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Old 29-01-2012, 11:21   #46
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Re: Documented or Titled?

G'day, Jim Cate. Read my post carefully. I did NOT say that vessels with U.S. state registrations could not clear Customs in New Zealand. It was one that could not VERIFY that registration, a big difference. Cheers.
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Old 29-01-2012, 11:37   #47
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Re: Documented or Titled?

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Originally Posted by Kettlewell View Post
The Coast Document expires every year. There is an expiration date on the front of your document. They will send you a renewal form every year about a month or two before your document expires. You have to sign and return it if nothing has changed. You can correct your address for no charge, but most other changes require you to file new forms and pay a fee. All the information is here.
I have never received a renewal form from the CG. Thanks for the info Kettlewell.
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Old 29-01-2012, 11:50   #48
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Re: Documented or Titled?

If you haven't been receiving the forms than chances are your document has expired.
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Old 29-01-2012, 11:52   #49
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Re: Documented or Titled?

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If you haven't been receiving the forms than chances are your document has expired.

Let me guess, another $300.00
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Old 29-01-2012, 11:58   #50
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Re: Documented or Titled?

If you do the paperwork yourself it is more like $100, and should be pretty easy if you have just let it lapse, but I would have to read all the details on the USCG website I linked to above. How long has it been since it expired (says right on the front of the document)?
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Old 29-01-2012, 12:01   #51
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Re: Documented or Titled?

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If you do the paperwork yourself it is more like $100, and should be pretty easy if you have just let it lapse, but I would have to read all the details on the USCG website I linked to above. How long has it been since it expired (says right on the front of the document)?

Haven't received any notification from the CG since the boat was purchased in 05'. Doccumentation went into a folder and as the vessel has been on the hard ubtil September last year I never looked at the certificate. The first time I am hearing it needed to be renewed was today.
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Old 29-01-2012, 12:11   #52
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Re: Documented or Titled?

OK, you may have some issues there. When you buy a boat you have to have the previous owner withdraw the boat from documentation and then you have to redocument it. Just getting handed the document from the previous owner does nothing. That is one thing a good broker can help you with. Take a look at the back of your document. There is a form there the seller has to fill out and you will need notarized Coast Guard bills of sale in order to transfer the document. Take a look here online to see what owner the CG thinks your boat is currently documented with. You may have to go to a documentation specialist to help you with this one.
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Old 29-01-2012, 12:23   #53
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Re: Documented or Titled?

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I remember reading somewhere about U.S. yacht owners during WWII being "conscripted" to combine their recreational sailing with sub watch off our coasts and internationally I think of the British evacuation of Dunkirk involving recreational boaters.
Were Aussie boaters called on in similar ways during WWII?
I dunno about being "conscripted", but a flottila of small boats was sent from Jersey to St Malo (France) to assist in the evacuation, not sure if only members of the St Helier Yacht Club:-

"A pivotal moment in the club's history was the involvement of it's members in the evacuation of British troops from St Malo in June 1940.

Two convoys of boats sailed from St Helier, the first ferrying troops and stores from the French port to transporters lying offshore, the second helping to take off the remaining troops and demolition party just as German forces entered the city.

The club's immediate response to the Admirality's request for help, described later as 'the little Dunkirk', led to the unique award of a 'Battle Honour' in the form of a defaced Red Ensign that members have proudly flown on their boats ever since."



Never bothered myself - costs a couple of hundred quid .

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Old 29-01-2012, 12:28   #54
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Re: Documented or Titled?

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Personally I would be reluctant to buy a cruising boat without documentation, partly as assurance of clear ownership and partly because it can be very difficult to document later (since the chain of ownership has to be established from the Master Carpenter's Certificate provided by the builder through Bills of Sale to present).
I wonder about this. I've noted documentation records showing the builder as "unknown."
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Old 29-01-2012, 12:35   #55
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Re: Documented or Titled?

It is possible to document a boat that doesn't have a chain of documentation back to the master builder, but it can be tricky. That is where a documentation specialist is worth their money. However, the general point stands that I prefer to have all the paperwork in order when purchasing a boat: the up-to-date USCG document showing the owner you are purchasing from, his/her address that is up-to-date, and/or a title and registration from states that require them. Anything and everything to guarantee you are purchasing a boat with a legitimate title is useful. These things are hard to recreate or circumvent later. Before I sign paperwork I ask to see first at least a scan or a fax of the document so I can research and study it at my leisure, and then demand the actual documents at the closing. The old owner has to sign over the document at the closing.
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Old 29-01-2012, 12:50   #56
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Re: Documented or Titled?

People get conscripted, yachts get commandeered. There are many old, established, and obscure laws providing for these type of events and yes, Uncle Sam is smart enough to know that anytime there is a "list" of something, that's a good way to grab an instant shopping list if you need them.

Got a ham radio license? You're on the shopping list for radio operators if there's a draft. (That's why hams used to be required to know Morse Code.) Got any special skill, degree, registration? Your selective service board knows about that too. What we now call "data mining" has been around for a long time.

Vessel documntation is covered in the US Code (Title 10? USC section ? ###) and over the years the benefits of being documented have shrunk. Used to include (70s?) things like medevac and repatriation for injured/abandoned crew, and might still for "real" paid crew on commercial flagged vessels. Among the oddities, last time I looked a documented vessel was still encouraged to carry inbound mail from foreign postal services. If you're carrying it inbound, you are allowed to proceed to the nearest US Post Office to deliver it into the US postal system--without delay or hindrance from anyone, including USCG and Customs. I know, tell that to the nice man in the suit.

But the USC should still carry, and define, what documentation will or won't do for you.
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Old 29-01-2012, 13:00   #57
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Re: Documented or Titled?

As has been said numerous times here, the major benefits of a USCG document are to convey and confirm clear title (not every state requires a title), and as an instantly identifiable and universally known system for informing foreign customs offices that you are the legitimate owner of said vessel. Also, it's free to renew and once you're outside the USA there is no need to keep feeding your state coffers for the annual state registration fee.
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Old 29-01-2012, 13:14   #58
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Re: Documented or Titled?

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There is no annual fee to renew your CG documentation--it is still free. However, many states still require you to also register your boat with them, which will surely have an annual fee. Massachusetts does not require a documented boat to be registered, but Rhode Island next door does. Florida requires all boats to be state registered, even if you are documented and from out of state. Go figure. Big advantage of documentation is that it is instantly recognizable in any foreign port and will garner the least scrutiny. If you pull out some battered, wallet-sized state registration you will instantly arouse suspicion in some other countries. New York's state registration is such a cheapo print out on crappy paper that it looks worse than something you dreamed up on your home inkjet printer. Another advantage is that you don't need to put numbers on the bow of your boat.

if you READ your uscg info, you will see it is illegal to both document and register a vessel. i document as it is spozedly easier to clear customs when traveling internationally. i refuse to state register for any state, if they so desire , i will relocate. easy.
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Old 29-01-2012, 13:47   #59
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Re: Documented or Titled?

Zeehag, that is incorrect. This is what the USCG says on their website:

Quote:
IS A DOCUMENTED VESSEL EXEMPT FROM STATE JURISDICTION?
No, all documented vessels must comply with the laws of the state in which they are operated. The vessel's document must be shown to state law enforcement personnel upon their demand. States may require documented vessels to be registered (but not numbered) and to display state decals showing that they have complied with state requirements.
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