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Old 17-09-2016, 23:20   #1
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Help me think - 1977 41 Morgan OI Ketch

The brain power on this forum could probably solve cancer if it wanted to...

I'm hoping to borrow some brain cells and opinion with this one:

I am in the process of Buying a 1977 41 Morgan Out Island. It is impeccable aesthetically (In a 1977 kind of way)... but is a pretty bare setup. It has good sails, a good perkins motor (seemingly)... 75% of the parts to an autopilot, and a recent chartplotter(2010+) but without any throughhull sensors...

If i said I was paying 30k and had 20k to upgrade it, what would you say? Not enough to upgrade? What would you upgrade first? What do you think we would have to have electronically to make our way to south florida from Mississippi?

any input on the type of vessel would be more than appreciated, and any input on the madness of buying a boat would be appreciated.

We have a survey tuesday...
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Old 18-09-2016, 06:09   #2
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Re: Help me think - 1977 41 Morgan OI Ketch

Well if you aren't upgrading before moving her I would make sure you have good ground tackle.
1.Tow boat US towing insurance,
2. A way to recharge batteries, either on board generator or a Honda 2000 and ensure the batt charger works.
3. A good plotter with high detail navionics even a tablet with jeppesen plan2 Nav and active captain is great to have.
4.Extra fuel and fuel jugs, fuel filters and eng oil is a good idea too. Not sure your long range plans so its hard to say what's the best upgrades but solar, good dinghy w Engine, and a water maker can set year u back 10-15k pretty quick.

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Old 18-09-2016, 06:36   #3
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Re: Help me think - 1977 41 Morgan OI Ketch

Not being a Debbie-downer but someone who has restored a similar vintage boat that I really love, you will perhaps need to budget more for restoration. Get a survey that is credible by someone who really specializes in older sailboats. There are plenty of jokes in the sailing world concerning the value of most surveys-so if you can't find someone that is a credited surveyor who has been recommended, find a local enthusiast that has a functioning boat of similar age and go from there. Of course you will still need a survey for most insurance companies, but at least you will know what you've got before you get to that point.


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Old 18-09-2016, 06:50   #4
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Re: Help me think - 1977 41 Morgan OI Ketch

Agree that first make sure all the boat basics are done.

- Rigging. How old is it? How are the chainplates and all the fittings, terminals, toggles, etc.

- Sails. How good are they? Just because they aren't falling apart doesn't mean they will set well and move you efficiently.

- Boat structure. Any water intrusion in the decks, bulkheads, etc? Hull/deck joint good.

- Engine. Have a very careful mechanical analysis outside the regular survey.

- Safety equipment. Life jackets, harness and tethers if you're going offshore, MOB gear, etc.

Upgrades? To some degree it will depend on what your boating plans are. If you're day sailing (D) or long distance cruising (C).

After the above, in more or less this order I would make sure you have a good, workable:

- depth sounder
- VHF
- power. good batteries and an appropriate way to charge them based on your boating plans and how much power you will use.
- navigation, either paper charts or chart plotter or both. radar depending on where you will cruise, local weather, etc.
- comforts. depends on your preferences but could be fridge, AC, hot water, generator
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Old 18-09-2016, 06:54   #5
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Re: Help me think - 1977 41 Morgan OI Ketch

If you have a reputable surveyor I would listen more to what he has to say than to what you can get off anonymous postings on a chat site.
The surveyors reputation is on the line.
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Old 18-09-2016, 07:01   #6
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Re: Help me think - 1977 41 Morgan OI Ketch

I think Skipmac has well covered the basic concerns.

I've been living aboard, cruising, maintaining and upgrading my 1973 Morgan Out Islands for 44 years. Use me,- ask any specifics. Your tasks have likely been things I've dealt with before and I'm eager to share.
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Old 18-09-2016, 07:04   #7
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Re: Help me think - 1977 41 Morgan OI Ketch

If you're serious about the Morgan, join the facebook group. Most of us there have done extensive work on our OI's you'll love it as long as you aren't in a hurry to go 8 knots!! I've had mine for 2 seasons now and just put her in the water in august for the first time! we replace the engine, rigging ( standing and running) electrical (on going! I've been through 500ft of wire so far) new Batteries, new plumbing, replaced the heads with composting units, removed a ton of old thruhulls that we don't have use for! We've probably spent $25k so far on the restore and still have cushions to do, a new furler to buy, solarpanels, paint, and a chartplotter. but I can't complain the boat was practically free and I knew what I was getting into!


They're solid boats, but like any boat that is close to 40 years old, they are going to require a fair amount of work. If you don't have the skill or desire to do the work, paying someone to do it for you will be financial ruin!


jump in, they're good boats, but make sure your eyes are wide open.

costs so far. ( in CAD)
standing rigging: 3800
rebuilt yanmar 4jh2e with all running gear $8000
wiring $1000
electrical fixtures and electronics $1600
plumbing $2000 including $800 for C-head
fiberglass work $1500
paint $ 1200
stove etc. $900

and list goes on.
But its tons of fun if you like putting things back together!
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Old 18-09-2016, 09:57   #8
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Re: Help me think - 1977 41 Morgan OI Ketch

Depends on what you want to do with the Morgan. As a liveaboard, great boat. As a sailing machine, you had better try it first to see if you like it. Not everyone's taste in a sailing vessel.
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Old 18-09-2016, 10:10   #9
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Re: Help me think - 1977 41 Morgan OI Ketch

Quote:
Originally Posted by neophyte2015 View Post
The brain power on this forum could probably solve cancer if it wanted to...

I'm hoping to borrow some brain cells and opinion with this one:

I am in the process of Buying a 1977 41 Morgan Out Island. It is impeccable aesthetically (In a 1977 kind of way)... but is a pretty bare setup. It has good sails, a good perkins motor (seemingly)... 75% of the parts to an autopilot, and a recent chartplotter(2010+) but without any throughhull sensors...

If i said I was paying 30k and had 20k to upgrade it, what would you say? Not enough to upgrade? What would you upgrade first? What do you think we would have to have electronically to make our way to south florida from Mississippi?

any input on the type of vessel would be more than appreciated, and any input on the madness of buying a boat would be appreciated.

We have a survey tuesday...
I love that boat, glad to here it's coming back to life
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Old 18-09-2016, 10:31   #10
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Re: Help me think - 1977 41 Morgan OI Ketch

What do you HAVE to have to navigate around Florida? A hand held battery powered GPS and just about any old chart will do. Add a depth sounder, a pair of binoculars, and some polarized sunglasses if you want real luxury. A compass might come in handy if you want to go out of sight of land.
Thats all you HAVE to have. Anything more comes under NICE to have. Where you draw the line between them depends on your priorities and pocket book.
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Old 18-09-2016, 10:50   #11
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Re: Help me think - 1977 41 Morgan OI Ketch

My advice is free, and probably worth what you paid:

Fix the autopilot.
Add a depth sounder.
Get a simple, cheap GPS and a backup to it.
Get charts for the gulf.
Go.
It will probably be a close reach for most of the trip to south Florida, and you'll catch some nasty weather on the way. Learn, experience, enjoy.

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Old 18-09-2016, 11:00   #12
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Re: Help me think - 1977 41 Morgan OI Ketch

Quote:
Originally Posted by quill View Post
If you have a reputable surveyor I would listen more to what he has to say than to what you can get off anonymous postings on a chat site.
The surveyors reputation is on the line.
Even reputable surveyors miss a lot of stuff. I've participated in dozens of surveys and I can't think of any that didn't miss stuff, in many cases significant stuff.
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Old 18-09-2016, 11:01   #13
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Re: Help me think - 1977 41 Morgan OI Ketch

Quote:
Originally Posted by Hudson Force View Post
I think Skipmac has well covered the basic concerns.

I've been living aboard, cruising, maintaining and upgrading my 1973 Morgan Out Islands for 44 years. Use me,- ask any specifics. Your tasks have likely been things I've dealt with before and I'm eager to share.
Well I think Hudson Force should have the definitive answers. I would speculate he has as many years and miles in an OI 41 as just about anyone.
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Old 18-09-2016, 11:51   #14
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Help me think - 1977 41 Morgan OI Ketch

I bought an older basically bare of anything equipment wise boat, yes I am adding lots of equipment, but a boat that has essentially no cruising gear may be a boat that has been lightly used at most, likely a beach house or dock queen.
If the interior is in very good condition, you may have found a boat that has been very lightly used and has therefore little wear. Of course years take their tole too, but so does hard use.
Don't discount a boat that is lightly equipped, do however realize that you will be spending a lot equipping it, but then you get to pick what you want, and it's all new and since you installed it, you know where it's drawing power, where the wire runs are etc.

Of course depending on your expected use, you may not need the latest greatest Radar and AIS etc, but you will need good ground tackle, something I find rare in almost all boats I see, what there is is usually seriously undersized.


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Old 18-09-2016, 11:57   #15
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Re: Help me think - 1977 41 Morgan OI Ketch

Quote:
Originally Posted by neophyte2015 View Post
The brain power on this forum could probably solve cancer if it wanted to...

I'm hoping to borrow some brain cells and opinion with this one:

I am in the process of Buying a 1977 41 Morgan Out Island. It is impeccable aesthetically (In a 1977 kind of way)... but is a pretty bare setup. It has good sails, a good perkins motor (seemingly)... 75% of the parts to an autopilot, and a recent chartplotter(2010+) but without any throughhull sensors...

If i said I was paying 30k and had 20k to upgrade it, what would you say? Not enough to upgrade? What would you upgrade first? What do you think we would have to have electronically to make our way to south florida from Mississippi?

any input on the type of vessel would be more than appreciated, and any input on the madness of buying a boat would be appreciated.

We have a survey tuesday...
Ask after Tuesday.
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