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Old 20-04-2015, 13:28   #61
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Re: Boat Motor Legal Problems

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Originally Posted by hellosailor View Post
" who would go through the expense of retaining there own counsel "
Don't be na´ve. There are folks who will actually SOLICIT this business, searching forums, including this one, and reaching out to the defamed [sic] party and saying "Just sign this subrogation paper, if we make money you get half, if we don't make money, you don't pay us a cent."
Yes, there are such ugly trolls out there.


There are even folks who will look for potentially rich forum members (say, ones with a 50' and over boat) posting "We'll be on vacation for all of July". Then they go dig up your address (not hard if you've got a boat's name and home state) and when July comes around...you're burgled.


I know someone who lost a lot of photographic equipment that way, along with everything else easily carried out of his house, in a "good" safe location.


The slime is out there. If you've never been held up by thugs, that doesn't mean they aren't out there. The internet is a great place to harvest low-hanging fruit.
Like on all social media sites, never post vacation plans ahead of time and never send vacation pics while on vacation. always share after the fact while also letting people know your already back.
I travel on business to other countries from time to time and NEVER mention it until after my return, not that I have much worth stealing (we don't buy much "stuff"), but no one needs the aggravation. If you do, you might as well leave the house unlocked so they don't have to damage the place while breaking in.
No schedule of mine will ever be posted beforehand.
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Old 20-04-2015, 14:00   #62
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Re: Boat Motor Legal Problems

The only way you will ever come out of this OK is to be nice, keep talking and try to catch the guy at his shop or when he answers the phone. The idea to ask the woman on the phone if you can jus get your engine back is a good one also.
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Old 20-04-2015, 15:03   #63
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Re: Boat Motor Legal Problems

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Originally Posted by scarlet View Post
And also, it's the principal of the matter. I always try to 'do the right thing'... and the right thing is to get my motor back, and have him pay the appropriate consequences. I'm not one to throw up my hands and say.. "oh well"...

...and Skiprjohn, you hit the nail on the head.. "This is a sad story about someone getting ripped off. It's hard to imagine that you can just shrug your shoulders and walk away. I know I wouldn't be able to."

Thanks for that.

Scarlet, I'm very sorry this happened to you, and it's sad there are businessmen like this in the world.

You're correct, it's the principle of the whole thing, and I don't care if it's worth $2, $200, or $2000,.....you've been disrespected by some glue-sniffing wrench jockey, and you have to get your self-respect back, and at the lowest cost, otherwise, someday, someone else is going to steal your motor.

The left side of your mind has been telling you what you need to do....don't resist, just do it.


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Old 20-04-2015, 15:17   #64
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Re: Boat Motor Legal Problems

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Originally Posted by cards26 View Post
Scarlet, I'm very sorry this happened to you, and it's sad there are businessmen like this in the world.

You're correct, it's the principle of the whole thing, and I don't care if it's worth $2, $200, or $2000,.....you've been disrespected by some glue-sniffing wrench jockey, and you have to get your self-respect back, and at the lowest cost, otherwise, someday, someone else is going to steal your motor.

The left side of your mind has been telling you what you need to do....don't resist, just do it.


God, don't follow this advice.

Your doing the right thing. Your keeping the line of communication open and pushing him as much as you ought. Well done. Keep it up. Just don't spend anymore money on trying to get it back. Following Cards advice and spending potentially thousands on a $50 motor 'on principle' is foolish and in the end he wins.

So. Your doing the right thing.
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Old 20-04-2015, 15:19   #65
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Re: Boat Motor Legal Problems

scarlet
iff you need to buy an outboard there are used dink shops that help with this.
my favorite is the dinghy doctor in san diego. brian and jo totally rock.
they are available online under name the dinghy doctor.
they ship and are reputable.
tell em i sed hay if ye use their services.
as for the legal aid you got plenty of that here already
i hope you do not need my friends but if you do, they are good honest folk.
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Old 20-04-2015, 15:45   #66
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Re: Boat Motor Legal Problems

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Originally Posted by Rustic Charm View Post
God, don't follow this advice.

Your doing the right thing. Your keeping the line of communication open and pushing him as much as you ought. Well done. Keep it up. Just don't spend anymore money on trying to get it back. Following Cards advice and spending potentially thousands on a $50 motor 'on principle' is foolish and in the end he wins.

So. Your doing the right thing.

my way is the cheapest way. if it happened to me, i would just forget about the motor, and wouldn't have owned a 30 yo, 4hp motor anyway.

i only say from her point of view, and from what i gather from her comments, her self-worth is involved here. a person's self-worth can't be taking too many hits.
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Old 20-04-2015, 16:13   #67
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Re: Boat Motor Legal Problems

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Originally Posted by scarlet View Post
And also, it's the principal of the matter. I always try to 'do the right thing'... and the right thing is to get my motor back, and have him pay the appropriate consequences. I'm not one to throw up my hands and say.. "oh well"...
Actually the principle I'd suggest looking strongly toward at this point is "What is best for me." Value your time and energy. Yes, continue some pursuit, but spend very little effort on it.

You don't realize it but you may be throwing good money after bad. How? Well, time, energy, emotion are all of value. I would bet at minimum wage you've spent more time than the value of the motor by now.

Among the choices you have now, not the ideal world, what is least problematic, least painful for you? It might be file small claims but meanwhile move on to another motor. What's the value you'd place on missing a month of sailing while waiting? I'd put that pretty high.

Yes, he's done you wrong. But you are the one in control of how you let that affect you.

To add one thing too, if he's done work, there's a bill awaiting you. It might be more than the value of the motor. You have no contract so no maximum set. Fighting him increases that bill as well. Yes, you're entitled to the return of your motor but after paying for any work done. You took in a motor that wasn't running. That very fact diminishes it's value greatly.

How much are you going to let one man's apparent dishonesty, or at minimum lack of professionalism, affect you? That to me is the big question. Not what the police might do, or what an attorney might do or any of the other options.
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Old 20-04-2015, 16:22   #68
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Re: Boat Motor Legal Problems

you're all missing the point. it's about self-worth, not money. i think she's already doing what's best for her, and has come to ask us for help in her fight.

i know couples that were involved in some '30 years war' divorce case. why they would spend that much time and that much money on lawyers is beyond me, but that's what happens when emotions and net worth get into the formula.
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Old 20-04-2015, 20:09   #69
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Re: Boat Motor Legal Problems

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Originally Posted by cards26 View Post
you're all missing the point. it's about self-worth, not money. i think she's already doing what's best for her, and has come to ask us for help in her fight.

i know couples that were involved in some '30 years war' divorce case. why they would spend that much time and that much money on lawyers is beyond me, but that's what happens when emotions and net worth get into the formula.
She's asked for advice. We're offering it. That's our way of helping. Sometimes one thinks they're doing what is best for themselves, but upon more careful examination, change their mind.

In my opinion there are two outcomes to this with some reasonable probability. One is that she spends time, energy, money and gets nothing. The other is that she wins to the extent of a chance to get her motor, but loses as the cost exceeds the value or the bill does or she ends up with a non-working motor in pieces with a bill attached.

She is under no obligation to pay attention to any of the opinions or advice expressed. I don't see an emotionally draining losing fight consuming one's time and energy to do anything for self worth. There are some fights with no winners, just losers. Your "30 year war" divorce is a great example of one.
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Old 21-04-2015, 09:43   #70
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Re: Boat Motor Legal Problems

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She's asked for advice. We're offering it. That's our way of helping. Sometimes one thinks they're doing what is best for themselves, but upon more careful examination, change their mind.

In my opinion there are two outcomes to this with some reasonable probability. One is that she spends time, energy, money and gets nothing. The other is that she wins to the extent of a chance to get her motor, but loses as the cost exceeds the value or the bill does or she ends up with a non-working motor in pieces with a bill attached.

She is under no obligation to pay attention to any of the opinions or advice expressed. I don't see an emotionally draining losing fight consuming one's time and energy to do anything for self worth. There are some fights with no winners, just losers. Your "30 year war" divorce is a great example of one.

still missing the point.

i'm the one that said 'no lawyer'. lawyers are for a catastrophe, not for some 30yo, 4hp motor, and she knows that.

she wants 'justice', and she needs to get tough with the guy. some told her to 'keep the lines of communication open', THERE IS NO communication.

that's the third option.
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Old 21-04-2015, 09:50   #71
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Re: Boat Motor Legal Problems

reading between the lines, i think the mechanic may have broken something while he was fixing it, and now the motor is ruined, and beyond cost effective repair. he doesn't want get her a new motor so he's ignoring her. that's a possibility.

**** happens. once in a hospital in Los Angeles, while in the operating room under anesthesia, i was dropped off the gurney.
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Old 21-04-2015, 11:22   #72
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Re: Boat Motor Legal Problems

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still missing the point.

i'm the one that said 'no lawyer'. lawyers are for a catastrophe, not for some 30yo, 4hp motor, and she knows that.

she wants 'justice', and she needs to get tough with the guy. some told her to 'keep the lines of communication open', THERE IS NO communication.

that's the third option.
I'm not missing your point. I just don't agree with it. That's a huge difference. As to wanting "justice". Well she can want all she wants. But she's not going to get it. There's already been injustice and it's not reversible. Sometimes life just isn't fair, but compounding the problem doesn't make it more fair or just.
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Old 21-04-2015, 11:29   #73
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Re: Boat Motor Legal Problems

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Originally Posted by cards26 View Post
reading between the lines, i think the mechanic may have broken something while he was fixing it, and now the motor is ruined, and beyond cost effective repair. he doesn't want get her a new motor so he's ignoring her. that's a possibility.

**** happens. once in a hospital in Los Angeles, while in the operating room under anesthesia, i was dropped off the gurney.
Now glad you weren't hurt, but the worst case would have been broken bones and then a hospital bill for fixing them as well.

To your first paragraph, I think you're on target but he would have no obligation to get her a new motor. I just think he doesn't want to deal with one of many disgruntled customers while things have fallen apart. Now I do think it's even possible the motor got thrown out as he or someone thought it was junk. Lot's of possibilities. But the problem is her best case scenario is lousy even. Here it is.

Motor brought in not running. Value $100.
Less labor on dismantling and trying to repair $99.
Due to plaintiff $1 or they can pay $99 and have their still not running motor back.

Now I'm hoping ultimately she is just given the motor back in it's current state with no bill. But I wouldn't hold my breath. Meanwhile what's the value of a lost month of sailing?
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Old 21-04-2015, 11:47   #74
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Re: Boat Motor Legal Problems

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Now I'm hoping ultimately she is just given the motor back in it's current state with no bill. But I wouldn't hold my breath. Meanwhile what's the value of a lost month of sailing?

I would also hope for this outcome; motor back with no bill. He should man-up and admit what happened, though; I always gave my customers the bad news of my rare mistakes, and most everyone stayed with me and respected me for it. It seems odd to me that he would try and scam her over a small amount of money; my family lunch yesterday cost more than the value of this motor.

Scarlet: we've all had problems with marinas and mechanics; the name of the game we all play here is, 'Boating is Expensive'. Try and find out what happened, but I really think the mechanic meant well, and something unplanned happened. (He's wrong for not telling you though.)
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Old 21-04-2015, 12:08   #75
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Re: Boat Motor Legal Problems

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Originally Posted by cards26 View Post
you're all missing the point. it's about self-worth, not money. i think she's already doing what's best for her, and has come to ask us for help in her fight.

i know couples that were involved in some '30 years war' divorce case. why they would spend that much time and that much money on lawyers is beyond me, but that's what happens when emotions and net worth get into the formula.
No, we're not all missing the point. And, we're not all right or wrong. Each of us has a different way of taking care of being ripped off or bullied. Some walk away and some want to get what they are owed. Either way sometimes we don't get what we want and then have to learn to live with it.

I'm still thinking Scarlet has a chance of getting her outboard back and haven't given up on that optimistic thought.

Scarlet, how about a cheap Minn Kota electric to get you through until you can find the outboard of your dreams or get yours back? They can be picked up for $100 used sometimes depending on where you shop.
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