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Old 19-12-2012, 06:08   #91
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Re: Fin Keel Strength ?

If you worry about your keel falling off then stay at home where you are safe. The cruising places have enough people enjoying them we could have, but dont need more.
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Old 19-12-2012, 06:11   #92
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Re: Fin Keel Strength ?

Quote:
Originally Posted by K_V_B View Post
I have not come across a boat that did not have substantial reinforcements where the keel is attached. "Just bolted to the bilge floor" will not get your boat sold.

Bilge floor !! or do you see any stringer or beam suport in this bolts.....
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Old 19-12-2012, 06:26   #93
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Re: Fin Keel Strength ?

I can feel safe in any kind of keel boat if is properly made it, having owned 2 fin keel boats i know that, no worrys , and no one is saying in this forum that fin keels are going to fall down tomorrow for god shake!! and i still enjoy the flavour of fin keels boats , but guys this topic is about fin keel strenght!!

Like in other scary topics , sooner or later the scuadra of fin keelers try to turn the debate in a full keel v fin keel war or some smartasses saying that fin keels dont fall of , or my fin keel is there for 50 years i got 100 groundings and is ok ,
Fin keels dont fall off often . Fact.
Fin keels in some boats are prone to problems.Fact.
Fin keels strenght in some boats are equal to a well full encapsulated keel . Fact.
Fin keels disasters cost lives . Fact.
Fin keel is the most important part of the boat . Fact.

Now go ahead and keep going blind, your boat maybe is well designed and build it but others not, and this is a FACT.
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Old 19-12-2012, 06:44   #94
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Re: Fin Keel Strength ?

Quote:
Originally Posted by neilpride View Post
I can feel safe in any kind of keel boat if is properly made it, having owned 2 fin keel boats i know that, no worrys , and no one is saying in this forum that fin keels are going to fall down tomorrow for god shake!! and i still enjoy the flavour of fin keels boats , but guys this topic is about fin keel strenght!!

Like in other scary topics , sooner or later the scuadra of fin keelers try to turn the debate in a full keel v fin keel war or some smartasses saying that fin keels dont fall of , or my fin keel is there for 50 years i got 100 groundings and is ok ,
Fin keels dont fall off often . Fact.
Fin keels in some boats are prone to problems.Fact.
Fin keels strenght in some boats are equal to a well full encapsulated keel . Fact.
Fin keels disasters cost lives . Fact.
Fin keel is the most important part of the boat . Fact.

Now go ahead and keep going blind, your boat maybe is well designed and build it but others not, and this is a FACT.
There you go Gypsynurse. I think Neilpride just about sums it up. What you should get out of this discussion is that there are valid arguments on both sides of this issue. Since you are looking for an older boat your concerns about the keel are warranted especially if you intend to Go Blue Water.

If I was enamored with an old or new boat with a bolt on keel I would check the grid structure and the bolts (go with a surveyor). If the bolts are attached to the bilge floor (as shown above) are not accessible or require the tanks to be removed I’d walk away. Otherwise, if she passes survey, go for it. Just make sure you keep up with the maintenance required of bolt on fins particularly after grounding.

With regard to encapsulated ballast your maintenance issues are practically none existent and a sounding of the hull during survey should determine any voids. Any voids would be drilled to see if there is water entrapment then dry out and repair. This is a relatively easy fix.

What ever you do, do not shrug your shoulders and think because keels falling off is a "rare" occurrence it cannot happen to you. Murphy is watching….

RT
PS Almost forgot. With any boat you purchase you should go to the Owners Forums. If there are keel issues they will be discussed as well as all other problems associated with that boat. That’s a quick and easy Google search….
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Old 19-12-2012, 07:14   #95
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Re: Fin Keel Strength ?

Quote:
Originally Posted by MarkJ View Post
If you worry about your keel falling off then stay at home where you are safe. The cruising places have enough people enjoying them we could have, but dont need more.

I wouldn't be concerned about it Mark. 90+% of people looking to convince others about how dangerous are our boats are going to spend more time in the worry and fear world that they really aren't going anywhere overall.

I doubt that many people you are met in all your travels have been spending much time worrying about the reasons their boats can not "do it"!
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Old 19-12-2012, 07:41   #96
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Re: Fin Keel Strength ?

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I wouldn't be concerned about it Mark. 90+% of people looking to convince others about how dangerous are our boats are going to spend more time in the worry and fear world that they really aren't going anywhere overall.

I doubt that many people you are met in all your travels have been spending much time worrying about the reasons their boats can not "do it"!
What is your point Don, ignore the issue? You are one of those who shrug their shoulders and say it is a non-issue. Anyone who has been around boats and boat yards know differently.

However rare you think this event is it should be of concern to the prospective buyer. To ignore it is ignorance...

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Old 19-12-2012, 07:50   #97
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Re: Fin Keel Strength ?

My point is that there a lot more important things to be concerned about and you can find just as many internal ballast boats wth problems as with bolted on keels! So get a total boat and not just a keel.

Spend your time worrying about more important things, like the condition of your hose clamps!
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Old 19-12-2012, 09:02   #98
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Re: Fin Keel Strength ?

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Originally Posted by neilpride View Post
But Maine please, we talking about maintenance or fixing problems???

A perfect full keel with no collisions or water ingress is free of maintenace mate, when a fin keel in the same conditions have maintenace isues right?

Cheers...
Now to put a little wrench in this statement. For those that don't know,
Most all wood boats in FULL KEEL design, have a BOLTED ON iron forfoot for balast
Weighing up in thousands of pounds.
Being the date most builders switched or started building in fiberglass to the date or
Around when bolted on fin keeps showed up on the market, the era of the full keel fiberglass boat is very short.
So bolted on keels have been around , and even in full keel wood boats for many more
Years than a fiberglass full keel.
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Old 19-12-2012, 09:45   #99
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Re: Fin Keel Strength ?

Lets stay on topic.

Just to remind everyone the topic is Fin Keel Strength.
It is not IQ of an an owner that that has chosen a different keel to the one on your boat.
A number of posts that are just personal attacks, adding nothing to the discussion, have been deleted.
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Old 19-12-2012, 11:48   #100
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Re: Fin Keel Strength ?

Well here is another keel that fell off after they parked it on a sand bank, but no one was hurt. Shame nice boat.

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Old 19-12-2012, 11:52   #101
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Re: Fin Keel Strength ?

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Originally Posted by Pete7 View Post
Well here is another keel that fell off after they parked it on a sand bank, but no one was hurt. Shame nice boat.

Maybe would have been Ok if that spade rudder hadn't gotten in the way

But I also notice that the strut and prop look OK and it is almost like the keel has been removed for something else.
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Old 19-12-2012, 12:03   #102
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Re: Fin Keel Strength ?

Skipper parked it on the Brambles a sand bank in the Solent; I think during a race. I watched them lift the boat up from floating on its side to upright again a couple of days later with a crane so took the photo.

Big hole where the keel should have been so looks like the pounding in the waves punched the keel through the hull.

Of course it wouldn't have happened in a full keeled yacht, not because it's they are any better but because it wouldn't have been there racing.


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Old 19-12-2012, 12:04   #103
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Re: Fin Keel Strength ?

Slightly different angle

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Old 19-12-2012, 14:21   #104
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Re: Fin Keel Strength ?

Or this one, a Jeaneau Sun Odyssey 42 struck a rock in Scotland breaking the hull and breaking the rudder , i guess certains collisions break everything no matter if the keel have a good suport like the Jeaneau.
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Old 19-12-2012, 15:30   #105
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Re: Fin Keel Strength ?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Pete7 View Post
Skipper parked it on the Brambles a sand bank in the Solent; I think during a race. I watched them lift the boat up from floating on its side to upright again a couple of days later with a crane so took the photo.

Big hole where the keel should have been so looks like the pounding in the waves punched the keel through the hull.

Of course it wouldn't have happened in a full keeled yacht, not because it's they are any better but because it wouldn't have been there racing.


Pete
Of course it wouldn't have happened because full keelers would never show up for the race. But if for example a W32 landed upon the Brambles, it surely wouldn't have lost its keel.

This type of boat for racing, acceptable, as long as you don't run into anything. Cruising... Well.... You know how I feel.

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