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Old 21-04-2015, 11:56   #16
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Re: help me with buying a blue water yacht

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Originally Posted by bfiegener View Post
Sailboat Reviews of Offshore Cruising Yachts : Bluewaterboats.org

If you haven't already done so, check out this link. It was useful for me when I was researching blue water boats. I think it pretty much list them all.

good luck.
bill
Very interesting site (even if they don't list my boat yet).

Thanks for the link!
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Old 21-04-2015, 12:03   #17
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Re: help me with buying a blue water yacht

I have never sailed on a tartan but a friend of mine has a 37 tartan next me and he alreadt on his second circumnavigation and second wife but he loves the boat says its fast and comfortable in a seaway and points well.
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Old 21-04-2015, 12:05   #18
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Re: help me with buying a blue water yacht

To be honest, Dash, it sounds like you're getting a little ahead of yourself. I'm usually the cheerleader saying "go for it!" but you certainly don't lack for enthusiasm.

Instead, I'll take the counter-point. It's great that you want to buy a boat and sail long distances solo. This is a worthy challenge and I have no doubt that you can accomplish it. But...

You seem to be very focused on the boat. In many ways, the boat doesn't matter that much. People have done trips on all sorts of boats that suit their own personality, preferences, and budget (see link below for a film by a guy in the Caribbean on a 28' boat).

What you need most is energy, smarts, and a stick-to-it attitude when things get a bit dodgy.

Second, you need sailing skills and experience. You can probably get enough in a solid year or two of intense weekend and holiday sailing. You can shortcut this by doing formal training or take a bit longer by finding mentors and figuring it out by yourself.

Third, you need a boat and all the gear attached to said boat.

This is a thread about boats, so maybe you're well on your way on item 2, but if not, please think about it. Youthful enthusiasm won't keep you out of harm's way, especially if you're out there on your own.

I'm strongly of the opinion that most people should buy a 22-28' boat first for at least a season before buying a larger boat. You'll learn a ton and sell it for about what you paid for it. Why wait until November? Buy a small boat now and go sailing. You'll get to your goal of having enough skill to survive and have fun that much faster. If you miss the austral winter, you'll miss all the good heavy weather to learn in!

28 feet film
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Old 21-04-2015, 15:01   #19
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Re: help me with buying a blue water yacht

Konrad,

You've been given some sage advice here. And here's the best advice I can give you:

Purchase a copy of Beth Leonard's "The Voyager's Handbook" (Hard Back) and study it well.

You can get it here in Oz easily enough. Do NOT buy and old one as some of the advice has changed over time with respect to technology. Spend the extra dollars on new as it's a great investment. You will read it many times over the years.

This book will provide solid advice based on years of cruising experience both hers and from others. It will give you guidleines on what to buy, what to look for and what you can improve.

Single-handing is not easy and the only thing you can do is to improve it is experience. Experience takes time. At 25 you have time on your side but if you are the average 25 year old you are impatient to get to your goal. Be patient. You are embarking on something where inexperience can get you killed and/or endanger others. Which brings me to my second piece of advice...

Go talk to plenty of other boaties and see if anyone is wanting crew. Middle Harbour YC is a good place to start. Lots of sailing done from there and often skippers looking for crew.

Just finishing the same journey as you - buying my last (I hope) boat. My needs are different to yours but the principles of going about buying a boat remain the same. Get back to me if you need some help. I'm in Melbourne so not too far away and just a phone call if you want to chat. PM me if you want to exchange phone numbers.

Wish you well, fella
David
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Old 21-04-2015, 15:06   #20
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Re: help me with buying a blue water yacht

Great film! Go small, go now.
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Old 21-04-2015, 15:06   #21
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Thumbs up Re: help me with buying a blue water yacht

I can identify with your enthusiasm - I fell in love with sailing in my fifties when i was given a wreck of a 12 ft dinghy to renovate. I now sail a 36ft Bowman ketch, in which I am about to set off for the Azores from Ireland. My first cruiser was an Achilles 24, which I sailed in club races and coastal cruising for three years before I bought Calimbo for longer voyages.

the Achilles was a sturdy little boat, but needed a great deal of work to bring to reasonable condition. This was a very useful experience as it taught me what to expect in terms of the work involved in renovating an old boat, and what sort of boat I wanted for fulfilling my larger dreams. It is better to buy a boat that someone else has renovated/ maintained well, than to renovate a wreck - you never get your money back for the latter! It is, however essential, especially for a single-hander, to become adept at maintenance and have your hand on every inch of your boat. You will need to repair it where there is no one else to do it.

In choosing a boat, I looked for something sturdy, long keeled, and big enough to have some comforts - fridge, freezer, heating, shower etc, while still manageable single handed. I looked at a number of 1970's fibre glass boats (wooden boats are beautiful, but too much maintenance) such as Nicholson 35's, Vancouver 34's, Contessa 32's. I ended up with a boat that is perfect for me, a 1976 Bowman 36 ketch, which had been well maintained, and fitted with Selden in mast reefing masts in 1998.

In mast reefing rigs may not be as fast, or close winded, due to the lack of roach on the main, but the plus is the ability to reef each and every sail without leaving the cockpit. the ketch rig also gives great range of alternatives to balance the sails to suit conditions.

I am a great believer in learning to sail in a dinghy - buy an old laser or the like! Every time you make a mistake, you're swimming, so you learn fast. If you can sail a dinghy, you can sail a cruiser, but not the other way around. A bit of racing around the cans is also a great way to learn. Just going for a wander in a keel boat, you can spend a long time on the water without learning anything you really need to know.

There is a book I would recommend, by two Swedish guys (Yanne Larsson & Calle Andersson), called Brave or Stupid. They decided to sail round the world, having had no sailing experience at all, but gave themselves five years to prepare. People have set off with no experience and simply learned by doing, the question posed in the above title comes to mind!

The best of luck to you, and whatever you do, don't give up the dream!
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Old 21-04-2015, 15:23   #22
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Re: help me with buying a blue water yacht

Welcome to CF, Ketchcalimbo! Great first post.

In mast furling vs slab reefing is one of those great debates. I can (slab) reef my main in 30 seconds from the cockpit with 2 line reefing.
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Old 21-04-2015, 15:50   #23
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Re: help me with buying a blue water yacht

A great thread---good intelligent questions and thoughtful helpful answers. I wish the OP well and hope to hear more from him. I'll bet lots of folks on here wish they were 25 again but remember what Shaw said "The trouble with youth is it is wasted on the young". And there are old sailors and bold sailors but no old and bold sailors...don't know who said that...
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Old 21-04-2015, 16:00   #24
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Re: help me with buying a blue water yacht

Konrad,

IMO, you will become a better sailor if you start small. The smaller yachts are far more responsive, so you learn quicker. If you consider someone like Jessica Watson, she had years of dinghy racing experience prior to her circumnavigation.

We have Ozzie friends who sailed from Newcastle to Canada in a Top Hat, which is a 24 footer, and return, the point being that even that little old boat was adequate for the journey. Ages at the time: 22, the man, 18, the woman. But, again, he had been sailing for 7 years by then. Knew American couples who circumnavigated in a 27 footer, and a 26 footer (with 2 children).
It is uncommon these days to do it in such small boats, but, in fact, it is very doable, albeit, bigger is usually more comfortable.

It is not that you cannot follow your proposed program, but that you will maximize your chances of a successful adventure if you approach it in stages. Start sailing on other people's boats, start learning the ropes, and refine your thinking, rather than using "internet wisdom." The real point is getting some experience to help keep you safe at sea. There will be a whole lot that you will learn from experience and experimenting that you will not be taught in a class.

Ann
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Old 21-04-2015, 16:26   #25
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Re: help me with buying a blue water yacht

There have been many discussions on this forum about the topic of "Blue Water boats."
The following link will take you to a custom search page with many different threads you could read and those have hundreds if not thousands of comments on the topic.

Good luck on your search, research, and making you dreams come true.

A Google Custom Search of this site:
blue water bluewater - Google Search
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Old 21-04-2015, 16:54   #26
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Re: help me with buying a blue water yacht

Don't waste time with an interim boat. Buy your blue water boat and learn on it. Look at the Morgan 383 and 384. It has a perfect underbody for blue water cruising, including a protected rudder with a full skeg and protected prop in an aperture. Easy boat to single hand and seakindly hull with more speed for faster passages than most full keeled boats. They are available in your price range. I did a lot of research before buying mine and I sailed her solo for years (in my 70's) before getting something larger which I now regret. Also, I have owned 5 blue water boats in the past 40 years, 4 with wheel steering, one with tiller, and they all steered prefectly with a wind vane. The tiller boat was no better. The windvane doesn't know or care what type of steering it is hooked up to.
Just do it.
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Old 21-04-2015, 17:50   #27
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Re: help me with buying a blue water yacht

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ketchcalimbo View Post
I am a great believer in learning to sail in a dinghy - buy an old laser or the like! Every time you make a mistake, you're swimming, so you learn fast. If you can sail a dinghy, you can sail a cruiser, but not the other way around. A bit of racing around the cans is also a great way to learn.
Here, here! Agree completely. It's the way to learn.

Little boat, big mistakes... oh well.
Big boat, big mistakes... Oh Hell!
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Old 21-04-2015, 17:55   #28
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Re: help me with buying a blue water yacht

Read some of John Kretschmer's books, Serious Ocean is a good one, or go sailing with him. Lots of advice on good blue water boats.


John Kretschmer Sailing - Training Passages - Workshops - Presentations - Expeditions - Writing/Photography
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Old 21-04-2015, 18:52   #29
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Re: help me with buying a blue water yacht

I think all the boats you named are fine.

Sadler may be the fastest (it is also the only unsinkable in the tree), S&S will have least space and W32 will have most volume and most classic looks.

Try to envision which of them fits your personal "me sailing" image best. Some fall for speed, others for practical matters, others for looks. As you are looking at three good designs, get the one that will make you feel like going sailing (or actually going sailing) every time you look at her.

Fair winds,

b.
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Old 21-04-2015, 19:42   #30
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Re: help me with buying a blue water yacht

We were not much older than you when we got the dream of sailing off shore -had no money and never sailed a real sail boat -basically a raft with a mast!! but we had a dream we were determined to live. We bought an Endurance 35 hull and deck, moved aboard and over the next 4 years we built the boat around us in the water at a government dock. We taught ourselves to sail by reading those books someone already mentioned and in the summer of '82 headed south to California and Mexico, milk run to New Zealand up the western Pacific to Japan then home to Canada 3 years later. In '94 we took off with 6 and 7 year old kids in the same Endurance and did a 7 year circumnavigation. We still sail the heck out of the old girl 37 years later and have never wished we had a bigger or faster boat. So I recommend a 32 to 35 foot fiberglass boat, cutter rigged, full keel with cut away forefoot built before they knew how strong fiberglass is, and keep it simple - if I can't fix it I don't want it! Our Aries work flawlessly via a vertical tiller in the lazerette to a cable quadrant - opened a ball valve to bypass the hydraulic steering. An inexpensive auto pilot also moved this vertical tiller and a handle could be added to the top giving an emergency tiller if the hydraulics failed. We have had friends with West Sail 32's, they liked them and could keep up with us in all but beating conditions - with good luck and proper planning you don't have to beat very often!
Cruising will cost everything you have, if you don't have much it doesn't cost much! Good luck with living your dream (and I hope you find a lover to share the dream with!! - The most important "addition" to our boat was a compatible partner who wanted to be there as much as I did.)
Cheers Rob
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