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Old 27-01-2007, 09:38   #1
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Got that itch again...

Could someone pass the cream or powder?

Kidding.

Anyway, with all of the help others have given us in the financial advice area, we are once again looking at putting our beloved boat up on the market so we can afford to live. We're just not rich enough to afford her AND go cruising. We have recently been trying to come up with boats that might make sense for us. We were looking in and around the $20-$30K mark. I'm posting here to see if anyone knows of one for sale, or even where to begin. Here are some items that are and are not important to us. Any ideas on cheapo (could be damaged) boats that fit?


Important to have:


*Water tankage capability 120 gals min
*Displacement and/or LWL - 26,000lbs or more sounds right. We don't like bashing around in light boats, don't like powerboat wakes causing us to rock, and we like to sit kind of still in a rolly anchorage. We found that a great stability comes with a 45' boat that is 26,000lbs. We would like to preserve this.
*Bluewater cruiser - good righting ability
*Sails to windward
*Rig set up to accommodate good sail inventory, including drifter or other downwind sails
*Set up to live at anchor, or at least really cheap so I can afford to put in generator and wood stove and make it liveable at anchor in all weather.
*Need to be able to pull up to a fancy dock and not look too poor - boat has to be able to clean up on the exterior so we don't look as poor as we are.
*Storage - hopefully low and below the waterline
*Aux diesel engine
*Cheap - can be bought for a max of $30K
*Sheets within reach of helm. Halyards don't need to be.
*RUGGED - Ideally, I'd like a commercial trawler, research vessel, etc... but we don't want to be dependent on diesel.
*Monohull - there isn't a multi made that would be this cheap that we could live at anchor with.

Not important to us, but usually are to others:

*Showers (ha ha ha... say what you will)
*Hot water (keep on laughing... ha ha)
*The looks of the interior
*Number of berths
*Hull material (interested in steel, FRP is ok, don't know much about ferrocement, wood is out - I stink at woodworking)
*Resale value
*Electronics

Nice to have:

*Full cockpit enclosure or pilothouse
*Means to store tender (davits or better yet... on deck)
*Whatever bluewater crusing gear might be strewn about a project boat of this price range


I'd also be willing to do a trade with someone who likes my boat and wants to upgrade, provided they have a really cheap boat they want to unload.

Any ideas on where to start? Winter gets you thinking...

PS: If I can figure out what boat to buy, ours will be listed again as the lowest priced model on the market.
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Old 27-01-2007, 09:50   #2
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Sean,

There's a Morgan OI 41 Ketch listed in the current CARIBBEAN COMPASS asking $35K.

Okay -so maybe she won't point to weather too well but they sure are comfortable... and capable.

Sail her to Australia and quadruple your investment.

IMHO anyway.

To Life!

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Old 27-01-2007, 09:53   #3
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Can I have one as well

Will put my thinking cap on. Budget is a bit of a challenge...............

Is this for Round Cape Horn, the Caribbean, the Med or Northern Europe?
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Old 27-01-2007, 10:11   #4
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Thank you, Kirk for a good start. I'll look at those again. I had looked at them before, but the sailing ability (or lack thereof) scared me off.

David: This is not for 'round the horn, but more of Nothern USA and Europe, a couple of trans-Atlantics,
Med, Caribbean, out to Galapagos, unsure about doing a Pacific crossing, but would be nice.

When you spend 100% of your time on a boat, you want it be a good home and safe cruisers no matter if you are going 'round the horn or 'round the bay. It's scary when everything you own is in a single boat, so I'm of the school that if we have a well founded vessel, it will be its own insurance in many ways.

Which reminds me: The boat doesn't need to be insurable or qualify for a loan. This is a cash transaciton.
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Old 27-01-2007, 10:17   #5
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Fair points on the use of the boat, but I suspect their may be "1 or 2" compromises required............

Quote:
Originally Posted by ssullivan
The boat doesn't need to be insurable or qualify for a loan.
Just a thought, don't some places require visiting yachts to have insurance? Italy at least rings a bell.......(but don't quote me on this!)
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Old 27-01-2007, 10:31   #6
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i've just seen this thread so i am not sure of your exact predicument...looks like you have a 45' boat now...are you carrying a big loan? or is it the shear expense of a 45' boat, e.g.~ slip fees, maintenence?

if the size is not the issue i just saw a post for a 45' morgan for 45k..."seller motivated" at keysyachts (i think they are on marathon??)

morgan 45'sailboat FOR SALE IN FLORIDA
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Old 27-01-2007, 10:33   #7
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David:
Yes, there are always compromises. I think the comprimise I lean toward is a boat that has the above characteristics, but is so god awful looking that nobody wants her. Something like the 2001 Hyundai car we have. It's got dents and dings, it's a Hyundai, it's got wood chips in the back seat, etc... But, I paid $5000 for it a few years back, it doesn't break down, and it gets us from point A to point B. We did not buy it based on styling or image, only on logic. This is the type of boat we are looking for.

In the countries were you are required to have insurance, is liability sufficient? This is a very good point I was not thinking of.

Max Mariner: Yes, it is the loan that we are not so happy with. We had purchased this boat and refit it to the utmost for chartering. Since we are no longer chartering, we find that the loan payments for such a nice boat are a lot to carry. We want to downgrade in style and beauty, and still keep the same overall seaworthiness or even improve a little in that dept.
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Old 27-01-2007, 11:01   #8
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Don't have any info on what you are looking for but I have a Pearson 36 for sale
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Old 27-01-2007, 11:04   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sonny
Don't have any info on what you are looking for but I have a Pearson 36 for sale
Way too light for what we need. Sorry. I need some substance.
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Old 27-01-2007, 12:16   #10
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Have you played around in the Yachtworld.Com search engine? It ought to help you get a little better idea on what you might get for your money or what boats of the type you want are being listed for. The prices you see are not always the real price but you at least get a feel on what is out there.

In the $20K-$30K range I'm not seeing a whole lot that don't need a lot of work. It would take a closer eye to weed through the many that do come up.
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Old 27-01-2007, 12:25   #11
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Hi Paul.

Yes, I've hit the Yachtworld search engine. I didn't see much. Oddly, I often see more of these "fixer upper" boats in marinas or boat yards rotting away than I do actively on the market. My hope was that maybe someone on the board has seen one. I don't mind doing another complete refit, so long as it's labor intensive, rather than capital intensive.

I'll keep on weeding through those. Any thoughts on those old Morgan OI's? I have avoided them like the plague because I would like to sail. Also boats of that age (early 70's) seem to be the ones with the most blistering issues. Any thoughts on that?

And... one final thing: Does anyone see why a fiberglass boat wouldn't last 80 to 100 years? I'd like this next boat to be my last purchase. Given that I'm looking at boats as old as I am already, they are in the 35 year range today. I'd like to use it until I'm too old to handle it, which would still be another 30-40 years off, hopefully.
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Old 27-01-2007, 12:43   #12
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Deliberately going for a GRP boat with Osmosis / Blistering may be a good idea. It knocks the cr#p out of the price..........and then you get the OPTIONS of:

a) getting it fixed professionaly at your / your bank managers leisure;

b) patching bits and pieces yourself as you see fit;

c) Ignoring it on the basis you are never selling and she won't sink in the meantime.

Maybe find out where boats go in your area to get "fixed" and have a chat to the guys, I am sure they do get people in who scream when they hear the costs / can't afford to have the work done...........or even advertise for one?? especially as you are willing to PX a boat without (I assume?).

100 years? probably need a "bit" of maintanence over the years - but my understanding (belief?!) is that once a GRP boat has lasted 20 / 30 years it is a good indication that she was built / designed well enough to survive long term, if not pretty much a lifetime (if the bulkheads were going to fall out etc, I reckon 20 / 30 years is a fair test period).........but from previous discussions on this point opinions have varied - but not enough for me to change my basic viewpoint.
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Old 27-01-2007, 13:02   #13
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Sean:
It really sounds like you’ve already got what you want – and just cannot afford it, even thought it’s a bargain (<$100K for a “nice” 45 footer @ 26000# et al).

Given your specifications, you might try haunting the insurance companies for a boat that burned (inside) – perhaps (as others have indicated) a Morgan OI (which normally sell for $50 – 100K).

$25K purchased my immaculate, but not perfect, (’84) C&C29 (@ 6800# displ. & 25 gallons water), six years ago.
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Old 27-01-2007, 13:10   #14
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Funny, they say it's a buyers market but the really good boats go before they are even listed. There is a whole lotta junk on the market.

Gonna be tough to buy in the price range specified and the requirements stipulated. That's a boat for $1.00/lb., parting it may bring more?

Maybe consider a smaller boat or watch e-bay to see if any deals come up but with e-bay you never know what you are gonna get. If it's to good to be true more then likely it is and there are flaws unseen.
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Old 27-01-2007, 13:20   #15
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one more question - what sort of timescale are you looking at from using her as "just" a Liveaboard to setting off??
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