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Old 18-02-2019, 11:58   #61
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Re: Hanse 418 or Jeanneau 410?

Given a choice of the two, I would stay away from the Hanse. Don't trust any boatbuilder that uses aluminum for a rudder shaft. This is a stupid idea that can't help but cause a lot of problems long term with electolysis or corrosion. Hunters had aluminum alloy rudder posts and they ended up being a big problem. I know of a brand new Hanse that had it's rudder working and leaking so badly that the delivery crew were scared to keep going until they got approval from the builder and insurance company. Who needs this kind of problem?
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Old 18-02-2019, 12:36   #62
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Re: Hanse 418 or Jeanneau 410?

I’ve noticed those who have a Hanse love their Hanse and those who have a Jeanneau love their Jeanneau. Speaks well for both brands. Those with neither seem to like something else. Go figure.
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Old 18-02-2019, 12:40   #63
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Re: Hanse 418 or Jeanneau 410?

I own a Hanse 415 (model before the 418). I don't own a Jeanneau so can't comment on them.

I purchased the Hanse because I wanted to be able to sail safe and fast solo or short handed without relying on crew. The Hanse philosophy of placing the mast (deck stepped, don't confuse the compression post with the mast) further forward with a large mainsail and smaller self tacking gib along with all lines led aft to the cockpit and controllable from the helm (no cabin top winches) makes that possible for me. 41 foot is not a small boat but my Hanse is a joy to sail solo in any conditions. I can put a reef in or take it out in about a minute on my own from the safety of the cockpit. Note that I live in Tasmania (finish of the Sydney to Hobart yacht race) and sail offshore. I sailed from Hobart to Port Arthur via Storm Bay and Cape Rouel and back on the weekend on my own. The previous owner was older than me and sailed her with his wife from Sydney up the Eastern seaboard of Australia to Queensland and back three times before I bought her. If you want to see them sailing oceans then check out the Sailing Tranquilo channel on YouTube, they are sailing a 445 from Europe to Australia. A lighter, flatter bottom boat like the Hanse (and maybe the Jeanneau?) will slam coming off waves and not be as sea kindly as as something with a full keel but may be quicker on a long passage which can help to avoid weather.

Mine has the drop down bow thruster. I would not feel confident entering the marina in any sort of a breeze without it however it is not a panacea for all situations. They rotate the boat around the keel, they don't just push the bow in, the stern goes the opposite way. That takes some getting used to but can be used to your advantage. It can also be overpowered by a strong side wind.

Good luck with your purchase, no matter which boat you chose you will love it!
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Old 18-02-2019, 23:34   #64
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Re: Hanse 418 or Jeanneau 410?

My advice is to do what I did after researching the same issue and buy a Moody 41 ac. It’s built by Hanse in a cell construction mode and designed by Bill Dixon. The fittings are top notch, it’s well built, i’ve Had a Bow thruster and electric winch retro fitted which was significantly cheaper than a factory fit. I have friends with jeannneau’s and when I showed them the plug I cut out of the deck for the winch adaption they were amazed at the strength of the section v what they found on their own boats.
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Old 19-02-2019, 00:47   #65
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Re: Hanse 418 or Jeanneau 410?

The lack of good information is frustrating!

When the opinions fall all over the place from [total crap] to [wonderful], it's quite difficult to form one's own opinion based on that.

Here are some thoughts.

1. If you're buying a new Jeanneau or a new Hanse, what matters is the quality and features of that very one boat you've bought, not the ones manufactured ten years ago by different people using different materials, subcontractors, processes and whatnot.

2. Without a magic 8-ball, though, I guess that for the best indications of how that one boat will be built, one has to turn to the history and track record of the builder.

3. What frustrates me the most is that there doesn't seem to be a lot of reliable historical data available. Without data, and without putting that data into some sort of relevant context it's easy to end up with "never buy a Beneteau because of Cheeki Rafiki". That's frustrating.

(4. What also frustrates me a bit is that sailing magazine reviews of boats always seem 99.9% positive. Or am I just not reading the right magazines where professional people look at the boats as critically as some experienced people on this forum?)

So what to do.

Are there any recreational boaters' organizations that are working on issues related to these?

I think a good step forward would be to get more data. An anonymized database of every single boat survey performed would be quite cool.
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Old 19-02-2019, 07:48   #66
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Re: Hanse 418 or Jeanneau 410?

Not a particular useful place to look but the US Coast Guard maintains a database of reported issues.
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Old 19-02-2019, 07:51   #67
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Re: Hanse 418 or Jeanneau 410?

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Originally Posted by mglonnro View Post
"if you need a bowthruster on a 70 ft yacht, you're not competent to sail it"
Agree completely
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Old 19-02-2019, 11:46   #68
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Re: Hanse 418 or Jeanneau 410?

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Agree completely
I'd be happy to come and practice!
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Old 19-02-2019, 14:47   #69
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Re: Hanse 418 or Jeanneau 410?

Let your wife make the final decision. "If mama ain't happy, no one's happy!"
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Old 19-02-2019, 16:52   #70
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Re: Hanse 418 or Jeanneau 410?

I completed 1400 miles of deliveries on a Jeanneau 419, so I am familiar with the boat and not biased by wanting to resell it.

Having circumnavigated on a Beneteau, there were things that shocked me on the Jeanneau.

1. No sea berths. The boat comes with a large forepeak berth which is only good for getting airborne going to weather. It has a double berth aft, which I claimed and wedged myself in with sailbags and the rolled up dinghy to keep myself in place. The dinette 'berth' is unusable on starboard tack.

2. The single anchor roller is out on a sprit and the slot the roller is in has very sharp stainless steel plates in position to cut the anchor rode in short order as the boat sails back and forth at anchor. Plan on spending more than a boat unit to go with all chain rode or putting chafing guards on the plates.

3. The port lazarette opens to the inside of the boat. Looking out from below, I could see 1/8 inch of daylight around the seal. Worse, there is plywood cabinetry below with unsealed edges, just waiting to get wet and swell from the leaks. Plan on replacing it if you leave sheltered water without sealing the edges.

Less shocking, but still worrysome if you are not looking for a dock queen:
The boat is quite wide, with a relatively low ballast to displacement ratio. I have no idea how they got around the CE stability requirements.

The primary fuel filter is almost inaccessible under a hole in the back bunk--just imagine trying to change it out in a seaway.

Don't know about the new Hanse, but if was up to me I'd buy an older boat.
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Old 20-02-2019, 07:06   #71
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Re: Hanse 418 or Jeanneau 410?

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Don't know about the new Hanse, but if was up to me I'd buy an older boat.
Like an older Hunter Legend from the late 80's?
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Old 20-02-2019, 08:25   #72
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Re: Hanse 418 or Jeanneau 410?

Ironically, the Hunter Legend from the late 80's would not have been built to the CE standard as the standard, which requires third party construction review, didn't exist until 1998. (certainly doesn't make it a bad choice). Likewise, many of the racer cruisers built in the 70s and 80s were designed to the IOR rule which rewarded unstable hull design. Note that donradcliffe circumnavigated on a Beneteau, a high volume, often maligned as an offshore boat.
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Old 20-02-2019, 08:59   #73
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Re: Hanse 418 or Jeanneau 410?

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Originally Posted by Zzmeyer View Post
The Hanse owners from “myhanse” scared me away from the Hanse. A key to being a happy new boat owner is the dealer network. Both are good boats. I’d go with the one you like, but research your dealer. Our local one doesn’t have the same reputation as the Jeanneau dealer.
That is because Jeanneau has not a forum like that otherwise you would be scared too. In fact that forum is a very good support tool and you certainly noticed that Hanse owners are satisfied with their boats. I don't think Hanse have more problems than the Jeanneau.
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Old 20-02-2019, 09:04   #74
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Re: Hanse 418 or Jeanneau 410?

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Also, re: deck stepped / keel stepped, as you have been made aware most boats are deck stepped nowadays. I would be careful thinking about keel stepping being "better" than deck because of some unspecified strength factor. Masts stay on because they are pulled down by the standing rigging, not because they are well attached to the deck/hull. But, in extremis, any mast will fail wherever it's attached. Personally, in that situation I would prefer the mast to disappear overboard where I can deal with it. A keel-stepped mast has the option of taking some of your cabin top with it, which you may not want.

Also, of course, keel-stepped masts leak water into the bilge which deck-stepped ones don't.
The only reason why boats are deck stepped is for interior space considerations. On racing boats or cruiser racers de masts are always keel stepped. Why do you think they do that if not because it is better that way?
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Old 20-02-2019, 09:18   #75
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Re: Hanse 418 or Jeanneau 410?

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The only reason why boats are deck stepped is for interior space considerations. On racing boats or cruiser racers de masts are always keel stepped. Why do you think they do that if not because it is better that way?
Still, if the ClubSwan 50 is deck stepped, it's not like only the cheapest (and slowest!) of cars go that way? Interior space is cool
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