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Old 01-01-2011, 18:37   #16
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Long keel with centreboard - best of both worlds. ... Ah, but then less space in the cabin. Dang
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Old 01-01-2011, 18:44   #17
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when it comes to keelboats, big boats need big keels. if you want a little keel, get a little boat. if you want a big boat, get a big keel to go with it. little boats can go places big boats can't go, and big boats can handle nastiness with which little boats have trouble.
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Old 01-01-2011, 18:56   #18
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when it comes to keelboats, big boats need big keels. if you want a little keel, get a little boat. if you want a big boat, get a big keel to go with it. little boats can go places big boats can't go, and big boats can handle nastiness with which little boats have trouble.
Yes all that is good advice and true but one clarifying point: soundly constructed and well designed little boats, properly handled, can go (virtually) everwhere big boats can go - it's just that the comfort factor is compromised. And of course they're slower.
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Old 01-01-2011, 19:20   #19
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Yes all that is good advice and true but one clarifying point: soundly constructed and well designed little boats, properly handled, can go (virtually) everwhere big boats can go - it's just that the comfort factor is compromised.
Yes (to emphasize that "draft is a personal matter"), and well designed big boats that lay their big keel in a more horizontal fassion can go many of the places little ones go also (with a bit of a compromise in hard on the wind performance).
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Old 02-01-2011, 03:14   #20
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That's true too. If you're happy to hang some 44 gallon drums of water off your boom, you can get through most tight spots.

Bloke I know was bringing a wonderful old carvel vessel, over 25 tonnes worth, back along the west coast of Eye Peninsula, heading for Adelaide. Things got a bit rough out there - well, it is the southern ocean - and he needed to bring it into Coffin Bay. But the entrance can be shallow at low tide, and of course it was low tide. So the 44 gallon drums was his solution and it worked.

I always take my hat off to those types.
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Old 02-01-2011, 03:15   #21
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Yes (to emphasize that "draft is a personal matter"), and well designed big boats that lay their big keel in a more horizontal fassion can go many of the places little ones go also (with a bit of a compromise in hard on the wind performance).
That's true too. And if you're happy to hang some 44 gallon drums of water off your boom, you can get through most tight spots no matter how much you've got below.

Bloke I know was bringing a wonderful old carvel vessel, over 25 tonnes worth, back along the west coast of Eyre Peninsula, heading for Adelaide. Things got a bit rough out there - well, it is the southern ocean - and he needed to bring it into Coffin Bay. But the entrance can be shallow at low tide, and of course it was low tide. So the 44 gallon drums was his solution and it worked.

I always take my hat off to those types.
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Old 02-01-2011, 19:33   #22
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Could I get some input...?

Looking at two 42s7's, one has the tall rig and 7'7" draft (I believe it is lead), and the other is standard rig with the 5'11" Iron keel.
Would also appreciate thoughts on buying Hull number 1, as one of them is the first off the line for the series.

Thanks for the feedback.
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Old 02-01-2011, 20:10   #23
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Could I get some input...?

Looking at two 42s7's, one has the tall rig and 7'7" draft (I believe it is lead), and the other is standard rig with the 5'11" Iron keel.
Would also appreciate thoughts on buying Hull number 1, as one of them is the first off the line for the series.

Thanks for the feedback.
I'd suggest you start a new thread. Good questions relating to a specific breed and many knowledgable folk on this may miss your post, somewhat buried as it is here.
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Old 03-01-2011, 02:09   #24
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At sea,

Thanks, I started that thread, but I think that the keel/rig differences fits here. I have been finding this thread very informative, and the keel difference we are talking about is 20 inches in shape, lead versus iron, additional sail area against the additional draft. Without going back to school for engineering, can anyone offer a resource for coming up to speed on this stuff. I have found this thread informative and interesting!
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Old 03-01-2011, 06:49   #25
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At sea,

Thanks, I started that thread, but I think that the keel/rig differences fits here. I have been finding this thread very informative, and the keel difference we are talking about is 20 inches in shape, lead versus iron, additional sail area against the additional draft. Without going back to school for engineering, can anyone offer a resource for coming up to speed on this stuff. I have found this thread informative and interesting!
I'm not sure but I would imagine that the designer has worked out "this stuff" better than you or I could. I would be looking at my intended uses and preferences in those uses: ie exploring out of the way places vs marina hopping or desire and need to be tight to the wind vs a few degrees off in more comfort and then looking at vmg to intended windward target and the like. Is gaining a knot tight on the wind worth the added concerns of grounding in your intended cruising grounds or do those concerns even exist? Things only you can determine. As for keel material I believe the state in which the material is in each application is probably more important. A good survey should determine if there are any problems or concerns with each keel, the material used and how it has been mantained. If you can find the performance information on each rig and the deeper draft isn't a limmiting factor for you then you will be better informed. Have you searched for the polar information for the breed?
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Old 03-01-2011, 07:15   #26
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For me under six foot is the rule. Like someone said we motor to windward if we need to get there. When anchoring, close is good and beside you have nothing but time.
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Old 03-01-2011, 07:52   #27
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Thanks to all the contributors so far, interesting reading;
I owned a 36ft boat and she looked, sailed and behaved well with her 6ft draft. Yacht designers know much more than I ever will but I do know you don't get "owt for nowt" which is why design is an exercise in compromise. Its also about proportion; you can't keep the same 6 ft draft on a boat yet increase its LOA by 25%, 50% or more without compromising some aspect of performance however you define that term.
A tall rig and deep keel offer large 'moments' and whilst shorter versions of both can also give equilibrium, deflection can be achieved more easily.
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Old 03-01-2011, 07:55   #28
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Here's one article on design that also seems to highlight the "personal" aspects of draft. Interesting also is the relationship to aspect ratio of the rig and, of course, the "personal" choices of that influence.
What's The Ideal Sailing Rig?
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Old 03-01-2011, 08:15   #29
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[QUOTE=David1;589594]... Its also about proportion; you can't keep the same 6 ft draft on a boat yet increase its LOA by 25%, 50% or more without compromising some aspect of performance however you define that term.
......QUOTE]

But I guess the point is that everything is a compromise and only you can decide how you want to define "performance".

Mine is 42' on deck (54 with bowsprit and davits) 3ft 10 inch draft at 18000# Will work to windward in weather (ie can work off a lee shore) but wouldn't be my choice for rounding the bouys in the race world! That's not my intended use. Even in a deep fin and tall rig I'd opt for footing off a bit on windward cruising for comfort. Quite often the vmg to windward isn't that much difference and the comfort level is. But that's the personal stuff. The polar diagrams should give a good idea of the performance for the two different configurations of the boats in question. Talking to owners might give you an idea of the comfort in different relative headings.
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Old 03-01-2011, 09:44   #30
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Sure, it's a personal choice and always a compromise.

We spend a lot of time on coastal Florida, Keys and Bahamas frequenting many locations where you couldn't access with even 5 feet of draft. I know what I'm giving up with my 4'3" draft, but I'm pleased with what we have.
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