Fake Boats?

[Blue Crab]

Originally Posted by Kenomac

We've owned two production boats, an O'Day 20 and the Hunter 450. The Hunter had the keel come loose when the keel bolts corroded through. So that would be 50% of the production boats we've owned have had a keel failure.

We don't expect to have a problem with our Oyster keel. No reports of any Oysters loosing their keels.

Geez.


50% is like half, man.

[scuba0_1]

I have decided to start a new business keel and rudder salvage. I am gonna make it rich just based on the posters here. Please start posting locations of lost parts thanks. What's that dear, I can't guit my day job yet.......

[scotty c-m]

Comes down to the choices you make. Heavy has advantages, but so does speed. Maintenance is crucial. Any of the 40-50 foot boats mentioned is going to have their own advantages and modern construction techniques add strength. That 45' Oyster in the video is awesome, but any small boat (and yes, a 45 foot sailboat is small in the perspective of the ocean) in those conditions will require care in handling. Gear failure is a worry for even the best kept yacht. Finally, all of us take a chance being on the ocean. You pay your money and you take your chances. What is a true blue water boat? - probably none of them.

[RainDog]

Another way to approach this question is: if you want to take a stock production boat and cross oceans, what modifications would you have to make?

One answer to this is from Patrick Childress who prepared a Catalina 27 for a circumnavigation. The details of what he did are listed here: Preparing a Catalina 27 for offshore

This is a older and very small boat, and not everything he did perhaps had to be done, but it is good food for thought about what the limitation are to a stock coastal cruiser. One thing you will see on his list, that is perhaps not obvious is securing the tanks. A few hundred pounds that are not attached firmly to the hull could be a real issue if you are on your beam.

[boatman61]

To be honest it always surprise's me the amount of work/prep folk do before setting out on a crossing.. is it really necessary or is it more for psychological reassurance.??
If you've been maintaining your boat as you should.. it should be ready to go as it is.. bar the provisioning

[Jim Cate]

Originally Posted by sailorboy1

Tell the rest of the story where the earlier owner kept the boat at a slip that wasn't deep enough for the boat so the twice a day the boat sit on it's keel so that the tide basically torqued it back and forth. And yet is somehow Hunters fault that the keel joint cam loose.

Well, Sailorboy, most boats can easily withstand the issue of sitting on the keel in part of the tidal cycle, so yes, I do see that failure (if as you describe it) to be a fault of Hunter's... either design or execution.

But as others have said, not all Hunter vessels have keel or rudder issues. The number of problems that have been reported seems larger than it ought to be, and that should get a potential buyers attention IMO, but not necessarily rule out the whole marque from consideration.

Cheers,

Jim

[a64pilot]

Originally Posted by boatman61

To be honest it always surprise's me the amount of work/prep folk do before setting out on a crossing.. is it really necessary or is it more for psychological reassurance.??
If you've been maintaining your boat as you should.. it should be ready to go as it is.. bar the provisioning

In my purely uneducated perspective I think a LOT of prep would be necessary. I would say a normal well kept boat is simply not to standards required for a Circumnavigation. I would look at standing rigging entirely differently if I were to start a circumnavigation as opposed to a trip to the Caribbean, goes for engine, electronics, electrical generating capacity, spares, well just about everything. Before I were to go around I'd want everything in as perfect a condition as possible

[RainDog]

Originally Posted by boatman61

To be honest it always surprise's me the amount of work/prep folk do before setting out on a crossing.. is it really necessary or is it more for psychological reassurance.??
If you've been maintaining your boat as you should.. it should be ready to go as it is.. bar the provisioning

Having owned a Catalina 27, I would for sure want to do significant upgrades. It would be very wet below without significant modification and the companionway is way too large.

[sailorboy1]

Originally Posted by Jim Cate

Well, Sailorboy, most boats can easily withstand the issue of sitting on the keel in part of the tidal cycle, so yes, I do see that failure (if as you describe it) to be a fault of Hunter's... either design or execution.

You got to be kidding. I have always thought of you as a more serious member here. But if you are going to say that it is a builders fault that the stress of sitting on the keel, refloating, and then going back onto the keel as the tide goes in and out and in and out over and over is something the boat builder should plan for, well I guess I was wrong.

[a64pilot]

I too have heard of a keel bolt failure, maybe the same one?
Question, wouldn't checking the torque on the keel bolts determine if there were a problem or not?

[Jim Cate]

Originally Posted by sailorboy1

You got to be kidding. I have always thought of you as a more serious member here. But if you are going to say that it is a builders fault that the stress of sitting on the keel, refloating, and then going back onto the keel as the tide goes in and out and in and out over and over is something the boat builder should plan for, well I guess I was wrong.

So, I guess that you were indeed wrong about me, for I do think that a boat should be able to endure that sort of usage without harm. I've been in such berths from time to time... don't think that they are uncommon and certainly should not cause damage to the boat.

Realistically, the stresses on the keel bolts and hull structure are far greater when the boat is well heeled than in the situation that you describe. I rather doubt that Kenomac's keel issues were related to the berthing that you attribute them to.

Anyhow, sorry to disappoint you, but that is my opinion.

Jim

[boatman61]

If you mean one of these the only mod I'd want/need to take it solo to Europe would be a furler... I'm just gentle with boats...
Hell.. if I could take a Hunter across.. and these are supposed to be better built...





Don't suppose anyone wants to bet me one I couldn't/wouldn't make it...

[Cap Erict3]

A big chunk of my sea time was spent on a real boat. 760' long, 180' beam, 60' of freeboard and a crown over 200' off the water. Rode out a micro burst on it once. Pretty hairy. Did the edges of Katrina. Not as bad.

Our plastic boats are just toys. Mother Nature rules.

It is like taking pride in being the tallest midget.

[Kenomac]

Originally Posted by sailorboy1

Tell the rest of the story where the earlier owner kept the boat at a slip that wasn't deep enough for the boat so the twice a day the boat sit on it's keel so that the tide basically torqued it back and forth. And yet is somehow Hunters fault that the keel joint cam loose.

Not true. The Swan 40 docked next to the warf with a much deeper keel had no problems with the depth in Sausalito. I just checked, the marina and slip were dredged to 11 feet, the Keel on the Hunter 5' 6"... Unlikely the situation sailorboy describes. Actually, you can look at the chart yourself to verify the actual depth.

The keel came loose because of the failed keel join that was only secured by a honeycomb joint, without a flat surface, which allowed seawater to break through the bond and corrode the keel bolts. Would you like me to post all of the pictures of the repair? And the location of the slip? I will if you wish, then you can see for yourself the substandard construction of the interior of a Hunter keel.

[Sondor]

I used to think knocking production boats was just a good natured lark.

It's starting to sound like it's done by those who feel the need to justify having paid 3x what an average boat costs...

Couldn't agree more w/ Capt Erict3!