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Old 12-01-2010, 17:50   #301
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I'm sure many of us are aware of some recent horror stories concerning other manufacturers that have behaved disgracefully in similar circumstances.
I haven't heard those stories. Please fill us in.
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Old 12-01-2010, 19:58   #302
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I haven't heard those stories. Please fill us in.
Hot topic for another thread Mr. Curmudgeon. All over the world, Cruisers Forum members are wincing and saying to themselves . . . "whatever you do, don't answer that question MC01!".
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Old 13-01-2010, 01:23   #303
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I'm a proud owner of a Bavaria 37. We recently took it to Kangaroo Is in South Australia for 12 days (no marinas) in 5 to 40 knots with my family and I have absolute trust in this boat. Admittedly it wasn't massive swell and 50 - 60 knots but you try and avoid that in any boat anyway. It's fast, seaworthy and has all the luxuries. Don't get me wrong, I love all boats, new or old.
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Old 13-01-2010, 04:38   #304
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Hot topic for another thread Mr. Curmudgeon. All over the world, Cruisers Forum members are wincing and saying to themselves . . . "whatever you do, don't answer that question MC01!".
Right!
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Old 21-01-2010, 18:43   #305
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Hi all,

Thank you to everyone for sharing your knowledge with the novice. You have made me look at the problem from different points of view.

Reason why I would like to go for production boat:

1. They are easy to find (I will be buying in Croatia). Also BTW what do you think about ex charter boats? I heard to keep away from them but what is your opinion?

2. They keep good resell value

3. I like the look (especially of Benetau)

4. I have spent weekend on the Benetau 31, and I like it a lot. I donít know a lot about sailing but whether was bad and boat was feeling very safe to be on. I had a great time.

Now I know that whatever I buy there will be better boat out there, but on the other hand I can see that there is a lot of people out there with Benetau boats and they have great time and no problems with boat (BTW MarkJ, I am very very envy of your boat. Have spent an hour on your website yesterday!)

Ivan
Hi Ivan,

did the 31' feel roomy enough?
how many people on the boat with you?
I am looking at one myself
Thanks
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Old 24-01-2010, 13:52   #306
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Hi Ivan,

did the 31' feel roomy enough?
how many people on the boat with you?
I am looking at one myself
Thanks

Yes it was ok size for a weekend. It was 5 of us, but for a offshore I would be looking something in the 35 -40 range.
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Old 24-08-2010, 19:17   #307
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Just like cars, I buy new and dump them at 60 thousand miles.. let some jerk do the mantance on it, I use it..
I be that jerk I haven't bought a new car since 1973 (lots of 2 year old ones though), and haven't had a payment since then either.

I let some other jerk take that huge depreciation upfront... after 2 years, neither that jerk or anyone else can tell if I bought my car new or used
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Old 24-08-2010, 21:03   #308
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I be that jerk I haven't bought a new car since 1973 (lots of 2 year old ones though), and haven't had a payment since then either.

I let some other jerk take that huge depreciation upfront... after 2 years, neither that jerk or anyone else can tell if I bought my car new or used
+1 on the depreciation hit.
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Old 25-08-2010, 04:02   #309
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Just to say after all these posts

the fact is that the marine industry is almost exclusively fin keel and spade rudder. You would be hard pushed to find altenatives. More importantly user opinion is backing this. The French sailor fir example would laugh at the idea of long kneeled boats etc. Yet thus is one if the most prolific sailors on the planet.

The production/ versus blue water is a funny almost exclusively US argument and it's stance that many of the so called BW boats are taiwaneese or chineese build stuff many of which had and still have horrendous build quality issues.

Europeans are the most prolific builders of sailing boats in the world and funnily there have universally switch to fin and spade even so called premium brnads like HR oyster and najaid have seen the light.

Production jeanneaus etc are more then capable of circumnavigation end of story. Why because large numbers of them are out there doing it and the uncomfortable thruth is that they are not falling apart.

More money does not equal a better boat. Is your merceded better then a toyota no it isn't it's merely more luxurious.

As to new or nearly new it's notable
that here in Europe I can get cash deals on new boats that are cheaper then well maintained nearly new ones.

Ps Bavarias do not have a reputation for loosing there keels please read up on the " single" incident involving a charter racing bav and what happened.

Dave
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Old 25-08-2010, 04:39   #310
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goboatingnow,

You make some excellent point. Especially the points about the Europeans and the French. They have always been ahead of the curve, just look at who has lead the way in multihulls.
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Old 25-08-2010, 08:46   #311
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Ahh...back to this are we?

The real question for me in the used boat dept - even 5-10 year old ones - is which design years are of better quality than others. There are some nice looking Jennies and Bendies out there for sale, but it's difficult to judge which have "experimental design" changes in those years and models that are dubious, or build / sailing quality that are unsuitable for a sojourn. Yes, for example, Bennies in the early to mid 80's are desirable (35, 38, 405 etc), but no one...no one steps up and gives a play by play on which models are good up to today. And not all of them are.

I have no idea about Catalinas. I know 27, 320, 36 have done well.
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Old 25-08-2010, 09:37   #312
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I just did a delivery trip in a new Jeanneau 42 , excellent boat well put together. \i for one dont subscribe to the notion that 1980 benes are better then recent ones. Theres no evidence to suggest one way or another.

In fact your question could be applied to any brand , HR, Hylay, who knows what was done version to version. Look at the problems with some major Taiwan rubbish, that caused huge grief.

Dave
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Old 25-08-2010, 11:39   #313
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Recent Bennies are probably decent, but I wonder about say from 1988-2002 - which models to focus on...and between 30-40 feet? I think the 40+ should probably be a lesser concern but what do i know. Outside of the FIRST 38, Problem with all of them is that they don't come up on anyone lists - probably because of tankage, storage, and sump issues.
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Old 25-08-2010, 14:42   #314
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The real question for me in the used boat dept - even 5-10 year old ones - is which design years are of better quality than others.

Wouldn't the question become which are better quality at a given price?
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Old 25-08-2010, 15:42   #315
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Maybe. I'll let you all decide on how to qualify them. The model numbers and names totally confuse me, and there is no useful information to search. Someone mentioned a few CE numbers, which I know are dubious but hey...that was a start as incomplete as it was.
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