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Old 02-02-2015, 15:33   #31
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Re: Crusing on a J 44

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Originally Posted by ScottMeilicke View Post
Thanks to everyone for your thoughtful replies, I genuinely appreciate it. I think we would be OK getting this boat, adding a bimini, some safety gear, lots of sweat and money for a good anchor setup, and off we go. Sailing a go fast boat such as this doesn't scare me off. Well maybe a little. But I suspect if we then wanted to add a few doodads down the road, we may run into the problems suggested here, and this boat, not designed as a cruiser, would be harder to convert into one than most.

For now we will keep looking.

Now if anyone has an opinion on that fine looking Stevens 47 in FL...

-Scott

Stevens 47 is a very nice boat if it was kept up. What are your plans when you get back in 2 years? If one of them is selling the boat that would have some effect on what I might buy and how I would equip it.
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Old 02-02-2015, 16:00   #32
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Re: Crusing on a J 44

I would suggest to you that if you could get that Waterline for $250,000. you would be ahead of the game. I think you would have to spend $60,000. or more on the J44 before you could go cruising.
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Old 02-02-2015, 16:18   #33
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Re: Crusing on a J 44

OK. I'll be the one to rain on this parade and take the heat for what I'm about to say.

The deep draft .... go around the shallow spots. The failing rudders ..... fix it.
The part of these boats that would seriously concern me is the absolute stupidity of TPS mounting winches and deck hardware right through balsa and sealing it with some kind of crappy goop instead of relieving the core in those areas. Same for some seacock installations. I have seen a mainsheet winch pulled out of the rotten balsa on a 2 year old J-boat

These boats are light weight toys and anybody who survives bluewater cruising in one of them is either seriously lucky (please buy my lotto tickets for me) or has spent an ungodly amount of money to keep them going. These were built for Wednesday night club races then sitting on the dock enjoying a glass of chardonnay and they do that very well. Buy a boat that was built for your purpose.

OK let r' fly boys
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Old 02-02-2015, 16:20   #34
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Re: Crusing on a J 44

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Jim,

What's the idea there? Isn't mast bend the reason for putting lots of load on the back stay?
Yes, mast bend is the reason, but with really bendy masts it is all too possible to overdo it. When the mast gets too far out of column it is at risk of collapse from the compression loads. The check stays limit the bend to avoid this situation.

Very common on "wet noodle" race boat masts, IMO not acceptable on a short handed cruising boat.

Cheers,

Jim
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Old 02-02-2015, 17:27   #35
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Re: Crusing on a J 44

I anchor out twice a week or so. The anchoring setup in those pictures is alarmingly insufficient. Just horrible. While hard to tell from the photos for sure, it appears that the bottom of the furling drum would interfere with the anchor coming up.

You don't just slap a windlass on it and go.

For that reason ALONE, I'd keep looking.

The cockpit is also questionable for relaxing, too broken up with "stuff."

As mentioned, it appears to be a racer that was adapted for local cruising, not RTW or even a quarter of the way.
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Old 02-02-2015, 18:37   #36
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Re: Crusing on a J 44

Boatpoker, that sounds crazy (not you, TPI).

Stu, I agree, the anchor setup would require so much effort to make right, with a high risk of not getting it right, that it is a deal breaker. My giant (for a 20' boat) anchor and chain, is one of my most favorite things about my boat.

I had my day of exploring what I knew would probably end up a dead end, but if you don't push the boundaries of your thinking, you won't get very far. Thanks again everyone.


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Old 02-02-2015, 19:19   #37
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Re: Crusing on a J 44

TPI did know how to build a fast cruiser and mount the stuff for serious work. In 1993 I was dead set on getting a Sundeer 56 and spent at day at the TPI factory so I could understand how they built the boat. I was impressed.

But, my wife did not like the interiors on any of the Sundeer 56s we could afford - too "industrial" - a comment I've never forgotten.
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Old 02-02-2015, 19:30   #38
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Re: Crusing on a J 44

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spent at day at the TPI factory so I could understand how they built the boat. I was impressed.
.
I did not get a walk through the factory and I've only surveyed 17 of them and all were poorly built with core problems. Perhaps I just saw the 17 bad ones.
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Old 02-02-2015, 19:37   #39
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Re: Crusing on a J 44

The OP mentions going from a 20 footer to this boat. We did something similar, a 20 footer to a 42 footer.

I am REALLY glad the 42 footer we jumped to is such a forgiving, conservative old beast, otherwise I suspect the learning curve could have been painful.

I don't think I'd want to put my family on any kind of a racehorse boat, even with a few more years of experience under my belt. I don't know anything about the J44 so I don't know what it would be like to handle, and therefore my concerns may be totally ill-founded. But for the sort of money being asked, I've seen many other lovely, more conservative boats that I suspect would be more pleasant as a family tourer.

Still, it's a lovely looking boat inside, and I've kept a few photos as part of my interior rejuvination inspiration album. Technicalities about layout aside, it looked light and airy and pleasant to be in, and I could easily imagine it being a joy to sail in the right conditions.

Matt
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Old 02-02-2015, 20:00   #40
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Re: Crusing on a J 44

Perhaps this or something like it would be more suitable for your needs.

1982 Valiant Cutter Sail Boat For Sale - www.yachtworld.com
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Old 02-02-2015, 20:30   #41
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Re: Crusing on a J 44

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I did not get a walk through the factory and I've only surveyed 17 of them and all were poorly built with core problems. Perhaps I just saw the 17 bad ones.
Lighten Up!

I did not say anything about the 17 J-Boats you surveyed - I just said that TPI was capable of building a stout long distance and fast cruiser.

Am I wrong - were the Sundeers poorly built?

Am I lucky I did not buy a Sundeer 56?
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Old 03-02-2015, 01:22   #42
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Re: Crusing on a J 44

Hello Scott,

Found something you should consider seriously..

1996 Koopmans 40 Sail Boat For Sale - www.yachtworld.com

Koopmans is one of the best builders in the Netherlands. She incorporates most of the important features loved by long-distance cruisers namely: Solar panels, wind generator, aluminium construction throughout, heavy-duty Anchor rig, A large electric windlass and cutter rigged.

You mentioned you are a "nine ne'er" in an earlier post; what could you object to?

����
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Old 03-02-2015, 01:41   #43
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Re: Crusing on a J 44

I hesitate to chime in because the only experience I have with a boat like this was as crew on a long distance delivery of a Frers 65. Like the J it was a big, light surfboard. We were 7 fairly experienced sailors and it was a bit of work at times. The boat required a good deal of attention and was not very forgiving or sea-kindly. It was damn fast, but to drive it that fast you need to have a crew that is on its toes. In the last leg of the trip, after beating to weather for a week (and that flat hull really BEAT) I was actually relieved when the giant spade rudder snapped off. I finally was able to get some sleep. That boat was insanely fun, absolutely no doubt of that. But it cost 10 times what yours will and I still wouldn't really want one to cruise on after that experience. I think for a family and for the money you are ready to spend there are pretty fast boats out there that would be more user-friendly, more sea-kindly and safer, for you for cruising around the world. But I have never set foot on a J-44 so take this for what it's worth. I liked the suggestion of the Valiant 40.. something of that ilk makes more sense for what you are planning. But the other more important question is, have you sailed a boat like this one before? If not, I'd say find someone with one and crew on it for a while if you can, in lots of different conditions to see if it is really the right boat for a family cruiser for you. It may be, once ANY rudder issues are cured... well then again, even then, I could see having a blast racing in the Transpac with a few experienced sailor friends, but as a family cruiser, not really. I sure understand the temptation though!
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Old 03-02-2015, 02:17   #44
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Re: Crusing on a J 44

Here is another thought...

1997 Island Packet 45 Cutter Sail Boat For Sale - www.yachtworld.com
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Old 03-02-2015, 02:32   #45
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Re: Crusing on a J 44

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Aww, come on... the OP has listed as requirements speed, good light air performance, good windward performance and other attributes totally foreign to the IP 45.

Jim
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