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Old 20-03-2013, 10:37   #31
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Re: BoatUS wants 3 people on board while cruising in Mexico?

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Originally Posted by Cheechako View Post
Not sure if still true, but I had a boat insured by All state years ago and they covered coastal waters to 75 miles out! Essentially you could sail from Seattle to San Diego and be covered by cheap regular pleasure boat insurance.
I've found Boat US to be one of the most expensive out there everytime I've gone through the quoting exercise....
When you think about it, any powerboater who wants to go salmon fishing out of say... Westport, must have insurance that covers them offshore cheaply.... The question is how far offshore.
Regarding Boat US towing insurance.... which one do you buy? I had it in Florida 3 years ago, I wont go into why, but I ran out of diesel on the Waterway. I was told it was going to cost me $600 for a tow one mile to a fuel dock.... even though I had their towing insurance... so the question is, do you have to buy only the very top end offering to ge any useful coverage at all? I think I had the tier 2 coverage.... I guess I find it pretty misleading in what they sell....
Like any insurance, Boats US towing policies have some pretty tight restrictions, so you need to make sure you have the correct policy for your area and what you are asking them to do. If you get outside their strike zone, they aren't your answer.
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Old 20-03-2013, 10:40   #32
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Re: BoatUS wants 3 people on board while cruising in Mexico?

liability only, mexican while here, and from wherever i sail when i am there, and is under 250 usd per annum.

and i can and will sail wherever i wish, not wherever the insurance lobby wishes me to sail.

greed is the death of freedoms.

as for towing insurance, keep a good dinghy with adequate outboard and save your dough. or kedging anchors and line. or, locals with pangas....

do it yourself for freedom.
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Old 20-03-2013, 10:43   #33
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Re: BoatUS wants 3 people on board while cruising in Mexico?

Shop around Jared. Competition is a good thing.
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Old 20-03-2013, 10:53   #34
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Re: BoatUS wants 3 people on board while cruising in Mexico?

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One really has to read their policy, it isn't like they write it to protect you from them.
This is why I'm glad I have a barrister for a son, he reads that crap for me for free.


As far as the Boat US policy for 3 bodies on board, there have been a couple of times I've had 3 bodies on board and that was one too many and wanted to float test an old Danforth with them attached.
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Old 20-03-2013, 11:35   #35
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Re: BoatUS wants 3 people on board while cruising in Mexico?

wow, thanks for so many great responses and things to think about.

I've put the last 2 years of my life into fixing and rebuilding this boat with all the money I have. There is no way I'm sailing without it properly insured. Its my only real asset (besides my 401k) and I treat it as such.

I'm going to call around to some other insurance companies and see what comes out of it. I'm glad I asked about it now and not 3 months before the trip.

They said they want another survey done on the boat which seems silly considering how much money I have put into the boat since I bought it but they don't know that I guess.

so the next question is what are some recommended insurance brokers? A few have already been mentioned.

my sailing experience has only been a few years but its been very potent. You'd be hard pressed to find anyone in the Seattle area that sails as much as I do. For example, I've put 550 hours on the engine in the past 23 months and that's sailing whenever possible. I've moved aboard a year ago since I was spending so many days on the boat it didn't make sense to live anywhere else. Which brings up another question....how are liveaboards looked at from the eye of insurance companies? While cruising its obvious your a liveaboard but I was asked while getting a quote from another insurance company that ended up declining me coverage. Getting back to my experience. We have sailed up to desolation sound on a two week trip and have chartered a 41 ft boat in the bvi's twice now and are chartering a 51ft boat in Grenada this coming October. Besides that I grew up on powerboats in the Puget sound for what its worth. Asa 101 and 103 certified.

the longer passages I told myself that I would have 4 people on board to keep two people on watch at all times. I wish the insurance company would differentiate between the coastal cruising day jumps between moorings and long shots like from Seattle to San Fransisco. I should bring that up when I get the next quote.

thanks again for all the info to think about!

Jared
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Old 20-03-2013, 11:45   #36
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Re: BoatUS wants 3 people on board while cruising in Mexico?

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Originally Posted by Cheechako View Post
Regarding Boat US towing insurance.... which one do you buy? I had it in Florida 3 years ago, I wont go into why, but I ran out of diesel on the Waterway. I was told it was going to cost me $600 for a tow one mile to a fuel dock.... even though I had their towing insurance... so the question is, do you have to buy only the very top end offering to ge any useful coverage at all? I think I had the tier 2 coverage.... I guess I find it pretty misleading in what they sell....
Now this is worrisome. I upgraded to the "Unlimited" package when I first bought my boat since I was moving it 1000 miles down the ICW to FL, on a schedule and was not yet confident in the machinery. From reading the BoatUS website it sounds like they would pay for the whole towing bill.

So can you give more details on why they wanted to charge you $600? Did you have the Basic, Unlimited, or Gold package? Had you "violated" some rule or restriction on the coverage?
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Old 20-03-2013, 11:46   #37
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Re: BoatUS wants 3 people on board while cruising in Mexico?

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the longer passages I told myself that I would have 4 people on board to keep two people on watch at all times.
Jared
We also did our long passages with four. However, we did the watches solo! And we always helmed. If you are going to be on watch you might as well helm the boat. It prevents the watch from getting distracted by the birds, fish, and mammals.
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Old 20-03-2013, 12:27   #38
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Re: BoatUS wants 3 people on board while cruising in Mexico?

It's hard for us to coment on INS. As we have only carried Liabilty on our boats! Never had a claim as yet ! Where we live, Louisiana, There are many Ins agents who only write boat Ins. so we are able to get our liabilty Ins very cheap ! I know that if you have a loan you must have full coverage on your boat ! I guess we are lucky to have ours paid for, and only really need coverage for damage we do to others or there property! With over 30 yrs of cruiseing, we have yet to have a claim. I don't think I would be to happy to be told I must carry more crew than I wish to !! But then Ive never had a Ins company tell me anything but that I owed them more money !! LOL As others have said, look around a bit you might find a better deal and better coverage from someone local! It sure would be worth a few phone calls and a couple of days !! Just my 2 cents
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Old 20-03-2013, 14:06   #39
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Re: BoatUS wants 3 people on board while cruising in Mexico?

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So can you give more details on why they wanted to charge you $600? Did you have the Basic, Unlimited, or Gold package? Had you "violated" some rule or restriction on the coverage?
The time I went aground I had the Basic. The bill came to $1600 so the $50 Basic coverage amount wasn't worth much.

The real thing to consider I feel is how often you may go aground and need the tow. If you pay an upgraded Boat US and it is $100, but have a $500 deductible on your boat insurance it is a 1:5 year deal. But there is also the change in premium to consider and whether once your insurance company pays out for a tow they drop you and when you go replacement shopping you are "have been canceled" buyer.
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Old 20-03-2013, 14:58   #40
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Boats us towing unlimited towing is max at $2500

I've been towed a few times over the years they always paid, but I'm a stickler for paperwork from the towing companies.
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Old 20-03-2013, 20:23   #41
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Re: BoatUS wants 3 people on board while cruising in Mexico?

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The time I went aground I had the Basic. The bill came to $1600 so the $50 Basic coverage amount wasn't worth much.

The real thing to consider I feel is how often you may go aground and need the tow. If you pay an upgraded Boat US and it is $100, but have a $500 deductible on your boat insurance it is a 1:5 year deal. But there is also the change in premium to consider and whether once your insurance company pays out for a tow they drop you and when you go replacement shopping you are "have been canceled" buyer.
$1600 for a tow? I'm in the wrong business.
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Old 20-03-2013, 20:56   #42
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Re: BoatUS wants 3 people on board while cruising in Mexico?

I've used several insurance companies (not Boat US, though), and they all wanted to see my crew resumes for the big offshore trips. The first time I sailed to Hawaii I had little true offshore experience, and the insurance company insisted on a crew of four, with at least some experience. A friend who was sailing with me had a six-pack USCG license and years of ocean-sailing experience, so he became skipper of record for the trip.

Since then the crew requirements have been easier, but I don't know if the companies I've used would insure a doublehanded crossing.

The "crew of four" requirement probably isn't to guarantee two on-watch, but to allow for seasickness, injury or fatigue. It's not so stupid, especially if you don't have a lot of experience.

I carry insurance not so much to cover damage to my boat, but for liability should someone else be hurt, and to cover reef damage, oil-spill cleanup, etc. These can add up to well beyond the value of your boat.

Al (Golden), would you insure an inexperienced doublehanded crew for an ocean-crossing? I vaguely recall discussing this with you a long time ago, but I could be mistaken. I'm interested in the parameters.
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Old 20-03-2013, 21:50   #43
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Re: BoatUS wants 3 people on board while cruising in Mexico?

It is hard for me to understand the BoatUS requirement you describe.

I have made four sailboat trips from Seattle to San Diego and two down to Mexico and back.

Boat US insured me single handed and with a two person crew

2000, 2001, 2002, 2004, 2006

At the time of the first trip I had been sailing for 30 years with no claims and by the time I did the single handed trip I had over 5,000 miles of documented single handing experience

I have spent a lot of time talking to Boat US underwriters and they seem to have a very good understanding of US West Coast Pacific sailing - have you personally talked with an underwriter rather than a insurance sales person?
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Old 20-03-2013, 22:26   #44
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Re: BoatUS wants 3 people on board while cruising in Mexico?

"At the time of the first trip I had been sailing for 30 years with no claims"

What I meant to say was that at the time of the 1st Seattle to San Diego trip we had no offshore experience and BOAT/US insured my wife and I as a double handed crew.

And, in 1999 BOAT/US insured my brother and I in a double handed non-stop trip from Neah Bay to Cape Scott - my first experience as a skipper west of the Straits.
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Old 21-03-2013, 02:05   #45
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. They would take my word. Enquiring further about their coverage I was told that while the boat is out of the water there is no liability cover. If it falls over and causes damage to other property or people, tough luck. I actually have doubts about the legality of this part but that's what the sales rep told me. I'd love to hear from someone with actual experience with this..
On this topic I don't have first hand knowledge thankfully but I know a few folks that have. When the boat falls during a storm it is considered an act of god and everyone is on their own dealing with their own insurance if they have it. We had a big 40+ Hunter fall with its mast up that took out half a dozen boats like dominoes. People were ticked when they learned they were responsible. However not being an attorney or insurance professional I don't know if liability is warranted at other times. Part of me thinks about the idiot that breaks into your house and sues you when he gets injured but I don't know if that carries to boats. The other concern I'd have is fire and whether or not that would b an event I'd be liable. Granted there isn't much to ignite on my boat but others may be different.

Just some idle thoughts and musings trying to help.
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