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Old 29-09-2010, 09:16   #16
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Beware of any heavily raced Swan - it can be horror story (but it can be a bargain too). I have seen many Swans of that era cruising ... without their rig ;-)

A Hanse is a rebranded Bavaria. Them and Swan are not quite tthe same league.

If you can get a sound Swan and if you love Swans, that's what you will buy into.

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Old 29-09-2010, 21:08   #17
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A Hanse is a rebranded Bavaria.
b.
Geeze Barny, I don't think so, unless the rebranding changes the hull shape, the rig, the construction materials and the accomodation.

I don't particularly care for either of those marques, but they do not have the relationship you describe.

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Old 30-09-2010, 09:04   #18
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I believe there's a serious unfair approach to both Hanse and new Moody's at this point. O.k., I can agree with the idea of new ones not as rock solid as the old ones. And there're plenty of horror stories around for Hanse's -especially 630e's. However, comparing a Moody 62DS to a Bavaria seems a bit unfair don't you think?

It's obvious that if anyone in this forum had unlimited money, we'd go for either Swan, Oyster, Najad or Hallberg Rassy. I for example would either buy an Oyster 885 of Swan 90FD. However, if choosing such elite boats is a must, then how come people sail all around the world -even South Ocean- with 30-40 foot production boats? And as it has been reminded maybe hundreds of times on cruiser's forum, didn't Slocum circumnavigated with a very very old 30 footer that he repaired himself?
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Old 30-09-2010, 09:13   #19
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in relation to themoody 45DS or62 DS, how do you know, I have sailed the 45 it sailsvery well indeed and is no "motor sailer" thats for sure. Sure the design is radical, but its a strong boat ( with one or two faults that put me off, front engine access being one),

PS it has no angle of vanishing stability. no negative part under the line at all!!!

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If you've actually sailed one, then I have to defer to your experience, because I have not. But it is hard for me to imagine that it sails all that well, with that rig. It has a self-tacking headsail, which cannot but seriously harm your trimming ability (I know whereof I speak, since my boat has a self-tacking staysail, and it just can't be trimmed, except very vaguely). It has an extremely fat aft section. To my eye it looks like it was optimized for accomodation and motoring, but again -- I haven't sailed it, so this is just what it looks like.

It's a very cool looking boat. I love the high salon and the views. But it's just about as far away from a Swan, however, as you could ever get, and it puzzled me why it interested the OP so much.
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Old 30-09-2010, 18:16   #20
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Geeze Barny, I don't think so, unless the rebranding changes the hull shape, the rig, the construction materials and the accomodation.

I don't particularly care for either of those marques, but they do not have the relationship you describe.

Cheers,

Jim
It was a parable. I do not think they are the same company, just meaning the difference between their boats is very small.

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Old 01-10-2010, 12:25   #21
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That's it! I'm opening a seperate thread for the 62DS!!!
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Old 02-10-2010, 05:43   #22
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I bought a 30 year old S&S Swan but probably would not have done so if she hadn't been substantially redone by the prior owner, including new teak decks, electrical, rigging and all new varnish below. The teak decks generally last about twenty years. Don't underestimate the cost of replacing the decks. But what a great boat. Sails wonderfully. Stiff and stable. Goes beautifully to wind. If you keep them up they retain their value very nicely. Good luck with your choice.
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Old 02-10-2010, 06:15   #23
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That's it! I'm opening a seperate thread for the 62DS!!!
I hope you buy one and tell us about it.

I for one didn't slag it off. Moody is now Hanse's premium brand and the Hanse-built Moodys, while not quite as nice as the "real" Moodys, still look very nice and pretty solid. Not at all like a Bavaria. I have not sailed them but I have walked and poked around in them at the Southampton Boat Show. I'm sure they're ok, especially the 62DS, for blue water.

But again -- just about as different from a Swan as you could ever get which I think has puzzled some people, since you initially posted asking about old Swans.
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Old 19-11-2010, 17:09   #24
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Hello again;

Let's rekindle the flame here... What do you think about this boat? Do you think it's good value?

1999 Nautor Swan 57 RS (Raised Saloon) Sail Boat For Sale -
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Old 19-11-2010, 17:38   #25
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I would require a deep discount before I'd buy a boat names "Swanky". Ewww.

At $1.1 M it gets way outside my ability to judge it's value but it does have 2 heads AND 2 bathrooms which I've never seen

It's hard not to like it though, all my "ain't got that kinda doe" moaning aside.
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Old 19-11-2010, 18:33   #26
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Sorry, wrong question. The question should be something like the original tread starter :

Would it worth to pay a million bucks to a 11 year old 57ft Swan RS while you can buy a brand new production boat for almost half or even less than that? And will it be a good investment?
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Old 19-11-2010, 18:49   #27
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Hello again;

Let's rekindle the flame here... What do you think about this boat? Do you think it's good value?
I think they were between $1.6m and $2m when new

The main difficulty as I would see it is there is no cockpit room and no saloon room. The Raised Saloon means that the saloon does not use the full beam and has 2 huge exterior lazarettes in the decks outside the coach house. My friends kept a rigid dinghy in one. (or was it something else they kept in there... one was the sail loft.....)they really were big and it was saloon space.
You can see how small the saloon is from the photo in the ad.

With one wheel you have zero room in the cockpit.

You would be faaaaaarrrrrrrrrrrrrr better to get any production boat of similar size, or even smaller. The Beneteau 54 is vastly larger.

Swan discontinued them shortly thereafter........

They sailed well, just a dog in every other way.
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Old 19-11-2010, 18:56   #28
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Never thought of that but you're absolutely right Mark. Then I really must ask for the following lady, which haunts me in my dreams for quite some time since I've first saw it on yw :

2009 Sensation Yachts Sail Boat For Sale - www.yachtworld.com

Sounds like a great deal for the price... There's also these two others :

2007 Nautor Swan 53.511 Sail Boat For Sale - www.yachtworld.com

2005 Oyster 53 Sail Boat For Sale - www.yachtworld.com

Last but not least, yes, a 53ft Jeanneau seems much more useful (and you extremely less expensive than the 57RS)...
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Old 19-11-2010, 18:57   #29
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Swan discontinued them shortly thereafter........
the important point here is that even though the boat was built in the late nineties, the design was fairly ancient by that time.

If you have a million bucks to invest in a boat, you can do far better than this one.
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Old 19-11-2010, 18:59   #30
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Sorry, the full listing of Oyster is this one :

2005 Oyster 53 Sail Boat For Sale - www.yachtworld.com
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