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Old 11-02-2010, 22:31   #1
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Foresail Sheets on Cooper 416

The foresail sheets on my Cooper 416 are showing a lot of wear from rubbing on the shrouds. It looks to me like another block would help closer to the clew. Right now the only block is back by the cockpit. Any comments? 416 owners who can tell me how there's are rigged?
Thanks.
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Old 12-02-2010, 08:06   #2
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Moving the Jib Sheet Block modifies the Sail Shape:

Moving the jib sheet block forward (or adding another one fwd) will place more tension on the top of the leech (back edge), as the jib's sheet is tightened. This will result in an increased draft of the jib and untwisting of the sail. This will power up the jib. If the jib luffs at the top of the leech first, the fair lead is to far aft. If the jib luffs at the bottom of the leech first, the fair lead is to far forward.

Moving the block aft would place more tension on the foot (bottom edge) of the sail as the jib's sheet is tightened. This will flatten the foot or bottom of the sail and twist the top of the sail, thus, depowering the jib.


Since the Cooper 416 appears to have a perforated toe rail, you can move a snatch block forward and aft, to achieve the best sail shape compromise for each varying condition.

BTW: Nice looking boats.
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Old 12-02-2010, 08:15   #3
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Thanks Gord. Good info. Before I buy a couple more blocks I'll test with the ones that are on there now.
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Old 13-02-2010, 13:12   #4
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I have a Cooper 416 as well. What I ended up doing with my particular genoa (125%) is to place a snatch block close to midships. I have it placed on the second toerail hole aft of the boarding stanchions. This seems to be the best overall configuration to keep sail shape.

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Old 13-02-2010, 13:20   #5
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Thanks Willem. I'll give that a try.
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Old 21-04-2011, 23:57   #6
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Re: Foresail Sheets on Cooper 416

Hi, I noticed on the cruiser log forum site that you had a Cooper 416. I am not sure if that is still the case but I am looking very seriously at purchasing one at present & would appreciate your feedback as to the good, bad etc on how the design performs & basicly your overall opinion on what you thought of the yacht. If you wish to email me direct this can be done at corpspeak@tonypurkiss.com

I look forward to hearing from you.

Regards, Tony
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Old 22-04-2011, 02:02   #7
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Re: Foresail Sheets on Cooper 416

Hi Tony. I love the my 416. I'm certainly no expert but it find it has a lot going for it. It is a very forgiving boat and yet sails well. Despite being described as a cruiser/racer I'd say it's more a cruiser, compared to lighter boats. It's bright and spacious and seems very well built. I consider it ideal for sailing around the PNW. I sail solo alot and it's an easy boat to handle.

If you're looking for a boat for day sailing I would choose something lighter but if you're looking for a boat to spend time on it's a good choice.

Where is the one you're looking at?
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Old 22-04-2011, 05:36   #8
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Re: Foresail Sheets on Cooper 416

Hi Greg,

Thanks for the reply.
There is one in the Pacific North West & another in Long Beach CA. that appeals to me.
How does your 416 sail to windward & what speeds do you get from her?
Do you like the inside helm & do you use it often?
Being such a wide yacht, how manouverable is she when it comes to docking her?
How dry is she on deck when out sailing... in otherwords , would she be described as a wet or dry yacht when sailing?
Do you have an issue with the size of the pilothouse windows in a big sea?
How easy is it to see the bow whilst steering from the cockpit helm?
On an average passage what sort of miles could be expected in a 24hr period in say 20/25kts of breeze?

Sorry for all the questions but hope you can help.

Regards, Tony.?
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Old 22-04-2011, 10:44   #9
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Re: Foresail Sheets on Cooper 416

She points very well. The knotmeter is broken on my boat but she always keeps up with similiar size boats. She's great in strong winds, very forgiving if you've too much sail up but she's heavy so you need to go with a spinnaker once you're below 4 knots. She's very dry.

She's built in Vancouver and is perfect for the conditions here. We get strong winds, heavy chop but not big swells. I use the pilothouse quite a bit when the weather isn't great or if I need to do something below. The water here is cold and if you sail year round you'll find yourself in the rain so a pilothouse is very nice. I have talked to people who have sailed them in southern waters. They've said they don't have problems with over heating and they do well in ocean conditions. Visibility is good as long as you don't have your dinghy on the foredeck.

Again, here the pilothouse windows aren't an issue. People I've talked to have suggested they wouldn't be a problem in ocean conditions. I do know of a couple of them that were sailing in Mexico and they had to get there from here at some time She has a lot of freeboard, I've never buried the toerail, though I may not have been tryikng hard enough

Mine is misery in reverse. A lot of prop walk and it took some getting used to. I didn't find the width to be much of a problem when I was at a slip but I prefer a mooring ball. If you have a crosswind coming in though there is a fair amount of windage and I have had her take off when backing. It never proved a problem if I came in forward. I have a hood furling mains'l so have a bit more windage then another might have. It's a heavy boat so she has a lot of momentum but she keeps her steerage well. A bow thruster would have been welcome at times.

I haven't taken her bluewater sailing so can't give you first hand answers for some of your questions. She'll sustain good speeds in my experience but there's no direction I can go for 24 hours without running into land! It's about 20 nm across the Georgia Straight here and in 15 knots on a reach she'll do it in less then 4 hours. In 20-25 knot winds I'm sure I've made 7 knots when reaching. I've sailed most of a day with a decent tail wind and while it was a very pleasant sail thought that my speed might have been less then hoped for. In the chop we get here it has to get pretty bad before being close hauled becomes unpleasant. She cuts the waves well.

Everyone loves there own boat I suppose. I lived on her for close to a year and was very comfortable. Now that I'm back on land I think something smaller would suit better but when I'm out with others the space is nice or even alone when I'm on for extended periods. The cockpit is small as a result of the pilothouse but the foredeck is big and I put a couple of deck chairs out at anchor and it's lovely. Sitting in the salon you can't believe you are sitting in a sailboat. It feels palatial. Storage could be better. Some of the other layouts may address that but they don't seem to.

If you have to replace the desiel or water tanks you may be in for some misery though I know that weren't all the same. They are built in areas not meant for access though.

There used to be an owners association but it seems to have disappeared for the time being.
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Old 22-04-2011, 22:14   #10
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Re: Foresail Sheets on Cooper 416

Thanks for the reply. The information you have given me is great.

It appears that the design is a very stiff yacht with good freeboard that can handle plenty of breeze without getting up much heel or water over the deck. There is also good visibility forward & easily handled whilst sailing.

I am surprised that for the volume of the yacht that you say she doesn't have much storage. Were you referring to locker space for placing boat stuff like buckets, fenders, dock lines, etc or storage for things like food, pots & pans, clothes, etc?

I understand what you mean about the prop walk & moving about in reverse. My current yacht, a Swanson 36 is the same, good going forward but does a big walk to port when in reverse. Which way does your Cooper walk?

The other thing that worries me is your comment on the fuel/water tanks. Have you or others you know had a problem with the tanks which nesesitated them being replaced or removed for repair?

As I am fairly tall, 6'3" can you tell me how much head room there is in the forward cabin & the head & shower tub please. I assume there is approx 6'6" in the dining & galley areas?

Once again, thanks for your feedback & look forward to hearing from you soon re the above.

Regards Tony.
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Old 22-04-2011, 23:18   #11
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Re: Foresail Sheets on Cooper 416

She walks to port.

One of the owners I talked to had to remove his and it was difficult. He had to dismantle the galley. My tanks are fine. Not all the layouts are the same.

Head room like you won't believe. I'm a little over 6 foot and there at the point where I step down from the pilothouse to the salon I have to stretch to touch the cabin roof. The pilothouse makes all the difference for things like the campanion way as well. There's nowhere in the boat where head room is an issue for me but I can't tell you the measurements and won't be down to the boat again for another week. You've got a couple of inches on me so it could seem different to you.

The storage issue may be different with other layouts. She has three hanging lockers and storage under settee's is good. I removed the waste tank and went with a composter so I gained that space back. There is a cocktail cabinet which seems waste space to me and the shelves above the settees are marginally useful. Maybe I just had too much stuff on board
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Old 24-04-2011, 09:49   #12
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Re: Foresail Sheets on Cooper 416

Thanks Greg, that all makes sense. How much room is in the chain locker & forward of the v berth or under it for that matter? Do you think I could fit a drop down bow thruster up there or is there no space or the area below the waterline to shallow to do it?

Does the sloop rig work well or would you prefer a cutter rig?

Are the water & fuel fillers on the deck or they inside the boat?

How functional is the nav station for reading charts? It doesn't seem like a big area.

How do you like the shower/tub area? Does it work or is the head/shower/tub area to small?

Once again thanks for your input.
Regards, Tony.
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Old 24-04-2011, 21:29   #13
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Re: Foresail Sheets on Cooper 416

I think you could put a bow thruster under the v berth. You wouldn't put it in the chain locker - it's above the waterline.

I like the sloop rig. I usually use a 150 genoa but for a while this summer I put my 110 on and did some repairs. The 110 is really easy to sail solo in stiff winds but the 150 is a lot of fun and needed in light winds. I do a lot of solo sailing so have never considered the cutter rig.

The tub in my boat I've heard call a soaker tub. It makes a great shower but I don't know about "soaking" in it .

Water and fuel are on opposite sides on the deck. Which does bring to mind one complaint I have. The water is all on one side and desiel on the other. If the water is full she isn't balanced. At one point I thought it was a serious flaw but I've got in the habit of not putting a lot of water in the tank at one time and I'm putting iin a watermaker and seperate tank on the same side as the desiel. Not all of them seem to have the same tank layout - I think the ones that have the salon up and the galley down have different tankage.

Glad I can help Tony.
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Old 24-04-2011, 21:33   #14
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Re: Foresail Sheets on Cooper 416

Forgot about the nav station. Lousy for reading charts in some ways however convenient if your underway because it's by the pilothouse nav station. The wiring on my boat was a challenge to work at times because of the location of the panel above the nav table.
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Old 25-04-2011, 05:59   #15
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Re: Foresail Sheets on Cooper 416

Thanks for that info. It is very interesting that you comment on the tankage. I have been told by other Cooper owners & what I have read in reviews that the tanks can be a real problem if they split or need replacing.

From what I understand, the Cooper layout has the galley in the pilothouse area & after the fire at the Cooper factory & the molds were sold to US Yachts in 1981/2 & they started to produce them the galley was below in the saloon area.

So does this mean that you only have one diesel tank on the port side & one water tank on the starboard side at present?

Will the new water tank you are going to fit be a plastic bladder one or a s/s tank?

Will you be putting it under the floor in the pilot house or saloon area?

Where are you intending to put the watermaker?

Thanks again for your feedback.
Regards, Tony
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