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Old 22-11-2009, 04:02   #106
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I think its crackers to waste ones whole cruising career owning a boat solely so its safe in the 1 in 100 year storm.

Just get a normal boat, have a good time and if the wind blows put out as bloody paracute anchor!


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Old 22-11-2009, 10:09   #107
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Not sure thats the point Mark.
One can also say its "crackers" to own a boat that makes one feel .... unsafe.
Many that own heavier displacement boats do so for the feeling it gives them. Not to say its true or not. The evidence is not really there, one way or another.
One thing is true, is that there are many boats out there cruising, both small and large, heavy and light, and all in between.
Get the boat you like after some careful thought and research and then forget about the rest.
Personally I would never get a Beneteau. You have one. Neither one of us is right or wrong. I also would never get a cat, either a boat or the animal. Monohulls and dogs are for me.
Just go with what you like and be done with it.
Time will tell if it was the right choice or not.
Fair winds,
Bob
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Old 22-11-2009, 10:23   #108
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having sailed both --i way prefer the heavy displacement ketches to the performance cruiser as far as performing in heavy or moderately heavy weather--we didnt sail hurrycames--just tstorms..lol....i really missed my formosa on this trip...LOL....woulda been perfect.....
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Old 22-11-2009, 18:44   #109
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What it mighht mean, however, is that few, if any, single-handed crews sail their lighter displacement racers to their potential day in and day out. If they did, we might expect to see that reflected in a set of data such as these. But, alas, we do not.
Yep. I agree with that. (And thanks to Joli for his clarification.) Most boats are a lot tougher than most crews.

Our speed advantage as a 31' lightweight is most useful on medium hops we do in a cruising area, with favourable conditions en route (e.g. good wind on the stern but modest sea), or in lighter airs from any direction.

As waves build I start looking after the crew, the gear and the boat. If I push for the extra knot or ten, motions get more extreme and the admiral starts delivering a LONG monologue on living with seasickness!
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Old 23-11-2009, 05:36   #110
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Yep. I agree with that. (And thanks to Joli for his clarification.) Most boats are a lot tougher than most crews.

Our speed advantage as a 31' lightweight is most useful on medium hops we do in a cruising area, with favourable conditions en route (e.g. good wind on the stern but modest sea), or in lighter airs from any direction.

As waves build I start looking after the crew, the gear and the boat. If I push for the extra knot or ten, motions get more extreme and the admiral starts delivering a LONG monologue on living with seasickness!
Thanks for this observation. Also, my clarification: I meant "short-handed" sted "single-handed" crews.
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Old 23-11-2009, 12:33   #111
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Then there is the comfort, or lack of such, from the boat's movements in the seaway. Yesterday I had the luck of powering by a huge sample of boats - both cruising and racing (ARC start). So, the racers sailed verically, the cruisers bumped and rolled widely. What caught my attention were two boats - an older swan (probably mid 80'ies, about 45' long) and a Belliure 40(?). Belliure was power sailing and she did well. The Swan was sailing and from the deck of our cat she looked like the kind of hull shape / disp / rig to take you anywhere without rolling your teeth out of your jaws.

Worst - small '"cruising"-racers' - Hanse, Elan, and the smaller Oysters. The lighter ones rolling at very high Hz, the heavier ones less so but to angles that looked like excuse me and what has happened to your ballast???

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Old 23-11-2009, 17:41   #112
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Those are elapsed times. ....
They maybe elapsed times, but the difference between the Cruising Class and the Rally Class is that the Rally Class has to keep a log of their engine hours, while the Cruising does not. Probbaly not very meaningful performance numbers

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Old 23-11-2009, 19:41   #113
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From all reports it was a very good year to sail. The boats enjoyed a 1500 mile port tack reach in moderate breezes. I read somewhere most boats were under 10 hours engine time. Sounds like a great sail.

Here is a note from the Carib 1500 web site Sunday the 8th:

"Just an observation on this end -- the number of engine hours reported by boats in the fleet this year is exceptionally low when compared to years in the past. But why run the engine when you have so much favorable breeze?"


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They maybe elapsed times, but the difference between the Cruising Class and the Rally Class is that the Rally Class has to keep a log of their engine hours, while the Cruising does not. Probbaly not very meaningful performance numbers

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Old 23-11-2009, 20:30   #114
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One interpretation is that even heavyweights were near hull speed, and lighter boats - less rail meat - were not free of the wind enough to sail flat and stretch their legs.

I figure on ~1.2 knot speed advantage pushing on a beam reach, but I loose much of this if I want comfort in moderate seas. The rest comes from heeled LWL nearing my LOA. But put the same sea on the stern quarter, and I go flat & get 10+ in comfort.
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Old 23-11-2009, 20:46   #115
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One interpretation is that even heavyweights were near hull speed, and lighter boats - less rail meat - were not free of the wind enough to sail flat and stretch their legs.
One nice thing about heavy displacement is that there's no "Rail Meat".
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Old 23-11-2009, 21:03   #116
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One nice thing about heavy displacement is that there's no "Rail Meat".
So what do you eat when the cupboard gets bare?

Oops ... showing my Maori heritage ...
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Old 23-11-2009, 21:21   #117
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From all reports it was a very good year to sail. The boats enjoyed a 1500 mile port tack reach in moderate breezes. I read somewhere most boats were under 10 hours engine time. Sounds like a great sail.

Here is a note from the Carib 1500 web site Sunday the 8th:

"Just an observation on this end -- the number of engine hours reported by boats in the fleet this year is exceptionally low when compared to years in the past. But why run the engine when you have so much favorable breeze?"
Sounds like it was good sail that year where all boats did reasonably well. If you look at this years HaHa down the Baja peninsula, something like 3 boats out of 175 did the entire course without engine help.

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Old 23-11-2009, 22:22   #118
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So what do you eat when the cupboard gets bare?

Oops ... showing my Maori heritage ...
Crew, of course. They're just not on the rail
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Old 24-11-2009, 05:56   #119
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Crew, of course. They're just not on the rail
But, then they aren't properly sun dried!
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Old 24-11-2009, 08:42   #120
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But, then they aren't properly sun dried!
There is that.....
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