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Old 17-02-2009, 10:17   #1
jzk
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Best deal I have seen so far....

Jenneau 52.5 2002, with generator and AC. Decent shape. $123,393.

A couple of months ago, I saw a Bene 50 2002 for $150k with gene and ac. I have never seen anything like this. Is there more to come?

2002 Jeanneau Sun Odyssey 52.2 Sail Boat For Sale - www.yachtworld.com=
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Old 17-02-2009, 10:32   #2
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Jenneau 52.5 2002, with generator and AC. Decent shape. $123,393.

A couple of months ago, I saw a Bene 50 2002 for $150k with gene and ac. I have never seen anything like this. Is there more to come?

2002 Jeanneau Sun Odyssey 52.2 Sail Boat For Sale - www.yachtworld.com=
More to come? Count on it!

But having said that, this does appear to be a pretty good deal. It all depends, of course, on how well the vessel was maintained while in charter for the last 6-7 years. It may have developed some expensive issues that the current owner just didn't want to pour the cash into, possibly anticipating a massive softening in the charter market as people find better uses for their funds.

You might try to find someone on CF who is down that way to go have a look at her for you. Who knows - this might prove to be the deal of a lifetime.

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Old 17-02-2009, 10:34   #3
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That seems a lot of boat for the money and she's registered in Jersey (which would mean that any marine mortgages are registered - but not a guarantee that no debts tied to her, ie dock fees etc) You can also tell she is a Jersey Boat by the dual technology beer can - wedging the Cooler open

Ad says tax not paid - so I am guessing that means EU VAT. UK is now down to 15% VAT (for the next year).....of course if no intention to (permanently) relocate to the EU (or anywhere else!) then no taxes payable anywhere

I am guessing at 2002 she is ex charter in 2007, which means 2 years of private ownership possibly bought just before many folk realised the economy went tits up......be interesting to know what updates / refurb she has had since - and a good chance of a recent(ish) survey available.

And with a UK broker listed means that you don't have to buy the boat before making an offer or getting more details

If I had 9 Freinds I would be interested in having a look
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Old 17-02-2009, 10:39   #4
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It is a bank repo. I meant to say that. As was the bene 50 that I had seen for $150k with gene and AC.

Broker says no major issues. Ugly cushions, a bent stanchion, freezer needs a recharge, and a couple of frozen seacocks. I only wish I was ready to pull the trigger. Not my first choice, but hard to pass up.

Look at the next cheapest 52.5 newer than 2000.
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Old 17-02-2009, 10:39   #5
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If I had 9 Freinds I would be interested in having a look
But you're tight with Miss Bikini - surely "she" has at least nine friends!

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Old 17-02-2009, 10:56   #6
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Bank repo? Plusses and Minuses to that one. Good news is the paperwork should be in good order and bought debt free (which as she is abroad would rate as a big plus for me) - but the risk being that maintanence was not kept up - as always a gap between getting skint and the repo man turning up.....but with a bit of luck nothing that a few thousand dollars or so should not cure........


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But you're tight with Miss Bikini - surely "she" has at least nine friends!

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I think "she" would have more than nine freinds if she ever does a decent "Meets and Greets" thread . and perhaps changes her profile picture......time will tell
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Old 17-02-2009, 20:27   #7
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at that price who care i would be more worried with the cost of owning a boat of that size. you are talking alot of expence. plus that boat would have to be care full where you go with it due to keel depth. I would certainly have to question why so cheep.
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Old 17-02-2009, 20:37   #8
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What would be dearer 50ft Jenn needing some love or 30/40 year old 50ft needing some love. Not sure about keel depth as unless shoal draft you would expect to have that type of depth on cruising boat if you wanted it to sail efficiently.
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Old 17-02-2009, 20:49   #9
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David,

I think you have the picture pretty clear. Lots to be leery of when a boat is a repo. They didn't spend their last bit of money fixing the boat only to give it up. They couldn't even afford the transport cost to go look at it let alone maintain it. At 50+ feet that is a lot of work. Bank repo's are not the best boats to purchase.

Things like "Broker says no major issues. Ugly cushions, a bent stanchion, freezer needs a recharge, and a couple of frozen seacocks." means they all are trashed. No freezer just needs a recharge - period. The cushions are ugly because they got trashed. So nothing else did? Multiple frozen seacocks that they admit to is not good news. There also are all things they didn't tell you too. They didn't want to look for them so they don't even know about them. It is easier to keep a straight face if you don't go looking for trouble.

Anything being sold cheap is probably not well maintained so that means trouble. Boats maintained well are never sold under stress. People that have boats that are well maintained are keeping them even if they want to sell them. They don't have to worry about a repo. The one problem indicates worse problems. At 50+ feet this is easily $40,000 to clean up plus UE VAT if if it going that way. Sometimes they price the boat properly.
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Old 18-02-2009, 05:51   #10
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Let's be honest. This boat is cheap because the bank is asking for the amount of their loan plus commissions.

Boats like this one come out of charter and sell for $200,000 with no generator and AC. Look at the moorings listings.

Of course you need a survey, but who cares if there is a thing or two to replace at that price. The engine hours are low for a charter boat.

You could pay $150,000 for a 1990's version of that boat.

As far as the keel goes, this is a pretty short keel for a 52 ft boat. Some of them are 7 feet plus.

There is no hull core to be wet, and the decks on these boats are constructed pretty well such that you would be hard pressed to find moisture or rot in a 2002.

I am not selling this boat, and I am probably not buying. Just posted it because I stumbled upon it during one of my dreaming sessions on yachtworld.
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Old 18-02-2009, 06:27   #11
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Let's be honest. This boat is cheap because the bank is asking for the amount of their loan plus commissions.
If a banker thought it was worth more then they would ask more. It's not about what other boats might be worth when you get to just one boat.

When all you have a limited amount of information and that information is only provided from a broker you don't know the rest of the story. With a 50+ boat the cost of buying it is nothing to the ten year cost of owning it. The core of the hull and the decks don't have to be in bad shape for this to be a bad deal. I would assume they wouldn't be a problem.

This boat could have almost 2 years of neglect. The risk is great enough to lower the price. By the time you go there, arrange for a survey, and consider an offer you will need to invest a fair amount of money just to find out. Low ball Yachtworld.com prices are very high risk boats. The fact that you don't intend to buy it is clearly my point. Taking a Yachtworld search and starting with the lowest price boat and working up would be a bad plan.
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Old 18-02-2009, 06:31   #12
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The only way to determine the value and the issues is to take a look.
If I were in the market (I'm not) for a 50 footer like this I might look at it. Even with $40,000 of repairs or improvements it's a 7 year old 50 foot boat for $163,000 u.s.

Frozen seacocks might be costly or not, it could be just some time and a little grease.
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Old 18-02-2009, 06:51   #13
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Paul I think your bias against these type of boats is showing through, as has been stated no matter if more seacocks need replacement and other issues are found it still looks cheap. As for the banks valuation they will want what it owes them anymore is a bonus. Like I said earlier the chance of major problems would be less on a 7 year old 50ft boat than a thirty year old one regardless of the survey.
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Old 18-02-2009, 07:33   #14
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Technically, a bank repo will yield the bank whatever they sell. They now have title to the asset, and the former owner is out.

However, this is a non performing asset on the bank's balance sheet. It is messing up their ratios. They don't want it there, and if they can quickly get their money and costs back, they will jump on it.

The last thing they want is a non-performing asset sitting there losing value. As you state, there are costs to maintaining a 50ft boat.

And, the bank knows where this market is headed. There will be more 50ft boat bank repos in the coming days, not less. How is the charter business doing these days? I see people going on less charter vacations. Less charter revenue coming in. And, less of a reason for the charter company to keep your 5 year old boat in charter.

So, there will be good deals. And there will be good deals on perfectly good boats.

Of course no one should buy a boat without a survey. The survey is also an excellent introduction to the boat, as the surveyor will usually tell you all about it as they are doing the survey.
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Old 18-02-2009, 07:35   #15
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The only way to determine the value and the issues is to take a look.
FWIW my take on the price is it is meant to be attractive as the Bank has no interest in throwing money at the boat, and that includes mooring fees and possibly guardianage (of some sort)......sale price will be guided by the interest shown - and you don't get interest by over pricing initially.

The odds are that a UK based lender is involved (UK / Jersey reg and a major UK based broker, with an international presence - english speaking and english contracts) and for the Lender the boat is out of position for prospective UK buyers, and in any event a small market for a non VAT boat in the UK, as not too many folk around at the moment willing to write large cheques to the VAT man to bring her home (indeed also some large cheques likely required to get her fit to get home on her own keel!) - so best shot of ASAP and close the book.

On a "simple" repo of course the sale price would cover the loan and if any shortfall would still fall on the former owner (not so easy / painless to go bankrupt or walk away from debt in the UK as perhaps in the USA).....but if this forced sale is part of the Owners larger financial problems (IMO likely) bank knows that the boat simply sitting their will be costing them money........and banks (in the UK at least) do not like writing out cheques, even if it later saves them money - Even on an asset they can sell for 70c in the dollar against the loan - which would nowadays be called a "Good" asset

I appreciate the cautions about this not likely to be a mint example (indeed I would put money on it not being!), nor ready to sail the 7 seas (all 12 of them ) - but for someone looking to cruise the Carribean with a largish family / freinds for a few years of holidays (i.e a Floating Condo / Self Charter) in exchange for some refurb dollars (I would mentally budget USD5k and a bucket of elbow grease - and have her surveyed for anything major) IMO could be a tempting boat for the right person / circumstances at the right price......especially if you weren't looking to create a minter.
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