Finding the needle in a haystack - how?

[john61ct]

At this low end of the market, best to assume you will get hardly anything from selling it.

[captrick2011]

Find a broker to work for you not the seller and sit down and explain what your plans and expectations are.Find him by word of mouth,then check him out by talking to previous customers.

[Mauruuru]

Start by removing Hay from the stack! This is an example of analysis paralysis. Decide how to use the boat, decide how big/small and essentials, then go shop

[Jammer]

Hello MHagen


Hope you're following the thread and will keep posting.


Most of us have been new at this at some point. (A few people were never really new at it because they started sailing when they were like 7 years old and never stopped, but that's the exception)

Originally Posted by mhagen

How do you find the needle in a haystack?

With a magnet or an inductive-loop metal detector.

I recently moved to Corpus Christi TX and Im looking seriously for a live-aboard mono-hull. So where do I start looking and how do I identify a "good deal" or compare boats on the market[?]

There is no one "right" way.


There is some good advice upthread. I offer these points of light:

• Decide whether you want a "project" boat. There's no clear-cut definition but in general a "project" boat is a boat that will require significant refitting before being reasonably suitable for its original intended use. Typically these are wise purchases only for buyers who intended to "downcycle" the boat. An example would be a sailboat with the rigging and sails damaged or deteriorate to the point they are unusable. Such a boat might be suitable for someone who does not ever intend to sail it and wants an inexpensive trawler for the Great Loop. Another example would be someone purchasing a boat with a runout engine with the intent of fitting an outboard, or with a plan to never move it under engine power.
• Narrow down the size, because a 45' sailboat is twice as big as a 35' sailboat and that's too wide of a range.
• Narrow down your budget. You have limited funds to work with given your goals, so focus on the top end of the range, allowing some leeway for other costs of the search and purchase and minor refitting so the boat meets your needs.
• Figure out how much draft you can tolerate, because you may find that rules out a good deal of the market.
• Decide whether you will be in a slip with power and water or on a mooring ball or at anchor.

Most Common Mfg'r: This really surprised me. I knew the big production boat manufactures dominated the market but I didnt realize by how much. Catalina with 158, Hunter with 157, and Beneteau with 134 dominate the market. Along with Pearson, C&C, Tartan, and Morgan these make up the top 7 and after that, the number to choose from any particular manufacturer fall off a cliff.

You left out Jeanneau.


The major high-volume makers at the top of your list mostly manufacture relatively lightweight, beamy sailboats, most of them with a wide sugar-scoop transom, with a walk-through feature in many cases. There is some variation from year to year and model to model. They are generally less costly than other makes when new.


For a liveaboard, be sure you are comparing boats of similar usable space. Less beamy boats have less room.


Most of the smaller makers produce boats that are narrower, or heavier, or both, either in pursuit of better performance or better handling in rough seas, or both.


You will have to decide whether sailing performance is important to you. For liveaboard boats, it usually is not.


Enjoy the journey. The shopping is part of the fun

[wingssail]

Originally Posted by zeehag

try sailing.
by sailing a boat you figure out what you do and donot want in sailboats. more you sail the better educated you are as to how sailboats handle and what you wish for will be more readily defined.
try it. sail . then sail some more. then figure out what you want. if you donot sail, any boat will do, even a trawler.
no one can decide for you what kind of boat to get..is all personal, kinda like finding a spouse. or do you do that by interwebs also, then wonder why the fit is wrong...

Absolutely! What she said!

Do a lot more sailing. Find people who want crew for passages. Try getting on a racing crew. Ask everyone you see if they need crew. Charter in the waters where you will live. DO consider what you want in a boat.

FORGET the search for the best deal. Instead, find the boat that best suits your needs, then try to get the price to be reasonable and affordable for you.

A BOAT IS NOT A COMMODITY. Just cause it floats and is a great deal does not mean it will be what you will like and love for the next 5-10-20 years.

I wanted a racing boat, to live on. Totally impractical. It would not even fit on your charts. I found one. I loved it. I found a way to buy it. I have been happy for 32 years.

[Hoodsail]

Completely agree with already mentioned 1st step - how will you be using the boat in addition to live aboard? When looking for my current boat the criteria were; within my initial budget, 35 ft, blue water capable, 1970s to early 1980s vintage, < 4 ft draft.
Another source for a boat are salvage dealers in addition to yachtworld. I found a few boats that were candidates albeit - "buyer VERY BEWARE". Online salvage auction (after crawling about the boat) was an interesting experience...enjoy the hunt and good luck to ya

[Paul J. Nolan]

how do you find the needle in a haystack?

Not your way, pal.

How did you search for a mate?

Paul

[Tetepare]

Originally Posted by redhead

Which one makes your heart sing?

The one that’s going to break your heart later.

I think OP did a great job of understanding the market.

Now chart price per foot for dockage.

Whatever you have available to spend, 30% gets set aside for repair, the remainder is your boat budget.

As a live aboard you will want space and storage. Keep that in mind. A pilot house is a plus, dodger and Bimini a must.

Beyond that know the big ticket expenses: motor, rigging, leaking deck hardware. Do not buy a boat with teak decks. Hire a surveyor before you buy.

[WingRyder]

Originally Posted by SV Sailfish

But if I were a newbie, I would hang out where the sailboats are.

As a newbie myself, herein lies the problem. I live an hour from the coast, and I don't know anyone out there (at the coast) that owns a sailboat.

I guess if you already have a boat, it seems pretty obvious. But I have been out to the marina's in my area, and have only seen a scant few people heading from the laundry room to their boat, etc. From a boatless perspective, it seems like a closed loop. The phrase, "Start hanging out with people who have boats", sounds the same as, "Start hanging out back stage." If you already
have a back stage pass, it seems pretty simple, but it is a sealed loop, that isn't readily accessible to outsiders.... and rightly so! Once I get a boat, I don't want a bunch of looky loos trying to bum a day sail.

I understand the point the OP is trying to make, that is, without a vast amount of sailing experience, how do you get to know the quirks of so many boats? For instance, 'this one is great in rough seas, but doesn't sail upwind well, ... while this one handles great but isn't built for blue water', ... there are so many variables to consider. With limited sailing experience, it is very difficult to know what factors are going to be important to you a few years from now.

[john61ct]

If the sailing life is important enough to you, relocate.

[nimbex1970]

Originally Posted by SV Sailfish

If I were a professor of statistics, I would give you an A+ on your paper.



But if I were a newbie, I would hang out where the sailboats are. Walk the docks. (a lot) Then walk them some more. Eat, sleep and breath around marinas, yacht clubs, dry storage, work yards. club races, chandleries, etc. Put enough effort in and soon you will have a PHD in what not to buy. (very important)

Get off the computer. Dump that spread sheet and get out there and wander the docks. Good luck to you!

This ^^^^ in a nutshell, we are new too. I posted elsewhere, had a plan to spend $150k, got bank approved, then with the limits on 20 years old, full insurance and limited sail experience.. we ditched the plan.

We Hit up the closest five marinas, brought a cooler full of drinks and just chatted up the folks there. THey all helped us decide (for us), didn't need a morgan, we wanted sailing now.. and how to buy affordable for our needs.

We found ours on yachtworld, but narrowed the searches to where we were skilled to sail the boat from a purchase. We also had a marina picked out to know where we would keep her. Time is money and money is TIME. We accidentally found one in the marina we rent boats from. We thought the price would be too out of our league and didn't check on it, mistake, until yachtworld showed different.

So in many marina's there are sailors to chat with and share a beer, as well as brokers. Stick your head in and look at what they have. We compromised on a few things of wants, I think everyone does.. so set up a reasonable mandatory list and a wish list.

Good luck, she is out there waiting for you!

[sailorboy1]

I don't really understand these threads about it being hard to find a boat.

When I got my first boat I shopped on Yacthworld.com and selected 5 boats to look at. I put an offer on one and it got "I'll think about it" form the owner, so cancelled it and made an offer on the next boat that I ended up getting. This was my first boat and was a Cal-39. The whole "shopping" process took 2 weeks.

Did the same basic thing for my current boat except I only went to look at this boat! Process took 3 days.

[rbk]

Just a note on walking docks ans talking to folks. If you see someone in the middle of something or more importantly docking, come back later. Nothing worse than people chatting you up right in the middle of something, or complete newbies grabbing at boats or dock lines; use common sense, you may think you’re being helpful but most times you’re just in the way.