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Old 26-06-2016, 18:02   #46
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Re: First trailerable sailboat? Have 2 small kids.

The Com-Pac Horizon Cat I suggested above is trailerable ( see the photos via the link) and can fit inside a home garage too! It does NOT have a deep keel. So it is easier to launch and trailer and store than some boats. It is only 20 feet long. The linked photos and the com-PAC website show that clearly.

But, while it is only 20 feet long, because of its design, it has a large cockpit that allows more comfort while day sailing with others like friends and family. When sailing a boat like this, people will want to be in the cockpit. Having a nice cockpit is a great feature.

I also think the ease of raising the mast (with its special system) and the easy rig are more appealing than most boats in that size and most that are a few feet longer, but positioned as trailer boats. I would not want a trailer boat that is difficult or time consuming to rig (raise the mast) for sailing. Inconvenience or difficulty leads to less sailing and less fun with any boat.

Yes, it will cost more than some other production boats that size, but I think it is worth it, and would prefer it over many of the more common small sailboats positioned as pocket cruisers.

But of course everyone will have their own tastes and opinions. YMMV.
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Old 26-06-2016, 18:10   #47
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Re: First trailerable sailboat? Have 2 small kids.

Steady, while I think your suggestion has some merit, I'd point out that one of the things "first sailboats" should accomplish is teaching the skipper about sailing. IMO, this is better done with a conventional sloop rig rather than a catboat.

The large and well organized owner's groups that Catalina has are a definite advantage for a newcomer, too. All in all, the Cat-22 has a lot to recommend it compared to a relative odd ball like the cat boats.

All just an opinion, but a well considered one...

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Old 26-06-2016, 18:43   #48
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Re: First trailerable sailboat? Have 2 small kids.

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Originally Posted by neflier View Post
My situation is similar to the OP, but no kids and a larger tow vehicle (8,300# cap).

You mentioned Com-Pac Yachts. How does one get a Com-Pac 23 on and off a trailer at the ramp? I'm coming from many years of trailerable fishing boats in which we'd back the trailer up to where the rear wheel bearings were just out of the water and winch the boat down, or up from its roller trailer. I'd expect the tow vehicle to be in the water, along with the trailer going off of the end of the ramp when trying to launch or recover a Com-Pac 23. What am I missing?
Compac 23 trailer has an extension built in that is about 5 or 6' long. I self launched/recovered my old Compac 23 each season. But that is in an ocean at a fairly steep ramp. Would not be fun to do that as a daysailer. The Compac catboats are easy as daysailers though.

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Old 26-06-2016, 18:48   #49
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Re: First trailerable sailboat? Have 2 small kids.

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Originally Posted by Jim Cate View Post
Steady, while I think your suggestion has some merit, I'd point out that one of the things "first sailboats" should accomplish is teaching the skipper about sailing. IMO, this is better done with a conventional sloop rig rather than a catboat.

The large and well organized owner's groups that Catalina has are a definite advantage for a newcomer, too. All in all, the Cat-22 has a lot to recommend it compared to a relative odd ball like the cat boats.

All just an opinion, but a well considered one...

Jim
Jim,

The Compac owners forum is a great resource too. I'm not sure learning on an 'odd ball' like a cat boat is all that much different than learning on a Sunfish or Force 5. For a starting singlehanded sailer just having one sheet and easy tacks would be a good thing.

Not my boat but there is a beautiful Suncat for sail on the owners forum right now.

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Old 26-06-2016, 18:59   #50
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Re: First trailerable sailboat? Have 2 small kids.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jim Cate View Post
Steady, while I think your suggestion has some merit, I'd point out that one of the things "first sailboats" should accomplish is teaching the skipper about sailing. IMO, this is better done with a conventional sloop rig rather than a catboat.

The large and well organized owner's groups that Catalina has are a definite advantage for a newcomer, too. All in all, the Cat-22 has a lot to recommend it compared to a relative odd ball like the cat boats.

All just an opinion, but a well considered one...

Jim
Jim,

I have great respect for your experience, sea miles, and wisdom and enjoy reading your posts.

On this issue, we see things differently, and I do so with respect for you, and in a friendly tone of voice.

I have nothing against the Catalina's and other small keel boats or trailer boats.

My basic POV: Any boat that gets folks out on the water having fun is a better boat than one that stays in the yard.

The OP wants to sail on the Chesapeake.
In my view, catboats like this one, with its shallow draft, are ideal for the Chesapeake and gunk holing.

Catboats are not "oddballs" in some parts of the country, where Catboats were traditional craft and still enjoyed, but they are of course more uncommon.

In the Chesapeake, I would be very happy to have a Catboat like this, to be used mostly for daysailing or occasional overnight "boat camping." Same in the Tampa area or Miami's Biscayne Bay, or Galveston Bay as they too have large areas of very shallow waters.

Boats without a jib are easier for learning to sail, as there is less to manage, and with shorthanded sailing, a catboat rig has many owners who praise the ease of tacking the boat. One only has to read the comments from owners of Nonsuch boats (another catboat rig) to understand their appeal. A visit to the Nonsuch website to watch some videos on how they sail their catboats may be useful for anyone who is not familiar with them.

Learning to sail a boat and having fun on it does not require a jib. Many people learn to sail on boats that are not a sloop rig with a jib. Lasers, Sabots, El Toro, Sunfish, and many dinghy class boats lack a jib. And, millions of people enjoy sailing them too. They are too small for a family outing though.

From my POV, for a newish sailor with young kids who wants a trailerable boat to take on the Chesapeake, an easy to rig (raise the mast), easy to manage (sail) catboat like the Com-Pac is a good choice for taking the family out for some fun on the water. Easy in and out of the water, shallow draft, easy to gunk hole, and easy to manage the sailing. The Horizon Cat is designed to be that way.

One can always find other boats (OPB) on which to learn how to manage more complex sail plans (with jibs), spinnaker setting and such or racing. In fact, that is probably the best way to learn how those are best sailed, while sailing with more experienced sailors and crew who know and can show something about sail trim etc..

For some, complexity and sail or rig tweaking is appealing. For others, simplicity and ease of use. Luckily we are not all forced to use only one type of boat. There are boats designed to appeal to all types of sailors.

Different strokes (or boats) for different folks.

That's how I see it.
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Old 22-07-2016, 14:33   #51
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Re: First trailerable sailboat? Have 2 small kids.

We are also looking at our first boat and are appreciate all of the input so far. We are in central PA and would be looking for a boat to sail in the Blue Marsh reservoir, possibly Sweet Arrow or Memorial Lakes (more like ponds) but I think the later two are too small and shallow for anything that we could take to the Chesapeake. thoughts?

Also we're new to towing anything so if I see that a boat has a displacement of 2,000 pounds , is that to say the boat weighs 2,000 pounds (plus what ever you put on it)?

Our kids are all grown but we have grand children who may be on board.


Thanks,
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Old 22-07-2016, 14:55   #52
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Re: First trailerable sailboat? Have 2 small kids.

There are many boats with little draft, large cockpits are good on the Chesapeake as well as small lakes. I would begin with your car's towing capacity and stay well under it. Many 20 footers would serve your purposes. There is a wide array of options-- centerboard v keel, cat boat rig (single sail), vs. sloop (2 sails) small cabin vs. all cockpit, and so forth.
The key parameters are ease of set up (hoisting and rigging the mast) stability (some designs are very stable while others are for the adventurous good swimmer), and fit to how you want to use it. A small outboard is generally considered necessary as winds do not always cooperate.

Start with the ads and look at a lot of boats. As you get a feel of what is available and prices you can begin to focus your search. Read some books on sailing. You can better understand your boat's behavior if you studied some. Fair wind and good fortune to you.
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Old 22-07-2016, 14:56   #53
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Re: First trailerable sailboat? Have 2 small kids.

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Also we're new to towing anything so if I see that a boat has a displacement of 2,000 pounds , is that to say the boat weighs 2,000 pounds (plus what ever you put on it)
Yes, that's right, although that weight can go up considerably, quite fast, with all the other stuff that you add to the boat (including tankage if there is any).
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Old 22-07-2016, 17:14   #54
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Re: First trailerable sailboat? Have 2 small kids.

Yes, 2000 lb adds up fast... You also need to look at the maximum tongue weight on your car. This will help you decide whether you need a one or two axle trailer...

My O'Day 23 was only trailered once to the Chesapeake and then we sold the trailer... I had to get a big car to tow it... (not my own) I have extensive experience trailering a 15 ft daysailer and that was about as much boat as I would feel comfortable trailering long distance with a Subaru Outback. So if I had to do this (and we might at some point) I would go for the easiest option - a West Wight Potter 15 (very easy to trailer -- tiny inside, but simple, they sail nicely and are unsinkable) or a WWP 19 (sails better, bigger boat but still easy to trailer). A Catalina 23 would be a bit much to trailer in my opinion if the car is only rated for 2k lb...

Let us know what you picked.
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Old 22-07-2016, 17:32   #55
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Re: First trailerable sailboat? Have 2 small kids.

remember to add trailer weight, it may weigh <1000# on a 2000# boat...?
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Old 22-07-2016, 18:30   #56
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Re: First trailerable sailboat? Have 2 small kids.

I don't want to disparage any of the suggestions here, they are very much emblematic of small trailer sailors, and good places to start. But I have to be honest, if the budget goes up to $20k all of them pale in comparison to a small trimaran like the Corsair. Roughly the same weight, and about the same interior room, but with three times the deck space, much easier to sail, far faster, and easy to tow.

Add a boom tent over one of the tramps, and you have the best place to sleep aboard any of these boats.



...On towing weight... Assume that a 20ish for boat trailer is going to run about 800-1,000lbs, less if it's an aluminium trailer. This is in addition to the boat weight, which is rated empty so account for all the little stuff.
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Old 22-07-2016, 20:07   #57
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Re: First trailerable sailboat? Have 2 small kids.

Stumble,
Could you actually trailer that corsair on US roads? I know nothing but it looks wide. I think the max trailer width, over highways is 8.5 feet? Just curious!
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Old 22-07-2016, 20:16   #58
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Re: First trailerable sailboat? Have 2 small kids.

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I don't want to disparage any of the suggestions here, they are very much emblematic of small trailer sailors, and good places to start. But I have to be honest, if the budget goes up to $20k all of them pale in comparison to a small trimaran like the Corsair. Roughly the same weight, and about the same interior room, but with three times the deck space, much easier to sail, far faster, and easy to tow.
How long does it take to unfold, step the mast and get it all rigged for sailing?

Shawn
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Old 22-07-2016, 20:39   #59
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Re: First trailerable sailboat? Have 2 small kids.

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Stumble,
Could you actually trailer that corsair on US roads? I know nothing but it looks wide. I think the max trailer width, over highways is 8.5 feet? Just curious!
The beams fold in, I can't remember the exact folded width, but it's less than 8'6". It takes about a minute to fold, just undo four bolts and lift the amas. It's easy enough that a number of farrier boats are kept in normal width slips and just unfolded as they motor out since the mast isn't dependent on the amas being extended for support. And while you shouldn't sail with them folded in the boat is still pretty stable with the boat folded up.
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Old 22-07-2016, 21:05   #60
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Re: First trailerable sailboat? Have 2 small kids.

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How long does it take to unfold, step the mast and get it all rigged for sailing?

Shawn
It takes about 30 minutes to step the mast, which is a pretty slick system actually. It uses a trailer winch and gin pole that slots into the mast to lift. Basically you connect one bolts (mast hinge) the shrouds, and the gin pole, then just crank up the mast. Unfolding takes about 30 seconds a side. You just push them down and snug up two bolts.

It's actually far easier to step the Corsair than any other boat I have dealt with, except very small rigs.

This is the process on the Corsair 31' which is a much larger boat, but is still done in less than 30 minutes.

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