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Old 09-02-2016, 06:37   #106
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Re: Help me spend $350 K on a boat

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Originally Posted by HappyMdRSailor View Post
The buy at 250, add 100k is the best advice here...
I would be buying at $325k and adding $25k for stuff not on the boat.

$25k is a lot of money... unless u bought a piece of junk.


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Old 09-02-2016, 06:39   #107
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Re: Help me spend $350 K on a boat

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That's exactly my concern with cruising a CAT. How would I get my sailing "fix"? You know, when the moon is high, the wind is up, the helm is balanced, the decks are at that perfect angle, and the bow is slicing through the waves like butter.

Haha. Good question. I guess on a cat the moon will still be as high, the wind will be the same, the helm as balanced and you may have to lean to one side about 20 degrees to simulate 'that perfect angle'
But as you said, you're about to charter a cat, you will soon find out if it gives you your fix. My fix is sailing upwind, hiking or on trapeze and balancing the trim just with one rudder to keep the windward hull just clear of the water. That's not really possible on a cruising cat but I still manage to get a fix every sail
A couple of tips for your charter, In general sheet the main and jib hard (till the jib touches the spreaders for upwind and aim for around 40 degrees apparent wind angle. Off the wind the old saying 'if in doubt, let it out' especially applies to cruising cats. Ease the sheets as much as possible till the main is just touching the stays and the top of the jib is fluttering for best performance on most charter cats. Hell you can even slide the jib cars foreword if you're feeling particularly energetic off the wind ⛵️
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Old 09-02-2016, 11:15   #108
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Re: Help me spend $350 K on a boat

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Originally Posted by monte View Post
Haha. Good question. I guess on a cat the moon will still be as high, the wind will be the same, the helm as balanced and you may have to lean to one side about 20 degrees to simulate 'that perfect angle'
But as you said, you're about to charter a cat, you will soon find out if it gives you your fix. My fix is sailing upwind, hiking or on trapeze and balancing the trim just with one rudder to keep the windward hull just clear of the water. That's not really possible on a cruising cat but I still manage to get a fix every sail
A couple of tips for your charter, In general sheet the main and jib hard (till the jib touches the spreaders for upwind and aim for around 40 degrees apparent wind angle. Off the wind the old saying 'if in doubt, let it out' especially applies to cruising cats. Ease the sheets as much as possible till the main is just touching the stays and the top of the jib is fluttering for best performance on most charter cats. Hell you can even slide the jib cars foreword if you're feeling particularly energetic off the wind ⛵️
It would seem getting a hull clear of the water would get the adrenaline flowing. "if in doubt, let it out" seems like the best wisdom. I've flow amas a lot higher than just out of the water. Having the GM go neg. on a tri scares me less than a cat. If it gets white knuckled let it out, either way.
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Old 09-02-2016, 13:19   #109
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Re: Help me spend $350 K on a boat

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It would seem getting a hull clear of the water would get the adrenaline flowing. "if in doubt, let it out" seems like the best wisdom. I've flow amas a lot higher than just out of the water. Having the GM go neg. on a tri scares me less than a cat. If it gets white knuckled let it out, either way.

Great advice. I watched video of the new Gunboat G4 Timbalero capsizing with all professional crew during it's big Antigua Race Week debut. Someone didn't ease the mainsheet .......
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Old 09-02-2016, 13:47   #110
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Re: Help me spend $350 K on a boat

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Originally Posted by MarkJ View Post
I would be buying at $325k and adding $25k for stuff not on the boat.

$25k is a lot of money... unless u bought a piece of junk.


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Don't tell that to some of the people on CF. I recall a while ago someone was budgeting $30K for a used mast. Don't recall if the boom and rigging was included. Probably not.

Last year (or may be 2014) on YW there was an early 80s Kaufman 47, a well built knock off of Swan 47, originally listed in CA for around $100K, with subsequent drops in price and was purchased for about $50K (may be even less) as it lingered on the market for a while. Admittedly it may have had the usual teak deck issues, but even with those it probably would not take more than $100K, $150K tops to bring her to Bristol shape and ready for circumnavigation (unless of course she would be refit at a yard which charges $30K for a used mast). That's only about $200K for a monster of a boat. My marine pro buddy was drooling over her when I sent him the info and was ready to fly in to make an offer but got stuck on some delivery and it was sold in the meantime.

Funny how these often turn out - a boat is on the market for X number of years and I don't know about her. As soon as I stumble across the ad it sells within short time.
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Old 10-02-2016, 06:45   #111
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Re: Help me spend $350 K on a boat

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Originally Posted by MarkJ View Post
I would be buying at $325k and adding $25k for stuff not on the boat.

$25k is a lot of money... unless u bought a piece of junk.


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The money you have to add as much to do with the age of the boat and how well adapted the boat is to voyaging.

If the OP buys a voyage boat that it is entirely prepared for extensive travel and it is a recent boat than he may have to spend even less than that. If it is an old, once very expensive sailboat and therefore even today expensive, it is hard for him to know how much he will have to spend, but probably much more than 25k, to have it on the same condition as the much newer one.
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Old 10-02-2016, 08:05   #112
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Re: Help me spend $350 K on a boat

IMO this whole issue of new (newish) vs. old (older) at an equivalent price point (has to be, otherwise the comparison is not valid) is repeated over and over again in all other major buys a person makes. Is the brand new house better than a well restored 19 century Victorian? Is the new entry Corolla better than a 20-30 year old, then top of the line, Mercedes? Is new "made in 3rd world" suit from a discount chain better than a 5-10 year old top quality tailor made suit?

Of course it's easy to see that a brand new quality item is better than a 30 year old same quality item. But this is not proper choice as people who can afford new good stuff don't need to compare it with new so-so quality item or old good quality one. Myself given a choice of entry level or smaller sized new/newish boat and a larger older one for similar $$ I will always chose the older one as I am, having observed general deterioration of quality over my lifetime in practically everything that is mass marketed, not very keen on the new stuff in general. This is not new but has been going on for about 200 years when mass production and mass marketing replaced craft and small artisan based economy. The quality maker's and worker's wages are just too prohibitive for a mass production run so they have to rely on either low skill worker in a conveyor belt like production or dilute the quality of the materials or both (most likely). So by definition, everything else being equal the new anything is not built as well or by as well trained worker as the similar item built generations ago. Yes, technology is a factor but only where it is really needed or is the very reason of the item such as TVs, PCs, phones, etc. But even there older TVs, telephones or fridges would function well for dozens of years whereas new generation become obsolete or start malfunctioning in less than 5-6 years. MY old fridge lasted over 30 years and not a bin cracked or glass broken. The new one is less than 4 years old and already all bins are cracked or chipped and one glass shelf cracked and had to be replaced.

But a sailboat being nothing more than a tricked out piece of fiberglass hull can be easily updated by installing items which even on a newish boat have to be updated every 10 or so years - rigging, electronics, sails, etc. Other than aesthetics I just don't see the point, given a similar price range, to choose a newish smaller/lesser quality builder boat over an older larger well maintained better known brand name one. And my personal dislike for the plumb military ship style bows doesn't help either.
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Old 11-02-2016, 17:43   #113
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Re: Help me spend $350 K on a boat

ShackAttack. Are you at the Miami boat show? I took a pre show walk around the docks Wednesday and the boats on display are vast and varied. Seems a great place to compare and contrast new boats and a few older boats

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