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Old 28-12-2013, 08:47   #151
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Re: Fake Boats?

Too bad you put a green engine in your boat, LOL. Sounds like it will do the job real well although personally its not my cup of tea. Hats off to you for all the work you've done!
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Old 28-12-2013, 08:59   #152
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Re: Fake Boats?

Sounds like it might come out a winner in a collision with a shipping container.

Slow ain't the worst thing in the world.
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Old 28-12-2013, 12:47   #153
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Re: Fake Boats?

Ironworker, I sure hope that your boat has a BIG sailplan! Fifteen tons of design displacement for a 36 foot, full keel hull is going to take a lot of power to drive.

IMO, one of the desirable characteristics of a "blue water" (or any other) boat is a sail plan adequate to drive the boat well, including in light airs. In your case, the combination of very high D:WL and a lot of wetted area will require some big sails to get her going in anything short of stiff winds.

But then, perhaps you already knew this and made your choices accordingly... as RS said above, "not my cup of tea", but I admire anyone who completes designing, building and sailing a cruising boat.

Keep us advised of progress.

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Old 28-12-2013, 17:37   #154
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Jesus 15 tones over 36 feet. You'll be using that diesel a lot. And that presumably LOL , what's the water line say 32 !!

Build a boat like a tank and it will sail like one.

You say there's 8000 lbs in the keel , that's about 4 tonnes right ? , Jesus where's the other 11 tonnes ?? What's her AVS , could be awful.

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Old 28-12-2013, 21:03   #155
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im new to this but i think im building a real blue water boat ill list its quilitys and yall tell me if im close. Its a hanna designed Carol ketch Gaff rigged all steel. The boat weights 15 tons and it has a full keel 8000 pounds of steel punch outs and tar fill up the keel . I have three 75 gallon water tanks that sit right on top of keel and bolted in .the chain locker and 200 gallon fuel are also below water level and centered . I have a 3cyl volvo penta for enguine this boat is a double ender and built like a ship shes 36ft long .Its a copy of the white seal that gary trobridge built and sailed around the world. Do yall think this boat is even close to a blue water boat.
Please post a photo. When you say 15 ton do you really mean 15000 lbs. 200 gal fuel is a lot should that be 20 gal. Your numbers and available space just don't compute. Do you have room for all the boaty bits,
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Old 28-12-2013, 21:30   #156
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Re: Fake Boats?

His numbers may be correct, keep in mind the British Channel Cutter displaces something over 14000 lbs. and that's 28 feet long plus this gentlemans boat is built in steel and generally they are heavier in the smaller sizes (below 40 feet). It may or may not be a good sailor as it depends on the size of the rig. Heavy does not necessarily mean slow as the BCC and Cape George sailboats have shown however if it doesn't have the sail area it needs it will be a motorboat unless the winds get up. there.
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Old 28-12-2013, 23:59   #157
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Re: Fake Boats?

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Originally Posted by robert sailor View Post
His numbers may be correct, keep in mind the British Channel Cutter displaces something over 14000 lbs. and that's 28 feet long plus this gentlemans boat is built in steel and generally they are heavier in the smaller sizes (below 40 feet). It may or may not be a good sailor as it depends on the size of the rig. Heavy does not necessarily mean slow as the BCC and Cape George sailboats have shown however if it doesn't have the sail area it needs it will be a motorboat unless the winds get up. there.
Uhh, Robert, this chap says that his 30 foot boat (not that much longer than your BCC example) weighs 30,000 lbs (15 tons, and that's short tons to boot). That is not a good match to 28 feet and 14000 lbs.

I believe that it will be a pig to sail, but I am a prejudiced old fart who likes boats that perform well.

Jim
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Old 29-12-2013, 00:10   #158
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Re: Fake Boats?

You and me both Jim...not for me. I was only making the point that heavy doesn't necessarily mean slow and many of todays sailors think only the new modern flat bottom light weight boats can actually sail. On one of my Pacific crossings I was in touch (SSB) with another cruiser going our way. A 40 foot Cape George Cutter, full keel, super heavy and was knocking off 150 mile days and one 170 miler so I was impressed. Ran into them a few weeks later and they had a huge rig on that boat and it sailed so I had an immediate change in my thinking of what kind of boat was fast. Still have no desire to own a heavy full keel boat but I do appreciate that some of them can sail.
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Old 29-12-2013, 00:14   #159
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Re: Fake Boats?

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You and me both Jim...not for me. I was only making the point that heavy doesn't necessarily mean slow and many of todays sailors think only the new modern flat bottom light weight boats can actually sail. On one of my Pacific crossings I was in touch (SSB) with another cruiser going our way. A 40 foot Cape George Cutter, full keel, super heavy and was knocking off 150 mile days and one 170 miler so I was impressed. Ran into them a few weeks later and they had a huge rig on that boat and it sailed so I had an immediate change in my thinking of what kind of boat was fast. Still have no desire to own a heavy full keel boat but I do appreciate that some of them can sail.
Yeah, but the numbers for this boat are ridiculous... not in the same league with a Cape George or BCC... that was my point.

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Old 29-12-2013, 00:14   #160
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Re: Fake Boats?

in the 80's i bought a cheap multihull off a norwegian guy who'd come out to NZ, bought the thing up north and sailed it around most of NZ. I took the thing out to sea a couple of times and it was the scariest thing i've ever done in a boat - it was built to capsize, and the fact that it didnt was more due to luck than good management in my case. My conclusion was - it aint so much the boat, its the skipper. Think about the kind of boats the early portuguese used to travel round most of the planet in the 15th/16th centuries, if you are determined, skilled, and a bit lucky, you can probably put out to sea on just about anything floating today. Whats a real boat? What do you think Vasco da Gama would have done with a Beneteau 50?
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Old 29-12-2013, 00:16   #161
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Re: Fake Boats?

No argument Jim, not in the same league
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Old 29-12-2013, 01:58   #162
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Re: Fake Boats?

Seein' as how we've wandered a bit from the point here, how about a listing that looks like

marque: things that need fixing: a-z
marque B: things that need fixing or upgrading: a-z...and so on


Something logical that will allow the OP to consider options in a reasonable format?

A
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Old 29-12-2013, 04:40   #163
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You and me both Jim...not for me. I was only making the point that heavy doesn't necessarily mean slow and many of todays sailors think only the new modern flat bottom light weight boats can actually sail. On one of my Pacific crossings I was in touch (SSB) with another cruiser going our way. A 40 foot Cape George Cutter, full keel, super heavy and was knocking off 150 mile days and one 170 miler so I was impressed. Ran into them a few weeks later and they had a huge rig on that boat and it sailed so I had an immediate change in my thinking of what kind of boat was fast. Still have no desire to own a heavy full keel boat but I do appreciate that some of them can sail.
Of course heavy means slow, unless you compensate for it with larger ( expensive) sail plans. Where this " heavy doesnt mean slow came from I don't know. A 40 foot boat knocking off 150 mile days is a " reasonable boat" hence for cruiseing we tend to look at a compromise solution between motion at sea and speed.

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Old 29-12-2013, 04:43   #164
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Originally Posted by charliehows View Post
in the 80's i bought a cheap multihull off a norwegian guy who'd come out to NZ, bought the thing up north and sailed it around most of NZ. I took the thing out to sea a couple of times and it was the scariest thing i've ever done in a boat - it was built to capsize, and the fact that it didnt was more due to luck than good management in my case. My conclusion was - it aint so much the boat, its the skipper. Think about the kind of boats the early portuguese used to travel round most of the planet in the 15th/16th centuries, if you are determined, skilled, and a bit lucky, you can probably put out to sea on just about anything floating today. Whats a real boat? What do you think Vasco da Gama would have done with a Beneteau 50?
Yes and at the time of Vasco de Gama , ships went down and foundered all over the place. Today , give. The numbers sailing , very few do.

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Old 29-12-2013, 06:35   #165
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Re: Fake Boats?

This is one heavy boat my dad and i copyed the white seal built buy gary trobridge back in the50 he sailed around the world on this 15 ton 36ft sailboat. He says his best day was 182 natical miles i dont know if this is true im not a sailor yet still trying to finish this carol ketch takes alot of time when you have to work full time.the sail plan calls for jib is 176 main 350 mizzen 167 square ft. It got him around the world.Take a look at conversation with a world voyager by gerry trobridge white seal and it tell you alot about his boat im copying and i will try to post some pictures if i can figger out how not good on computors thanks.
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