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Old 01-11-2016, 15:34   #16
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Re: Hard Dodger (Sprayhood) Illustrated Guide - Examples, Tips

when sailing my formosa is a dry boat when underway even in a good wind with appropriate swells.
i am adding a hard dodger with ipe framing and a hard bimini with davits and each with boom gallows for the booms for shelter of my coach house and companionway in sun and canes.
the bimini is for shelter in sun here in tropics.
i will be able to catch water in rainy season using each of these. i will be able to place a soft connector in port for shade and protection from sun.
solar panels will be placed on dodger and windgennies on each trailing corner of the dodger, out of the way of booms and sails.
i can think of no time i would wish to remove the dodger or bimini.
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Old 01-11-2016, 15:36   #17
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Re: Hard Dodger (Sprayhood) Illustrated Guide - Examples, Tips

A frequent mistake (IMO) in the design of hard dodgers is making them far too tall. The stated reason is usually a desire for standing headroom under them, something that is hardly necessary for either safety or comfort. The resulting structure is ugly, has greater windage and, as Snowy says, mandates the use of glass for decent forward vision, which in turn adds considerable weight and expense.

Van de Stadt and Steve Dashew both have the knack for useful and attractive dodgers, and should be studied before designing one for oneself.

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Old 01-11-2016, 15:45   #18
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Re: Hard Dodger (Sprayhood) Illustrated Guide - Examples, Tips

Jim,

I agree with you that many dodgers/spray hoods are too tall. The height should be such that a standing helms person can easily see the sails and water in front of the boat without looking through windows. It should also protect crew sitting under the cover and allow reasonably easy entry/exit from the companionway.

I prefer a hard top with soft (but robust) easily removed panels for front and sides. To me that is the best of both worlds.
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Old 01-11-2016, 15:59   #19
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Re: Hard Dodger (Sprayhood) Illustrated Guide - Examples, Tips

Quote:
Originally Posted by zeehag View Post
when sailing my formosa is a dry boat when underway even in a good wind with appropriate swells.
i am adding a hard dodger with ipe framing and a hard bimini with davits and each with boom gallows for the booms for shelter of my coach house and companionway in sun and canes.
the bimini is for shelter in sun here in tropics.
i will be able to catch water in rainy season using each of these. i will be able to place a soft connector in port for shade and protection from sun.
solar panels will be placed on dodger and windgennies on each trailing corner of the dodger, out of the way of booms and sails.
i can think of no time i would wish to remove the dodger or bimini.
ZEEHAG,
Thank you for adding your comment too. I had only a few minutes to post my OP, and naturally I left off several things. You mention "catching rain water" and that is something I wanted to add to the reasons as Hard Dodger may have some advantages.

When you do get your Formosa fixed up with the new dodger/bimini, I would be interested to see it.
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Old 01-11-2016, 16:00   #20
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Dodger and Bimini's

A lot of CF cruisers including myself have made Dodgers and Bimini's out of AZEK sheets.
.
Bimini
.
Stands up to harsh weather
.
Resists stains, scratches, and fading
.
Quick and easy installation
.
Resists mold, mildew, and moisture damage
.
No cupping, rotting, or splitting
.
Suitable for ground contact
.
UV protection inside and out
.
Does not require paint for protection, but easily accepts paint
.
Covered by a 25-year limited warranty
.
Available in White in Traditional finish
.
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Old 01-11-2016, 16:10   #21
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Re: Hard Dodger (Sprayhood) Illustrated Guide - Examples, Tips

I have a lot of Hard Dodger Spray Screen images in my files. I will post a few each day so we don't get overwhelmed with photos. Here are a few to start. Many more to come in coming days/weeks.

Part of my plan was to include a sequential number for each dodger photo I post, so folks can easily refer to it if they have comments regarding the different designs. I will try to keep up with this, and if you (anyone) decides to post a new photo or example, simply look at the last number posted and add a number. No hard fast rule about this, but I think it might help once there are dozens of designs uploaded in this thread.

Dodger Example #4
(See, I skipped because others have posted a few examples before this one.)

This one appears to be fiberglass or some composite with multiple glass panels (windows).

NOTICE this dodger design #4 has a smooth hard top and lacks any handholds on the top or sides. This may pose a risk as crew move from the cockpit to side decks going forward along the cabin or returning to the cockpit. I would prefer to see robust long stainless tubing handholds (so one can slide their hand along the tube without releasing your grip).
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Old 01-11-2016, 16:19   #22
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Re: Hard Dodger (Sprayhood) Illustrated Guide - Examples, Tips

Dodger #5

This one appears to be made with composite (or plastic) structure or sides and is connected to the Bimini.

While I am not aware of this as a product, looking at it makes me think it is a "Semi-Rigid" design made of lightweight composite materials.
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Dodger Design Issue: What about Dodger Strength?

This may be asked as a question: "Will this Dodger survive a boarding sea or green water?"

Or will it be swept away?

This brings up the issue that some dodgers are built very robustly and some are not. The design considerations often mentioned in sailing literature emphasize the need for cabin tops and dodgers to be able to survive a boarding sea (assuming we are talking about a "blue water" cruiser). So, many dodger designs are robust, with plywood or fiberglass structures or metal on metal boats.

Modern materials and forming of plastics has brought newer designs that feature curves and fewer parts and apparently less metal or wood support. While these may be sufficient for typical day sailing, or coastal cruising in mild weather, it may be questionable if they are strong enough for "offshore" or "blue water" sailing in all seas.

What do you think? Of this design (#5) or this issue?
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Old 01-11-2016, 16:28   #23
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Re: Hard Dodger (Sprayhood) Illustrated Guide - Examples, Tips

Dodger Design #6

The "All Clear" design.

This design appears to be large panels of clear firm plastic that is hard enough to create a rigid side (unlike soft clear vinyl panels used on Soft Dodgers).

It would appear to have maximum visibility as most of the dodger is clear. The top appears to be a solid white plastic or composite material.

Good Dodger Feature:
This photo does show a good feature to have on any dodger, and that is the long stainless "handholds" that are on the sides and aft edge. This was noticeably lacking in Dodger Design #4, which also had a hard top.

But, would this be another example of a "fair weather" or "coastal" dodger that may not survive heavy weather or boarding seas?

What do you think about Dodger #6?
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Old 01-11-2016, 17:40   #24
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Re: Hard Dodger (Sprayhood) Illustrated Guide - Examples, Tips

Quote:
Originally Posted by Steady Hand View Post
Dodger Design #6

The "All Clear" design.

This design appears to be large panels of clear firm plastic that is hard enough to create a rigid side (unlike soft clear vinyl panels used on Soft Dodgers).

It would appear to have maximum visibility as most of the dodger is clear. The top appears to be a solid white plastic or composite material.

Good Dodger Feature:
This photo does show a good feature to have on any dodger, and that is the long stainless "handholds" that are on the sides and aft edge. This was noticeably lacking in Dodger Design #4, which also had a hard top.

But, would this be another example of a "fair weather" or "coastal" dodger that may not survive heavy weather or boarding seas?

What do you think about Dodger #6?
Steady, IMO that design lacks one rather important feature: it does not come back far enough to sit under... it is more like a windscreen than a proper dodger. Almost useless to my eye... hardly covers the companionway hatch!

Jim
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Old 01-11-2016, 20:38   #25
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Re: Hard Dodger (Sprayhood) Illustrated Guide - Examples, Tips

Steady Hand, this is a very "timely" topic, with us entering into the seasons of wet & cold in the N. Hemisphere. It's one that I've written a lot on in the past, & will try & cobble together some notes & pics on. Great thread idea!

Snowpetrel, the one on your blog is one that I routinely direct people towards. Especially your thoughts on both design, & construction. The why's & how's. It's excellent!

Jim Cate is definitely on target with his comments about Van de Stadt, & the Dashews. Ditto with the bit about sitting under a dodger, & not just behind one. As ideally they make a foulie jacket optional in all but the worst weather.
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Old 01-11-2016, 21:06   #26
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Re: Hard Dodger (Sprayhood) Illustrated Guide - Examples, Tips

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jim Cate View Post
Steady, IMO that design lacks one rather important feature: it does not come back far enough to sit under... it is more like a windscreen than a proper dodger. Almost useless to my eye... hardly covers the companionway hatch!

Jim
I agree!

But I think the same can be said about most dodgers I see. Still, if something does block that splash in the face, it is not all bad.

I do admire the deeper or longer ones. I have some photos of them and will post in the future. Stay tuned! And thanks for adding your observation and opinion, which I respect.
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Old 01-11-2016, 21:10   #27
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Re: Hard Dodger (Sprayhood) Illustrated Guide - Examples, Tips

Quote:
Originally Posted by UNCIVILIZED View Post
Steady Hand, this is a very "timely" topic, with us entering into the seasons of wet & cold in the N. Hemisphere. It's one that I've written a lot on in the past, & will try & cobble together some notes & pics on. Great thread idea!

Snowpetrel, the one on your blog is one that I routinely direct people towards. Especially your thoughts on both design, & construction. The why's & how's. It's excellent!

Jim Cate is definitely on target with his comments about Van de Stadt, & the Dashews. Ditto with the bit about sitting under a dodger, & not just behind one. As ideally they make a foulie jacket optional in all but the worst weather.
Good! I enjoy seeing your views in posts, and look forward to whatever you add on this topic.

The Dashew's Deerfoot and SUNDEER and Beowulf certainly were influential and I think different when first produced (1980s starting as I recall). I have some photos to post in future.
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Old 01-11-2016, 21:49   #28
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Re: Hard Dodger (Sprayhood) Illustrated Guide - Examples, Tips

I have a soft spot for the Boreal line of boats. Since I do not own one, nor have I been on one, I can only go off of written reviews and the large number of photos I've seen of them. I think they have done one of the best jobs of incorporating a hard dodger into the lines of the boat. It does not appear to block the sight lines too much while giving a substantial place to sit out of the wind and spray. The added bonus is the water tight door into the 'doghouse' from which to do navigation with great views almost all around. If anyone has sailed on one, comments would be welcome. Until then, a link to a reveiw in Sailfeed is about as well as I can do.

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Old 01-11-2016, 22:38   #29
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Re: Hard Dodger (Sprayhood) Illustrated Guide - Examples, Tips

Thanks for this thread, we will be following it with interest as replacement of our sunbrella dodger is high on the to do list.
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Old 02-11-2016, 00:46   #30
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Re: Hard Dodger (Sprayhood) Illustrated Guide - Examples, Tips

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Steady, IMO that design lacks one rather important feature: it does not come back far enough to sit under... it is more like a windscreen than a proper dodger. Almost useless to my eye... hardly covers the companionway hatch!

Jim
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Just add a bimini that connects to the hard dodger. This is almost done. Finishing around the plastic edges needs to be sorted out and the pvc pipes to test out the bimini need to become stainless.
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