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Old 27-12-2013, 08:26   #106
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Re: Fake Boats?

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Originally Posted by Vasco View Post
Actually I don't find any snobbery among cruisers. Once you start cruising there's no BS regarding which boat is better. We're all in boats and that's what brings us together. I think those stuck in marinas or armchairs are the ones who argue the merits of different boats.
It's been a while since I read anything here but not surprised to see these type discussions continue to persist here on this forum.

From reading on other forums, it appears this is the only one in which these academic discussions exist.

Apparently, this is the place where all the "internet experts" play.

Back to the real world.
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Old 27-12-2013, 09:04   #107
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pirate Re: Fake Boats?

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Originally Posted by S/V Illusion View Post
It's been a while since I read anything here but not surprised to see these type discussions continue to persist here on this forum.

From reading on other forums, it appears this is the only one in which these academic discussions exist.

Apparently, this is the place where all the "internet experts" play.

Back to the real world.
I get yer point but dunno why ya bothered.


Why'd ya bother?
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Old 27-12-2013, 09:43   #108
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Re: Fake Boats?

I am considering opening a fake boat brokerage. For a fraction of the price of a real boat you can have a fake boat.
Included are photoshopped pictures of you sailing. Fake log books fake maintenance bills. The lx edition includes all of the prior but with added fake stories facebook postings with fake positions with cliff hanger stories of disasters and averted disasters the new owners didn't really have to struggle through. A subscription to seatow and a reduced insurance premium if hire a professional captain. Hmmm I could refit the boat for almost nothing and upgrade electronics at only a slight up charge.
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Old 27-12-2013, 09:47   #109
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Re: Fake Boats?

How much extra for the fake cruising blog about my trip down the ICW?
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Old 27-12-2013, 09:53   #110
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Re: Fake Boats?

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I get yer point but dunno why ya bothered.


Why'd ya bother?
I think he/she is trying to say this is an inappropriate discussion and we should cease and desist.
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Old 27-12-2013, 10:06   #111
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Re: Fake Boats?

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I think he/she is trying to say this is an inappropriate discussion and we should cease and desist.
Not at all. Rather, it was to point out that these type judgments only seem to occur on this forum and usually written by the same people. As someone already stated, they never occur in remote anchorages in far off places. Telling!

Now to cancel the email notification of posts
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Old 27-12-2013, 10:14   #112
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Re: Fake Boats?

Blogs are apart of the premium package that have not yet been priced for fake boats. The premium package includes blogs, free water at select marinas, A new gen anchor with amsteel snubber. Free unlimited pump outs with a guarantee that you won't have a toilet problem. As a limited one time bonus included is a pirate shield so you don't have to deal with having a fake gun onboard .you can opt out if you want a gun and a really good gun story on your blog but you have to sign a disclaimer.
Fake guns are available at an extra cost.
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Old 27-12-2013, 10:33   #113
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Re: Fake Boats?

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As someone already stated, they never occur in remote anchorages in far off places. Telling!
Very telling. It tells us that these discussion are not of much interest to people who have already selected their boat. They are, however, of great interest to many people trying to decide what boat to buy.

When you are shopping for your first large boat it can be very hard to sort through all the information to get a clear understanding of what different brands represent. When I was doing that conversions like this one, or similar ones on:

Sailnet: Production Boats and the Limits - SailNet Community
Sailing Anarchy: Catalina, Beneteau or hunter - Cruising Anarchy - Sailing Anarchy Forums

Where a huge help in narrowing down what it was I wanted in a boat.
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Old 27-12-2013, 10:41   #114
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Re: Fake Boats?

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Originally Posted by sabray View Post
I am considering opening a fake boat brokerage. For a fraction of the price of a real boat you can have a fake boat.
Included are photoshopped pictures of you sailing. Fake log books fake maintenance bills. The lx edition includes all of the prior but with added fake stories facebook postings with fake positions with cliff hanger stories of disasters and averted disasters the new owners didn't really have to struggle through. A subscription to seatow and a reduced insurance premium if hire a professional captain. Hmmm I could refit the boat for almost nothing and upgrade electronics at only a slight up charge.
Does the package price include photoshopping in super models with fake boobs?

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Old 27-12-2013, 10:53   #115
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Re: Fake Boats?

Perhaps the questions should be? How is the hull layed up? How are the bulkheads tabbed? How is the keel attached? Are the rigging dimensions a tad heavy? What grade of metal is used? Are there backing plates at high stress areas? How are thru hull penetrations treated? What is the makeup of the deck? What are the tanks made of? How are the tanks fastened? How accessible are the componenents? Are the usual maintenance pieces easy to access? What grade are the accessories ie sunbrella, sails, rigging terminations, plumbing, .......
How is the cockpit set up? Is their a cockpit well or direct over board drain?
Can the decks drain easily? Can the hatches and ports be secured well? Are they of quality to withstand a good beating? Is the rigging easy to use, conveinant, safe? Etc....
Guess you could set up a spread sheet pretty easy to evaluate all these questions. Then add more.
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Old 27-12-2013, 11:35   #116
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Re: Fake Boats?

You can go on a virtual voyage for a fraction of the price, cross the equator, get your ear pierced, make landfall in the south Pacific, be greeted by topless polynesian women with flower leis. The whole nine.
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Old 27-12-2013, 11:52   #117
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Re: Fake Boats?

Really I wanted to know why people regard certain production boats as "light weight" or seem to talk down about them as if they are made of an inferior nature. From my experience I have not witnessed what I had been reading so I was curious if I have been missing something. Maybe I have been misinterpreting previous threads but the feeling I was getting is that some people did not think crossing an ocean in a production boat was smart. There have been a lot of great points brought up here and a lot of joking banter which I expected, but from what it looks like the overall consensus is that most production boats are well constructed and reliable.

Obviously every boat may need upgrades (such as like suggested making sure the winches have backing plates instead of washers), but I wanted to be sure that there wasn't some condition I wasn't aware of where Brand X does not bond component A securely to the flux capacitor and because of such when you get into bigger then 5 meter waves the fluffa valve gets stuck open and kills everyone on board. As opposed to a custom boat where they use 2 flux capacitors to mitigate this problem.

As before in a lot of my questions I try to be humble enough to know that even after sailing for 20+ years my experience is limited to only my experience and like to check and make sure that your experience has not taught you something different that may help me.

Thank you again to all that have replied it has been informational and entertaining.
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Old 27-12-2013, 12:17   #118
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Re: Fake Boats?

Ontherocks83, yeah we are a plucky bunch and get side tracked easily. The problem I have with newer FRP boats is the builders equate structural rigidity to strength, which in some ways it is, but it has led to thinner hulls using longitudinal stringers to make up for the lack of mass and to create a stiffer vessel. I don't like cored hulls for the same reason, if you happen run into something (which can happen) then you stand a chance of punching a hole in the hull. I like the vacuum bagging technique because it makes the resin uniform throughout the layup for a stronger hull. Back in the day, they were unsure of the strength of fiberglass, so they over compensated by laying up thicker hulls and everything in the vessel had thicker layups to insure structural soundness, then they went to the chopper gun for layups and I don't trust those boats either, though I have operated plenty of them in bad weather with no ill effects. There are those that would argue that it is overkill, not me. Opinions are like noses everyone has one and they all smell. If you went with a Hans Christian, or some other traditionally built boat it would probably be okay. The newer higher dollar boats seem to be okay too.
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Old 27-12-2013, 12:19   #119
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Re: Fake Boats?

Quote:
Originally Posted by ontherocks83 View Post
Really I wanted to know why people regard certain production boats as "light weight" or seem to talk down about them as if they are made of an inferior nature. From my experience I have not witnessed what I had been reading so I was curious if I have been missing something. Maybe I have been misinterpreting previous threads but the feeling I was getting is that some people did not think crossing an ocean in a production boat was smart. There have been a lot of great points brought up here and a lot of joking banter which I expected, but from what it looks like the overall consensus is that most production boats are well constructed and reliable.

Obviously every boat may need upgrades (such as like suggested making sure the winches have backing plates instead of washers), but I wanted to be sure that there wasn't some condition I wasn't aware of where Brand X does not bond component A securely to the flux capacitor and because of such when you get into bigger then 5 meter waves the fluffa valve gets stuck open and kills everyone on board. As opposed to a custom boat where they use 2 flux capacitors to mitigate this problem.

As before in a lot of my questions I try to be humble enough to know that even after sailing for 20+ years my experience is limited to only my experience and like to check and make sure that your experience has not taught you something different that may help me.

Thank you again to all that have replied it has been informational and entertaining.
Here's one example: To bilge or not to bilge?

Many of the production boats on the market today including the Hunter we owned and the Jenneau 54ds we seriously considered buying don't have a bilge; instead they have a small bilge pump located below the galley floorboards at a low spot where the water tends to drain towards when the boat is level.

On a "blue water boat," a proper bilge can be very important for safety reasons; here's a good example: On or cruise between Mallorca and Ibiza last summer, I noticed when I went below to make lunch that the bilge pump was running both times.... that's odd I thought, time to investigate. Turns out the watermaker had a hose clamp let go and the high pressure pumps were delivering seawater into the bilge at the equivalent rate as a broken-off medium sized through hill fitting. I repaired the hose... no problem. Our bilge, which is a deep well, approximately 2ft x 2ft x 4.5ft deep along with two oversized bilge pumps were able to handle the seawater incursion, and allow enough time to discover the breach and make the repair.

On our previous boat which didn't have a bilge, the hull would have probably flooded up to the floorboards, flooded the batteries and shorted out all the electric connections leading to the bilge pump in a matter of minutes. we would have probably discovered the same leak by first seeing water up over the floorboards.

Our friend had a similar occurance on his new Discovery 55 that he's sailing around the world, only his involved a broken fresh water fitting which flooded 200 gallons plus into the bilge.

Some of the major manufacturers no longer think a bilge is important enough to have on a boat.... I think it is, so we decided against the Jeanneau... which is otherwise, a lovely boat. If the bilge is missing.... what other shortcuts did they take? Ways to save money?
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Old 27-12-2013, 12:28   #120
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Re: Fake Boats?

Really you would need to go to the manufacturers and ask them how and what the hull is made of? How the hull to deck joint is formed? Etc.....then compare the boats you like.
The question is to general. Some are designed for rough weather others are obviously not.
Probably you have not sailed in foul weather. Even good heavy built stuff needs constant check ups. A little extra beef costs money. Reduces maintenance. Even well built stuff has a weak spot. Knowing and understanding the hull, the rigging , the sail quality, the plumbing, etc qualifies a lot of the price point.
Is something wrong with a production boat? No is their a reason it costs less? Yes. The reason could be any number of quality issues.
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