lined up, on final approach an Italian on a 40' mono belted into our assigned berth.

These guys are real A''holes they have no manners.

My only way out was to use Port astern and Stb ahead, steering locked with dabs of stb thrust, to make matters worse two of his friends had jumped into the water. There was about 12knots cross wind to piss me off even further.

Without the Thruster we would have had to fend off and manhandle the boat out. The thruster saved the Italian from a smack as i couldn't reach him but you can be assured i advised him about the doubts of the gender of his anatomy.

Thrusters are a tool, great when you need them and re-assuring to hear the armed beep telling me its there.

As far as not being good for more than 20 secs we have not seen that issue come up on our boat nor others around these overcrowded marinas, quite honestly in practice you only need a couple of 3 or 4 sec jabs to bring the head around.

20 Seconds of use would only come up if we dropped one of our mains and needed the thrusters to effect steerage. The motor on ours is huge and it has it's own 145 amp forklift battery.

When are you pulling the plug on work or are you going to scale back pick and choose a little? Look forward to hearing about your new boat is it a Moody or an Endurance 44????

Cheers morning coffee calls.. Frank
__________________

__________________
"Political correctness is a creeping sickness that knows no boundaries"
Lagoon4us is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 25-08-2012, 08:41   #123
Registered User
 
rcmpegasus's Avatar

Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: San Diego & Port Townsend
Boat: Formosa 51 Ketch
Posts: 143
Images: 1
Send a message via Skype™ to rcmpegasus
I guess the loss of speed due to weight and drag of thruster does not matter to most cruisers. The ice maker and rum added together weigh more than the entire bow thruster and when properly applied negate any concern on vessel speed.
__________________
Bob Mathews
S/V Pegasus
rcmpegasus is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 25-08-2012, 08:48   #124
Registered User

Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: Fethiye Turkey
Boat: Lagoon 440
Posts: 3,164
Re: Hmmmm - Bowthrusters ??

Quote:
Originally Posted by rcmpegasus View Post
I guess the loss of speed due to weight and drag of thruster does not matter to most cruisers. The ice maker and rum added together weigh more than the entire bow thruster and when properly applied negate any concern on vessel speed.
Correct particularly the rum, unless transferred to a spare water tank then there's a great saving in glass..
__________________
"Political correctness is a creeping sickness that knows no boundaries"
Lagoon4us is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 25-08-2012, 09:47   #125
Registered User
 
captainKJ's Avatar

Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: 3rd wave passed the sea wall
Boat: private yacht always moving
Posts: 1,388
Re: Hmmmm - Bowthrusters ??

Quote:
Originally Posted by IslandHopper View Post
Yep, lashed out again about 8 months ago.......it's only money hey...

I wonder what captainKJ will say when he finds out i am having a bowthruster fitted as we speak, or that all the work boats i drive have at least three thrusters fitted.......no doubt i'm a liability......

Glad to hear the beer is bearable and you are not being subjected to too much hardship......
How many thruster?????

Probably bow and stern on a 44 foot sailboat????
getting your DP also???

you will get so used to using the thrusters that you will forget how to maneuver with the engines and rudders

I am sooooo bad. how many HP for the bow??/ personally i would go for a 25HP, never know when you might need it.

add in a 35 on the stern and you can go sideways in 6 foot seas and 30 knots of wind.

I have driven the 280 mud boats with 3 thrusters and dual engines, they were fun to drive,, have not done 4 yet
__________________
captainKJ is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 25-08-2012, 10:08   #126
Registered User
 
captainKJ's Avatar

Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: 3rd wave passed the sea wall
Boat: private yacht always moving
Posts: 1,388
Re: Hmmmm - Bowthrusters ??

I better stop while I can still visit the forum

__________________
captainKJ is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 25-08-2012, 10:18   #127
Registered User

Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: Fethiye Turkey
Boat: Lagoon 440
Posts: 3,164
Re: Hmmmm - Bowthrusters ??

So why bother with comments simply because someone has an alternate view to yours?
Cheers
__________________
"Political correctness is a creeping sickness that knows no boundaries"
Lagoon4us is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 25-08-2012, 12:29   #128
Registered User
 
Auspicious's Avatar

Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: Chesapeake Bay
Boat: HR 40
Posts: 1,793
Send a message via Skype™ to Auspicious
Re: Hmmmm - Bowthrusters ??

Quote:
Originally Posted by rcmpegasus View Post
I guess the loss of speed due to weight and drag of thruster does not matter to most cruisers. The ice maker and rum added together weigh more than the entire bow thruster and when properly applied negate any concern on vessel speed.
What about all the rum and snacks you could store in the space the thruster takes up? *grin*
__________________
S/V Auspicious
AuspiciousWorks
Beware cut and paste sailors
Auspicious is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 25-08-2012, 12:34   #129
Resin Head
 
minaret's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Seattle WA
Boat: Nauticat
Posts: 7,199
Images: 52
Re: Hmmmm - Bowthrusters ??

I think most cruisers considering a thruster retrofit would be better served by purchasing a Max Prop. Costs much less money, and the 50% increase in thrust in reverse gives you much better braking ability and creates a stronger propwalk that works almost like a thruster (in one direction). With a little practice and planning I think a Max Prop adds more close quarters maneuverability than a thruster for way less money. And it actually increases your performance under sail instead of decreasing it.
__________________
minaret is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 25-08-2012, 12:44   #130
Registered User
 
Auspicious's Avatar

Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: Chesapeake Bay
Boat: HR 40
Posts: 1,793
Send a message via Skype™ to Auspicious
Re: Hmmmm - Bowthrusters ??

We're sailing to Crisfield MD for the watermen's docking competition. Not expecting to see any bow thrusters.
__________________
S/V Auspicious
AuspiciousWorks
Beware cut and paste sailors
Auspicious is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 25-08-2012, 18:47   #131
Senior Cruiser
 
IslandHopper's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: Bundaberg Queensland/Lake Bolac Victoria, Australia
Boat: 45ft Ketch
Posts: 1,196
Re: Hmmmm - Bowthrusters ??

Quote:
Originally Posted by captainKJ View Post
How many thruster?????
Just one in the bow why ?

getting your DP also???
You keep harping on about DP but what do you really know about it ? I myself have an Unlimited DP ticket issued by the Nautical Institute, what do you have again ? where did you do your Basic and Simulator courses ? what system would you suggest i install 1,2 or 3 ?

you will get so used to using the thrusters that you will forget how to maneuver with the engines and rudders
Absolute rubbish! i have used nearly all types of propulsion and chopped and changed between them all my boating life and NEVER forgot the basics, or lost the skill to use them when the need arises, whether that be driving a 120m DSV a 70m Anchor Handler or a 44ft Sailboat, it's all relative......or is the real issue here that you lack the ability to adjust to a given situation and believe others must be the same....

I am sooooo bad. how many HP for the bow??/ personally i would go for a 25HP, never know when you might need it.

add in a 35 on the stern and you can go sideways in 6 foot seas and 30 knots of wind.

I have driven the 280 mud boats with 3 thrusters and dual engines, they were fun to drive,
Ya gonna have to do better than that to impress me buddy...
Really, i think we have a few "legends in their own lunchbreaks" occupying this thread......just sayin'
__________________
Adventure before Dementia.
John....
IslandHopper is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 26-08-2012, 03:12   #132
Senior Cruiser
 
Kenomac's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: Somewhere in the Adriatic Sea
Boat: Oyster 53 Cutter
Posts: 8,510
Re: Hmmmm - Bowthrusters ??

I'd just like to add one thought which I don't think has been mentioned regarding bowthrusters. I've had a 45ft sailboat without a thruster, and now our current boat has one. I tend to use it sparingly for two reasons. 1) You never want to become too dependent on it; it's important to maintain your docking skills. 2) A bowthruster cannot be used for continuously service; it can only be used in short bursts to make minor corrections. The reason for this being the electric motor is either 100% on (full power) or off and this has a tendency to overheat the electric motor or drain the battery if used in a continuous manner. They don't work like the ones you see on a cruise ship.

I've seen this happen several times, where a sailor is attempting to dock his boat in a situation he might otherwise choose to do differently or avoid like in high winds, but knows he has the bowthruster.... so the attempt is made thinking the device can get him out of trouble. He then finds the bowthruster is incapable of assisting in the docking procedure. Now in panic mode as the boat is being driven into the rocks or breakwater, he finds that the bowthruster is no longer functional due to the battery being drained or the electric motor having quit due to overheating of triggering the electric breaker.

The bottom line: Bowthrusters are nice to have, but don't rely on them too much.
__________________
Kenomac is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 26-08-2012, 03:31   #133
Registered User

Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: Fethiye Turkey
Boat: Lagoon 440
Posts: 3,164
Re: Hmmmm - Bowthrusters ??

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kenomac View Post
I'd just like to add one thought which I don't think has been mentioned regarding bowthrusters. I've had a 45ft sailboat without a thruster, and now our current boat has one. I tend to use it sparingly for two reasons. 1) You never want to become too dependent on it; it's important to maintain your docking skills. 2) A bowthruster cannot be used for continuously service; it can only be used in short bursts to make minor corrections. The reason for this being the electric motor is either 100% on (full power) or off and this has a tendency to overheat the electric motor or drain the battery if used in a continuous manner. They don't work like the ones you see on a cruise ship.

I've seen this happen several times, where a sailor is attempting to dock his boat in a situation he might otherwise choose to do differently or avoid like in high winds, but knows he has the bowthruster.... so the attempt is made thinking the device can get him out of trouble. He then finds the bowthruster is incapable of assisting in the docking procedure. Now in panic mode as the boat is being driven into the rocks or breakwater, he finds that the bowthruster is no longer functional due to the battery being drained or the electric motor having quit due to overheating of triggering the electric breaker.

The bottom line: Bowthrusters are nice to have, but don't rely on them too much.
Same as all things on anything marine, anchor winches only ever throw breakers when 1 metre clear of the bottom, injector bypasses only stick and flood the injectors causing shutdown when 1 metre from the mooring pile.

All these things are tools relying on them is courting disappointment, as i said previously i've sailed to my mooring piles and set anchors under sail.

Don't agree about forgetting skills i can still ride a bike and i'm 59. You really need to see Europe and their mooring density before you discard their addition, i for one am quite shocked, i agree on using as a correction to windage and not continous and i also point out i arm the thruster only when occasion calls, ie swimmers in water,mooring lines like cobwebs.

There are other places than USA, other marinas not quite the hometown marina there is also language barriers where no assistance can be asked for they simply don't kapiche!!!!
__________________
"Political correctness is a creeping sickness that knows no boundaries"
Lagoon4us is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 26-08-2012, 03:32   #134
Moderator
 
Dockhead's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Cowes (Winter), Baltic (Summer) (the boat!); somewhere in the air (me!)
Boat: Cutter-Rigged Moody 54
Posts: 19,735
Re: Hmmmm - Bowthrusters ??

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kenomac View Post
I'd just like to add one thought which I don't think has been mentioned regarding bowthrusters. I've had a 45ft sailboat without a thruster, and now our current boat has one. I tend to use it sparingly for two reasons. 1) You never want to become too dependent on it; it's important to maintain your docking skills. 2) A bowthruster cannot be used for continuously service; it can only be used in short bursts to make minor corrections. The reason for this being the electric motor is either 100% on (full power) or off and this has a tendency to overheat the electric motor or drain the battery if used in a continuous manner. They don't work like the ones you see on a cruise ship.

I've seen this happen several times, where a sailor is attempting to dock his boat in a situation he might otherwise choose to do differently or avoid like in high winds, but knows he has the bowthruster.... so the attempt is made thinking the device can get him out of trouble. He then finds the bowthruster is incapable of assisting in the docking procedure. Now in panic mode as the boat is being driven into the rocks or breakwater, he finds that the bowthruster is no longer functional due to the battery being drained or the electric motor having quit due to overheating of triggering the electric breaker.

The bottom line: Bowthrusters are nice to have, but don't rely on them too much.
A bowthruster, like any other system on a boat, can be used correctly or can be used incorrectly, and requires some knowledge and skill to use effectively. They are not intended for, suitable for, of capable of driving the boat, like in the case described here ( ". . . as the boat is being driven onto the rocks . . ."). Neither are the made only for "small corrections". They are made to apply lateral force to the bow for various purposes which have been discussed above. Usually in shortish bursts -- I guess I almost never use mine for more than three or four seconds at a time.

A clumsy, unskilled sailor with a bow thruster is going to be just as clumsy and unskilled without it -- it really won't make much difference. And if you're a skillful, good sailor, and suddenly acquire a bow thruster, you will eventually figure out how to use it effectively -- and you will learn to do things you can't do without it. Acquiring a bow thruster will not make a good, skillful sailor suddenly into a bad or lazy one.
__________________
Dockhead is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 26-08-2012, 04:09   #135
Registered User
 
captainKJ's Avatar

Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: 3rd wave passed the sea wall
Boat: private yacht always moving
Posts: 1,388
Re: Hmmmm - Bowthrusters ??

Quote:
Originally Posted by IslandHopper View Post
Really, i think we have a few "legends in their own lunchbreaks" occupying this thread......just sayin'

sometimes my humor is taken wrong,,,, so enough said, not trying to impress anybody,

__________________

__________________
captainKJ is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes Rate This Thread
Rate This Thread:

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off




Copyright 2002- Social Knowledge, LLC All Rights Reserved.

All times are GMT -7. The time now is 18:09.


Google+
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Social Knowledge Networks
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.

ShowCase vBulletin Plugins by Drive Thru Online, Inc.