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Old 08-12-2008, 10:15   #1
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BUYER'S BEWARE

I recently made an inquirey on a boat listed on sailboatlistings.com and here is what the response was:



-----Original Message-----
From: Kusic Perica <essunrise@gmail.com>
To: scottvos@aol.com <scottvos@aol.com>
Sent: Sat, 6 Dec 2008 1:45 am
Subject: Re: Catalina 36 MKII


Hi Scott and sorry for the late reply,

The boat is in perfect condition, with no problems whatsoever. Check this link for more pics: catamk - Photobucket - Video and Image Hosting
We are expecting our first child in a couple of weeks and we need to make some financial arrangements before this happens.. that's why the boat must go. Also, we want to sell the boat now so we don't have to store it in the winter. next year, we will sell it at a much higher price.
Boat is currently located in Rijeka, Croatia. The price is $43,000.

If you are seriously interested in buying let us know
Kusic & Joanna Perica

-----------------------------------------------------------------------

Hello,
I saw the listing on the Catalina 36mkii and would like to get more info please. Also, the listing price seems low for this model/yr? are there any problems with the boat?

thanks in advance for any info

scott
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Old 08-12-2008, 10:21   #2
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And your point is?
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Old 08-12-2008, 10:32   #3
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Did the seller ask you to wire funds in advance, ask for your bank account number or anything else suspicious? If not what makes you think this is fraud?

I would of course proceed cautiously on a purchase of anything overseas, but there are sailors and boats everywhere there is water and this could be totally legit.
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Old 08-12-2008, 11:18   #4
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We see the pictures they wanted to show. You still have to follow the basics. Examine the boat and survey it for real trouble. Write a written contract to purchase with terms and conditions clearly spelled out. Do all financial transactions through an escrow service only!

Anytime they start saying you don't need to survey or we can do it all without an escrow service it's time to be nervous. You can't get taken advantage of if you follow the basics and don't agree to terms and conditions because somehow they don't have time or are in a hurry. It could be a fair deal so you should do what normal buyers do and don't be rushed. You don't have to fear anything if you follow the basics designed to protect you as well as the seller. It makes the process much easier knowing things can't be turned against you.
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Old 09-12-2008, 19:42   #5
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I think I see what you're saying. Picture 5 seems to have the name "Serenity" on the port side. But picture 8 shows no such name. Also, the canvas work, while the same color, might be a bit off from one shot to the next. Also 5 & 8, though roughly from the same angle show totally different backdrops--rather like some appetising fotos were strung together. Is this your sense?
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Old 09-12-2008, 19:46   #6
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Old 10-12-2008, 03:10   #7
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has the VAT been paid on the boat and does it have the C.E. plate?

if not add another 17.5% for vat and a few grand for the CE certification

you are allowed 18 months if you are a non EEC vessel before you get walloped for tax
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Old 10-12-2008, 04:11   #8
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I see his concern, but would still ask some more questions before calling this a scam. Yes, the photos do not match up. But there could be an age difference. Maybe one set is current, the other is when they bought the boat. Just trying to play devils advocate.
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Old 10-12-2008, 04:23   #9
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Starfish,

Not everything is a conspiracy. The pictures clearly were not taken on the same day in the same location. Some are at a floating dock and the others at another. It may still be the same boat but taken at different times. Even at that maybe years apart. What you do see is the Bimini canvas that looks very trashed as well as the hatch boards. A factory Catalina does not come with canvas that loose nor will it stretch that much. This boat is not that new. A boat with this price wouldn't be expected to be that new either.

A reasonable request for someone traveling a long way to purchase a boat is to ask for a new set of pictures. Long distance boat buying costs a lot of money. Just in terms of the idea that it might require more than one trip and you'll need to recommission the boat to get it home. There is a limit on how cheap a boat can be before it's the extra long distance expenses add up too high. On this boat I would worry most about what if the boat really is only worth the asking price? A fair deal on a worn out Catalina 36 is not worth a long distance airline ticket. You could probably get one closer to home for the same price. A more rigorous search in a smaller area may yield an easier boat to check out.

I think anyone on a budget is better off looking closer to home. Boats in pictures are not the same as ones in real life. You can chase a lot of boats you never buy that will chip away at your budget. The pictures don't have to be forged or fake to make a boat look better than it is. Your mind wants to see a great boat at a great price. Tricks of the mind can be costly.
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Old 10-12-2008, 05:29   #10
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PB, you're right, of course--not everything is a conspiracy. However, caveat emptor applies in spades to buying a used sailboat. My observations were simply an attempt to divine what spooked Scott. Your idea of requesting a new set of photos is fair enough. And I would want to have a surveyor in the area do a cursory inspection before I shelled out the considerable expense of flying to Croatia.

The photos are just one red flag, though. We are expecting our first child in a couple of weeks and we need to make some financial arrangements before this happens.. that's why the boat must go. Also, we want to sell the boat now so we don't have to store it in the winter. next year, we will sell it at a much higher price. That screams of a high-pressure sale, and is another red flag. I'm guessing the boat is a played out charter with a gazillion hours on a hard-run engine and sloppy rigging, etc, that someone is trying to make a fast few grand on.

Scott would be better served to look in Florida and Texas, as there are a lot of sellers in these areas.
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Old 10-12-2008, 10:03   #11
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Yes, the need to make "financial arrangements" right away is a huge red flag. Don't commit to paying a dime without an inspection and assurances of receiving good title. Where is the boat registered?

Maybe someone can recommend a reputable local inspector in Croatia to check out the boat. I'm sure it would be cheaper than going there yourself.
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Old 10-12-2008, 18:13   #12
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In photo 1 the genny is installed on the furler. In photo 5 it is not. Also photo 1 looks like evening. I'd say that is a different time.

I am not sure what you are worried about. Maybe you can explain.

What I am curious about is this photo. Sorry in advance for thread creep. In mase furling leaves a small triangle of main sail hanging out. I gotta believe that the UV really gets to this and is not good for the sail.

http://i457.photobucket.com/albums/q...alinaMKII4.jpg

Is it protected somehow?
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Old 10-12-2008, 18:20   #13
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Quote:
I gotta believe that the UV really gets to this and is not good for the sail.
There is usually a sun strip just like on a jib furler.
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Old 10-12-2008, 18:58   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Pblais View Post
There is usually a sun strip just like on a jib furler.
Yeah, maybe it's just white UV protectant.

A guy here left his boat on the hard with his brand new genny furled out about a foot. A year later the triangle was like burnt paper. Ruined the sail.

<sigh>
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Old 14-12-2008, 10:18   #15
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perhaps you should anonymise their emails from the original message. they will get spammed
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