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Old 11-05-2011, 19:11   #46
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Re: Bluewater MacGregor ?

Here's a thought, "modified" doesn't count; as a log can be modified into a canoe.
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Old 11-05-2011, 20:36   #47
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Re: Bluewater MacGregor ?

Huh, are you suggesting that adding the weight and windage of a center cabin somehow enhanced the bluewater capabilities of this particular macgregor? comfort, sure but otherwise it would detract from seaworthiness.
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Old 11-05-2011, 20:47   #48
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Re: Bluewater MacGregor ?

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Originally Posted by clockwork orange View Post
Huh, are you suggesting that adding the weight and windage of a center cabin somehow enhanced the bluewater capabilities of this particular macgregor? comfort, sure but otherwise it would detract from seaworthiness.
Steve.
Hell, I'm not suggesting anything, hang onto your combined and collective gene pool; "You take your chances with the law. Justice is only a role of the dice, a flip of the coin, a turn of the Wheel". Hey I'll take my chances with Thunder Dome first.
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Old 17-11-2014, 14:11   #49
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Re: Bluewater MacGregor ?

Can I sail jib only keel up in light wind. 1979 Macgregor Venture 25. Just bought, stripped and redid mine and intend to go from north carolina to the bahamas. Yes, like camping. Anticipating the adventure. I do welcome all input.
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Old 17-11-2014, 14:51   #50
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Re: Bluewater MacGregor ?

I think there is a big difference between day sailing in a protected bay or most lakes compared to crossing 50 or more miles of open ocean (wave height can increase with longer fetch).

I would likely enjoy a day sail in the bay, but have other plans if invited to sail on a mac25 to Bahamas.
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Old 17-11-2014, 15:01   #51
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Re: Bluewater MacGregor ?

oxymoron: a figure of speech in which apparently contradictory terms appear in conjunction.
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Old 17-11-2014, 15:05   #52
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Re: Bluewater MacGregor ?

Thank you steady hand. I do see some short comings in the mac, as I see in anything. I sorta thought 50 miles was a day sail. Not trying to be a smart aleck at all. Im 63 and tend to look at everything as do-able. Before retirement was an engineer, but have always lived up to the edge. I have the old army attitude that failure isnt an option, and have very rarely failed at anything and tend to think things out well. But I certainly see your point. Just want one more adventure. How about light wind, jib only, keel up. Ive not had this particulat boat out. Always had fixed cruising or shoal draft boats.
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Old 19-11-2014, 09:50   #53
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Re: Bluewater MacGregor ?

Quote:
Originally Posted by thirstyturtle View Post
Thank you steady hand. I do see some short comings in the mac, as I see in anything. I sorta thought 50 miles was a day sail. Not trying to be a smart aleck at all. Im 63 and tend to look at everything as do-able. Before retirement was an engineer, but have always lived up to the edge. I have the old army attitude that failure isnt an option, and have very rarely failed at anything and tend to think things out well. But I certainly see your point. Just want one more adventure. How about light wind, jib only, keel up. Ive not had this particulat boat out. Always had fixed cruising or shoal draft boats.
Hi Again.

First, I do not own a Mac and have not sailed on one. While I do think they could be a fun boat to own for daysailing on protected waters (lakes, bays), that particular boat is not what I would want to use for sailing TO the Bahamas and further in open seas. In short I do not consider that a "bluewater" boat, as I would be reluctant to use or depend on it far offshore in poor weather or high seas or in places where quick rescue is out of the question (e.g. Greenland, arctic, etc.).

That said, I don't doubt it (sailing to Bimini or Bahamas) could be done, as folks sail all kinds of "inappropriate" boats across oceans and in bluewater.

And I do think the Mac would be fun to sail IN the Bahamas, once it is there. Shallow draft is a plus there, according to many who have cruised those waters.

One of the things I admire is people doing extraordinary things in simple craft or with smaller boats. I like the "Corinthian" approach to races and amateur efforts and such.

So, if someone has the guts, determination, and some skills and luck, I don't doubt that all kinds of feats can be accomplished.

I will post a link to a list of some of the small boats that have made some incredible voyages. I found the list inspirational. But, that does not mean I intend to take a 12 foot boat across the Atlantic.

NOTE! The link below is to the page showing the famous small boats. The link as shown on this forum says "food list" but the link will take you to the famous boat page.

Food list

That page I linked above is "famous" boats and sailors and feats. But, ordinary folks do cruise in some very small boats too. In fact, I suggest you visit the following page to see some examples of people cruising in Pocket or Micro cruisers. In fact, the photo you will see on that site's home page shows a Micro Cruiser (3.6meters long boat) in the Bahamas.
Microcruising

Since you have an engineering mind and determination to make things work is probably part of your joy, IF you will visit youtube and search for "Jester Challenge" you will be able to see several interviews with sailors who intended to sail singlehanded in a 30 foot or smaller boat across the Atlantic to America. However, those sailors had boats they spent time to make seaworthy, with some tips on what to do or what they did to modify or prepare their boats.

Some were very experienced blue water sailors. AND...as you watch the videos, you will find that several of those interviewed (even ones experienced) QUIT the voyage after a few days at sea (due to various reasons). So, even experienced sailors, in small boats they have extensively prepped for ocean sailing, experience failures (boat breaks) or realize their dreams or boats were not prepared for the conditions in open ocean and have the sense to turn back.

But, you already have the Mac. What should you do?

I would simply enjoy the Mac as it is intended to be used, and sail it as much as possible, until I found the boat that really satisified my desire for a more seaworthy bluewater boat.

I don't doubt you can find other Mac owners that have crossed to the Bahamas, at least I assume you can, as I assume others have had the same idea.

But, the title of your post here is "Bluewater MacGregor." Going back to that topic, I do NOT consider the MacGregor 25 to be a boat I would call "bluewater" or designed for sailing over seas, even IF one or more has made it from Florida to the Bahamas.
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Old 20-11-2014, 03:41   #54
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Re: Bluewater MacGregor ?

This is a very interesting thread. I buy and sell Mac 25 as a hobby. The Mac 25 is a very light boat which is great for racing and trailering. The builder placed positive floatation in all the compartments because he wanted to sleep at night. Most of this has been removed in all of the boats I have seen. As I look through the compartments the bottom is so thin you can see daylight through the hull. As you come off a 20 ft wave is this what you want between the water and yourself? I have a very modified Mac 25 that I just sold, the owner removed all the flotation then fiberglass the boat and sprayed flotation into the compartments. After this was done they then fiberglass the compartments closed. The rudder assembly was strengthen with stainless steel. The rigging was replaced with larger wire and the mast step was enlarged. The keel bolt has been replaced with a larger bolt and fiberglass in with West epoxy. This was all done to race on a lake in Texas. This boat is very strong, but I would not take it in bluewater.
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Old 20-11-2014, 05:35   #55
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Re: Bluewater MacGregor ?

I don't see why so many people think a Macgregor 25 couldn't make it to the Bahamas. It's not exactly offshore. With a 50 horse motor a Macgregor could do a day trip there and back!
Their shallow draft makes them great for shoal waters too. The OP should just check the forecast before crossing IMO.
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Old 20-11-2014, 05:46   #56
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The Mac25 is not a blue water boat by any means. This was my 2nd boat and it was a lot of fun to sail in Biscayne bay. I tried to sail it to bimini once but hit some larg'ish seas for that boat (6') and the trip was miserable. The keel slapping was constant and the speed against the waves made it near impossible to cross.

I had a 15HP yamaha on the back which thankfully pushed me back to PoM before nightfall. Like others have said, any boat can do the crossing but the experience of the crossing on a good boat is so amazingly different (enjoyable), it's not worth experiencing it any other way. The boat will probably fetch enough for you to buy a comparable sized blue water boat like a Catalina or Hunter from the 70's. those boats were solid and Bahamas boats.

Safe sailing.
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Old 20-11-2014, 06:17   #57
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Old 20-11-2014, 06:19   #58
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Re: Bluewater MacGregor ?

Quote:
Originally Posted by thirstyturtle View Post
Can I sail jib only keel up in light wind. 1979 Macgregor Venture 25. Just bought, stripped and redid mine and intend to go from north carolina to the bahamas. Yes, like camping. Anticipating the adventure. I do welcome all input.
Advice from the owners manual with regards to the swing keel

http://www.macgregorsailors.com/manu..._25_Manual.pdf

If you are sailing in shallow water, where you can reasonable expect to hit bottom, install the
lock bolt in the top keel trunk hole before lowering the keel. Then lower the keel until it comes to
rest against the bolt. Since the lock bolt now does not pass through the keel, it will swing back if
you hit bottom. However, if a severe knockdown is taken, bear in mind that the keel may swing
back up against the hull and cause damage. Caution should be exercised while sailing with the
keel positioned in this manner.

---------------

The boat is self-righting only with the keel locked down. The lock bolt will assure that the keel
angle is proper, and that the keel stays down in the event of a severe knockdown.
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Old 20-11-2014, 06:39   #59
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Re: Bluewater MacGregor ?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Steady Hand View Post
I think there is a big difference between day sailing in a protected bay or most lakes compared to crossing 50 or more miles of open ocean (wave height can increase with longer fetch).

I would likely enjoy a day sail in the bay, but have other plans if invited to sail on a mac25 to Bahamas.

Not saying that the 25 is a suitable boat, but what does your picture of the Mac 26 X or M water ballasted power sailor have anything to do with a swing keel sailboat?

MACGREGOR 25 sailboat specifications and details on sailboatdata.com
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Old 20-11-2014, 07:39   #60
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Re: Bluewater MacGregor ?

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Not saying that the 25 is a suitable boat, but what does your picture of the Mac 26 X or M water ballasted power sailor have anything to do with a swing keel sailboat?

MACGREGOR 25 sailboat specifications and details on sailboatdata.com
Howdy!

You are right, and I don't mind being corrected (or questioned).

I posted a photo of the Mac 26 (not the Mac 25). I simply picked that photo as it shows a Mac 26 in what the manufacturer considers "bluewater" proof or that the boat can be sailed in winds over 20knots and some seas. I thought it was a good illustration for the discussion.

But, it is a different boat design. You are right to point that out.

I will try to post another photo of the Mac 25.

But, I do stand by my earlier statements.

In short I do NOT consider either the Mac25 or Mac26 to be "Bluewater" boats I would want to use to cross a sea or to sail in heavy weather etc.

I did visit the page linked up above (by another member) that gave an account of the Mac26 going to Bimini. I enjoyed reading their story. And I have read accounts on blogs of people crossing to Bimini in much smaller boats.

But, the Mac25 and Mac26 are NOT what I would call a "Bluewater" boat. Instead, I would call them "Bay or Lake" boats. Of course a boat like this CAN make a 50 mile trip in good weather and low or relatively calm seas (but so could a windsurfer or a hobie 16 catamaran or a birch bark canoe).

Here is the Mac 25:
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