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Old 06-04-2016, 07:02   #1
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Buying a boat

I am buying my first sailboat which is a 36 foot 32 year old Catalina.
It has been on the hard for about 5 years because the owners are older and cannot sail anymore. the survey was done last week and I'm still waiting for the report but I was present at the survey and I think it went well.
The owners are currently paying for outside winter storage.
Question: the boat is to be given a sea trial but probably needs a new coat of anti-fouling before launch. I do not know who should be paying for the painting and re-launch - owner or buyer?
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Old 06-04-2016, 07:07   #2
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Re: Buying a boat

Welcome to CF newcat !

Anything is possible with regard to "who pays"...

You'll be sure to get lots of advice regarding buying a 5yr on the hard boat...

Best of luck !
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Old 06-04-2016, 07:15   #3
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Re: Buying a boat

We just surveyed a Cat 30 two days ago and our scenario is: After being surveyed on the hard, the decision is made by the prospective buyer whether to continue the process, (is the buyer still interested in the boat). If so, the seller pays to have the boat splashed. If after the sea trial the potential buyer decides they are not interested, the potential buyer pays to put the boat back on the hard. There is no way you would pay for the anti-fouling on a boat you don't own. Any needed maintenance or repairs would be part of the price negotiation. A reputable broker, ( I am not one), should be able to guide you through the process, and what I just described should be part of the Purchase and Sale agreement.
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Old 06-04-2016, 07:24   #4
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Re: Buying a boat

Thanks for the quick response. As I said, I've had the survey done already - just waiting for spring weather here in Canada to do the sea trial ( all part of my conditions for buying the boat). Yes it was my feeling that the owners should be painting the hull before the splash. Would seem silly to launch. it do the sea trial, then pay to haul for painting and then re-launch it again!
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Old 06-04-2016, 07:32   #5
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Re: Buying a boat

If I were the seller, there would be no sea trial unless there was a cash-backed offer on paper. And I'd sell as-is.

If you want paint, you are welcome to put it on. Assuming you have made an offer, and it's contingent on a successful sea trial, then why not paint it?
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Old 06-04-2016, 07:37   #6
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Re: Buying a boat

Quote:
Originally Posted by newcat36 View Post
Thanks for the quick response. As I said, I've had the survey done already - just waiting for spring weather here in Canada to do the sea trial ( all part of my conditions for buying the boat). Yes it was my feeling that the owners should be painting the hull before the splash. Would seem silly to launch. it do the sea trial, then pay to haul for painting and then re-launch it again!
Where in Canada are you keeping the boat?
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Old 06-04-2016, 07:40   #7
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Re: Buying a boat

There really is no "should" or "should not".

I don't know what state the current AF is in - but even if there's none, a boat doesn't need it just for a sea trail

Just discuss it with the owner - either they can do it now (if they're willing - you said they're older and boat has been on the hard for 5 years. Doesn't sound like much maintenance will be done now) or you do it yourself when the boat is yours.

The survey should tell you everything that needs to be done, including bottom paint. The costs of all the "must do" repairs and maintenance will be reflected in the final price, or the owner takes care of it before you buy. This is something the two of you have to discuss and agree on.

I don't know how you'll be using the boat, but if you plan to haul her regularly anyway, you could do it yourself at the first planned haul.

Anyway - discuss it with the owner and reach an agreement, and check the report to see if she really needs bottom paint right now or if she's good to go for a season.

When buying a boat that's been sitting on the hard for 5 yrs, you might have to accept they're not suddenly going to do much of anything

And remember: you may WANT the owner to take care of the AF before splashing the boat for a sea trail, but at this point you may or may not buy to boat.
In other words: their boat, their decision. Obviously, you don't pay for any work on a boat you don't own (yet); you may have to accept you'll have to take care of it after you buy her.

If you do end up buying her: can she stay in the water or will she go back on the hard regardless of the outcome?
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Old 06-04-2016, 07:47   #8
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Re: Buying a boat

I have" skin in the game" ( a 10% deposit) - so I am serious about this boat.
thank for you input anyway.
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Old 06-04-2016, 07:49   #9
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Re: Buying a boat

I assumed as much, considering the survey and sea trail, but not sure what your deposit has to do with your question about the bottom paint
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Old 06-04-2016, 08:42   #10
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Re: Buying a boat

Newcat, I agree anything can be negotiated between you and the seller. However, consider this. If the boat was already in the water you would pay for the survey including the cost of hauling and splashing. If you decide not to buy the boat based on the survey you eat the cost of the survey and the haul out.

Many boat yards will agree to haul again free within a short time after the survey for bottom paint or other work they will perform.


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Old 06-04-2016, 08:50   #11
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Re: Buying a boat

There is no doubt that a boat on the hard for 5 yrs will need bottom paint. I think you are better off taking care of the paint yourself, if you get the owner to paint most likely they will slap on a coat of the cheapest stuff they can get, a waste of time and money.

Plan on a haulout after the sea trial anyway, more than likely on a 32yo boat the sea trial will reveal things that need attention best done on the hard. Bottom paint being the least of it.

Are you SURE a 32yo 36' boat is the best first sailboat for you? There will be a steep and $$$ learning curve. Just my 2 cents.
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Old 06-04-2016, 09:04   #12
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Re: Buying a boat

IMO the fears of a boat being on the hard for a few years are highly exaggerated provided a) it was winterized properly, b) was in decent shape/condition when put away and c) was a well built boat to begin with. If all 3 factors apply I say it is a great opportunity to acquire a good boat cheaply.

In my experience after looking at many and acquiring 5 boats, 3-5-7 years of well packed away on the hard time in Northeast sure beats 3-6 months of in the water non-use in Florida or the tropics in general.
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Old 06-04-2016, 09:25   #13
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Re: Buying a boat

If you buy a boat on dry, you pay for it and drive it away. The rest of the costs and trouble is yours.

If you buy a boat in the water, you pay and then go sailing (or, more realistically, you motor her to a boatyard).

Most of the time we buy boats 'as is, where is'. (In Europe)

You may ask the becoming ex owners to pay any new expenses I am sure they will allow for your claims in the selling price, NO?

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Old 06-04-2016, 09:33   #14
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Re: Buying a boat

The buyer pays for all costs of survey and sea trial. I wouldn't worry about painting it now. Paint is more a long term requirement. You could save a lot of money if you could run the engine on the hard ... there is some small risk in just doing that, you wont know the condition of the packing gland or shaft etc. But you could likely replace those with new for cost of launch and retrieval!
It is highly likely the shaft is corroded inside the stuffing box, as the salt water sits in there without oxygen. It's common. You wont know this other than the stuffing box drips too much and tightening doesn't solve it. (disregard if it's fresh water boat)
Did the survey run the fresh water system etc? Many things could have frozen in winter.
Running in the yard has some advantages also: The fuel is old, quite possible the engine will quit during sea trial. Hard to say. The impellor for the water pump may be shot from sitting. A simple sea trial on a stored boat can become a big long day..
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Old 06-04-2016, 12:33   #15
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Re: Buying a boat

So, what I think is going on here is that you are hoping that the sea trial will go well, the purchase will go through, and you will not haul the boat out after the sea trial. You will leave it in the water, it will become yours, and you will start using it. Is that what you are hoping?

And, along with that, you are thinking that it should be bottom-painted before the sea trial, so that is already taken care of when you leave it in the water and it is yours. Otherwise, after you buy it, you have to haul it out again to bottom-paint it before you start using if for the season. Am I getting this right?

The problem, of course, is that the current owner has no incentive for bottom-painting the boat. He wants to sell it, not use it. There is no reason that it needs bottom-paint for a sea trial so naturally he is saying (exactly what I would say if I were the seller)--if you want it to have bottom-paint for the sea trial then you pay for it.

My advice would be to launch it as is, do your sea-trial, then decide what to do later. You might be able to get through one season without any bottom-paint. Then paint it next spring. Or you might decide, come July, that you want to have it hauled and painted. I do not think you are going to get the seller to pay for painting it. I certainly would not, as I said, were I the seller. So either way, in the end, you are going to have to pay for the hauling and painting. The question is whether or not you want to take a chance and pay for bottom paint, with the possibility that it will fail the sea-trial and you will have just paid to paint someone else's boat.

Good luck, whatever you decide.
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