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Old 22-12-2009, 07:31   #61
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Originally Posted by slap View Post
What would be a good explaination for the way the aluminum toe rail bent between the bolts other than the hull bending?

Because the imbiciles put too much force on it!

I have raced a Swan 651 (racing version of the 65 footer) Trans Atlantic and I am NOT fool enough to put the same stresses on a production cruiser! Nor am I fool enough to think that a Beneteau, Jeneau, Hunter, Catalina. et al, requires the coffee grinder winches or heavy standing and running rigging of the Swan.

The bolts between the toe rails on the Bene are 15 cms apart. I know as I just measured them. Any clown who bends them is playing showtime in his 3 ring circuis.

Anyone can break a boat. The brain dead can break more boats easier.

That Swan later ripped 3 sails and broke the inner forestay between Brazil and Argentina it also put 6 twists in the genoas roller furler foil. How? Because when the Genoa wouldn't furl the skipper put the furling line on a coffee grinder. I was the other watch leader so put my head up to see if he needed a hand. No. So I went back to bed.

Do I slag all Swans?

No.

I slag the imbicile who put the furler line on a coffee grinder.



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Old 22-12-2009, 07:48   #62
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and another thing a toe rail with holes in it is NOT a reinforced pad eye to shackle a block to.

Its probably there so folks can lash a net to the lifelines so kiddies don't fall overboard or the cat can't attack dolphins.

What were they doing? Did they put a couple of spinnaker blocks on the toe rail? And they call themselves sailors?
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Old 22-12-2009, 08:22   #63
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and another thing a toe rail with holes in it is NOT a reinforced pad eye to shackle a block to.

Its probably there so folks can lash a net to the lifelines so kiddies don't fall overboard or the cat can't attack dolphins.

What were they doing? Did they put a couple of spinnaker blocks on the toe rail? And they call themselves sailors?
The bends in the toerail between the bolts went from the shrouds to the bow - not what you would get if you simply attached a block to the toerail and overloaded it.

Considering the level of effort that went into upgrading the hardware on that boat, I'd be a little surprised if they shackled any blocks to the toerail.
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Old 22-12-2009, 08:41   #64
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ain't that the truth!

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Anyone can break a boat.
yes, and nothing breeds poor decision making like a sailboat race.
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Old 22-12-2009, 08:49   #65
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Just a short, bear with me...
A good number of years ago, I did a fair amount of bicycling.. Did RAAM a couple times, BMB, and Paris-Breast-Paris 3 different times.. So Ultra-cycling was my choice of pain so-to -speak..
And I went through wheels, A-lot of wheels. Would keep a couple sets in the Van as spairs, and always having a new set built..
At one point I was doing a 400klm qualifier for PBP, and when I got back, I realized the wheels I was using were just as "true" as when I left.. When speaking to my Mechanic, I stated that he had out-done himself with this new set of wheels and how true they stayed..
His reply was that it wasnt the wheels, and that I finally learned to ride a bike..
And I hold this true in my sailing..
You dont have to work harder, you have to work smarter. and anyone can break a boat..
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Old 22-12-2009, 09:22   #66
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Originally Posted by MarkJ View Post
Because the imbiciles put too much force on it!

. . . .

Do I slag all Swans?

No.

I slag the imbicile who put the furler line on a coffee grinder.



Mark
Well, I've made the same mistake, so I guess I'm an imbecile (not spelled "imbicile") too.
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Old 22-12-2009, 09:26   #67
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Coming in a bit late here but I had a bad experience with a Beneteau 42. 40 knot plus headwind, close to coast so choppy confused seas. Got knocked down twice. Whilst the boat itself was fine - rigging, hull etc - the fitout literally fell apart. Head door came off, saloon table broke off mounting, all sorts of damage below.

My point is that however solid and well designed the boat may be, if it's inadequately fitted out then it will let you down.

We found packs of cornflakes, pieces of fruit etc wedged in all sorts of places for months afterwards.
Umm, yes, 90% sailor, 10% boat . . . letting yourself get knocked down will cause damage of various kinds to most boats. You are lucky not to have had damage to the rig.
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Old 22-12-2009, 12:16   #68
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Who is going to race a boat with in mast furling main?

Mark
Well, ... most of ARC participants !!!! LOL ;-))))

(For those who do not know this initialism, it stands fro Atlantic RALLY for Cruisers)

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Old 22-12-2009, 14:02   #69
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To my understanding, The ARC, even tho a point to point event.. is a "Rally" and not a race.. and according to the information provided, geared to cruisers and not racers...
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Old 22-12-2009, 14:05   #70
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Quote:
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To my understanding, The ARC, even tho a point to point event.. is a "Rally" and not a race.. and according to the information provided, geared to cruisers and not racers...
True. Motoring is allowed too.

/Hampus
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Old 22-12-2009, 14:17   #71
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Don - I was agreeing with your comparisons
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Old 22-12-2009, 14:21   #72
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is it time to lighten up yet

we all know the only real answer to any of the "best" boat questions is that it's the one that allows you do it
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Old 22-12-2009, 14:35   #73
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If some of you want to go out on blue water with a sailboat built to a price point, with a fin keel and an unsupported spade rudder, and whose decks flex when you walk on them at a boat show, I wish you good luck!

And you should take comfort from the fact that if you do drown, it was 90% your fault and only 10% was the boat.
I have yet to walk on any boat at any boat show that the decks flexed
Many year ago I bought a new Ford Falcon Wagon, the wagon version had only been released a couple of weeks. My business an automotive repair work shop and the car was sitting in the middle of the shop. Tow truck arrived to drop off another vehicle and as soon as he saw the Falcon and not knowing it was my car he exclaimed "have you heard about those things, the front screen pops out when you pick em up" well 500000+kms later the screen was still intact and I never heard of this happening even though I was in the trade.
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Old 22-12-2009, 16:05   #74
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Do your homework and consider what you really need out of a boat - learn as much as you can about what design tradeoffs are considered by naval architects and what those tradeoffs will mean to you (beam ratio, displacement, freeboard height, cockpit layout, etc). Consider your budget and your needs in terms of equipment, and translate that to things like tank capacity (the point made about a watermaker was a good one) and storage needs. Also consider what your must haves are in terms of construction. For me it was a through bolted deck joint and keel stepped mast - others will disagree, but I wasn't willing to compromise just for my own piece of mind.

Once you REALLY know what you want out of a boat, my personal opinion is that the type of boat that fits that bill ("production" or otherwise) is the boat for you. In other words, I'd spend more time worrying about the attributes of the boat than the brand.
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Old 22-12-2009, 16:13   #75
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National Enquirer

I read in the National Enquirer that the federal govenment has outlawed the sale of Beneteau Janeau and Bavaria boats in the USA because of all of the thousands of people who have sailed off and never returned!
In addition, all of the major insurance companies have declared that ownership of these tragically flawed vessels is considered a "pre-existing condition". Injury and death will not be covered!
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