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Old 27-06-2013, 19:09   #16
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Re: Beneteau First 38 or First 405?

OTOH, if I remember right it was a Bene 405 (did they just make one 405 model?) that I chartered in Mexico. (early/mid 90's) The boat just felt sloppy going to weather and pounded in a moderate chop. I've charter captained Catalina 42's in similar weather and they felt better. FWIW
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Old 28-06-2013, 12:35   #17
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Re: Beneteau First 38 or First 405?

Quote:
Originally Posted by 40 South View Post
That's why I prefer the F405 over the F38.

The reason for my original post was to seek feedback specifically from those that had experience with the F38 engine under the cockpit.

I think what engine is in there is more important than its location in the traditional place. The fact that Beneteau shoe horned in another head is not critical except it was a great place to hang your foul weather gear.

The F38 and the F405 are NOT the same boats like another poster suggested. There were F38's with deck stepped masts and taller keel stepped masts the F38 S model. This is not a Beneteau 38s model a totally different boat.
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Old 29-06-2013, 16:09   #18
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Re: Beneteau First 38 or First 405?

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Sorry, the engine is not under the stairway in the F38. It is aft of the 2nd head (behind the stairway) between the quarter berths. Access is via a hatch at the front and several narrow hatches accessed via the quarter berths. One has to climb into the quarter berths to open the hatches. The saving grace is that the cockpit sole is removable so the engine can be accessed from the top or easily removed.

Now I'd surly like to see some photos of that setup.. as I was under the understanding that the First 38, 42, and 456, were all on the the same basic layout..
And I own a First 42... the cockpit sole is removable on my boat but dosent open the engine compartment,, only the a hole used for the liferaft and under that is the fuel tank that sets behind the motor.. the motor sets directly under the top step .. I've pulled my motor before with the boom up throu the companion way.. the hatches you refer to in the berths are actually under the berth area on the inside wall.. neither are over 12 inches square... just for inspection...
and to my understanding, all three models only had two quarter berths when the rear head was left out.. the two head version had only one quarter berth and a sail locker behind the head accessed from a cockpit locker..
I'd really be interested in knowing how you pull the motor up throu the cockpit sole........please send pictures...........
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Old 29-06-2013, 19:09   #19
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Re: Beneteau First 38 or First 405?

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Originally Posted by Randyonr3 View Post
Now I'd surly like to see some photos of that setup.. as I was under the understanding that the First 38, 42, and 456, were all on the the same basic layout..
And I own a First 42... the cockpit sole is removable on my boat but dosent open the engine compartment,, only the a hole used for the liferaft and under that is the fuel tank that sets behind the motor.. the motor sets directly under the top step .. I've pulled my motor before with the boom up throu the companion way.. the hatches you refer to in the berths are actually under the berth area on the inside wall.. neither are over 12 inches square... just for inspection...
and to my understanding, all three models only had two quarter berths when the rear head was left out.. the two head version had only one quarter berth and a sail locker behind the head accessed from a cockpit locker..
I'd really be interested in knowing how you pull the motor up throu the cockpit sole........please send pictures...........
Hi Randy

If you look at the fist image in my post #13 the layout of the F38 can be seen. The engine is in the blank space between the 1/4 berths with the aft head forward of the engineroom. It is accessed from the front and via hatches in the 1/4 berths.
To my knowledge, the F38 only came in a 3 cabin version and not a 2 cabin version, whereas the F405 came in both flavours.

The F38 fuel tank is under the port 1/4 berth with the batteries under the starboard 1/4 berth.

In the image of the engine in this post you can see the bolts holding the cockpit sole down (above the engine). I did see a picture of the cockpit sole of a F38 removed, showing the engine from above, on the www somewhere but can't find it again. Engine removal would be easy with no cockpit sole. A tackle on the end of the boom and up you go!
In the 1/4 berth image you can see the hatch to access the engine.
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Old 29-06-2013, 20:00   #20
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Re: Beneteau First 38 or First 405?

Found it!!
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Old 30-06-2013, 10:53   #21
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Re: Beneteau First 38 or First 405?

Quote:
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Hi Randy


To my knowledge, the F38 only came in a 3 cabin version and not a 2 cabin version, whereas the F405 came in both flavours.

NOPE there was a two cabin version with a big head on the starboard side I am not 100% sure if this was a Moorings only version as the ones i have seen have had the Moorings big box fridge freezer chart table unit. Not a good trade off in my eyes but for a charter boat i guess the F/F took priority over a sit down chart table unit. They also had keel stepped masts but i suspect not the taller version.
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Old 30-06-2013, 17:07   #22
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Re: Beneteau First 38 or First 405?

True, there was a F38M. It was more of a hybrid between the standard F38 and the F38s5. It had the F38 hull & deck with the F38s5 interior. Masts.....I'm not sure? They were a later incarnation of the F38 series into the early 1990's, not the early 1980's F38 I am referring to.
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Old 01-07-2013, 15:44   #23
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Re: Beneteau First 38 or First 405?

Quote:
Originally Posted by 40 South View Post
True, there was a F38M. It was more of a hybrid between the standard F38 and the F38s5. It had the F38 hull & deck with the F38s5 interior. Masts.....I'm not sure? They were a later incarnation of the F38 series into the early 1990's, not the early 1980's F38 I am referring to.

I think that was the 38s or 38M the one with the round in the hull window. There is one in the boatyard here i will take a picture and post it ASAP it did have the STARK interiors. The Moorings F38 was just like any other F38 identical in fact excopt for the chart table and missing the starboard aft cabin and of course having a big big aft head
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Old 02-07-2013, 07:15   #24
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Re: Beneteau First 38 or First 405?

First 38M pictures

This was a Moorings version of the 38s5. Differences were masthead rigged, (not fractional) rod rigged (not wire) shorter LEAD keel (not cast iron) the Moorings chart table Fridge Freezer box and a 7.5 Kw Generator Engine driven F/F compressor and a smaller Yanmar diesel

i have pictures of the Moorings version of the First 38 but they are 4000 miles away i suspect i will have a look on my three 1TB back up drives and if i have them here will post them ASAP

For now enjoy the F38M pics....sadly the inside is wrecked so no interior pictures
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Old 02-07-2013, 07:57   #25
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Re: Beneteau First 38 or First 405?

Cant find the pictures of the Moorings 38 but here are some showing deck and keel stepped mast and the aft head on the two cabin model also a nice transom modification (dumped the two slip in boards) and added a bit of teak two vents and a boarding ladder.
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Old 02-07-2013, 18:06   #26
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Re: Beneteau First 38 or First 405?

Quote:
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Hi Randy

If you look at the fist image in my post #13 the layout of the F38 can be seen. The engine is in the blank space between the 1/4 berths with the aft head forward of the engineroom. It is accessed from the front and via hatches in the 1/4 berths.
To my knowledge, the F38 only came in a 3 cabin version and not a 2 cabin version, whereas the F405 came in both flavours.

The F38 fuel tank is under the port 1/4 berth with the batteries under the starboard 1/4 berth.

In the image of the engine in this post you can see the bolts holding the cockpit sole down (above the engine). I did see a picture of the cockpit sole of a F38 removed, showing the engine from above, on the www somewhere but can't find it again. Engine removal would be easy with no cockpit sole. A tackle on the end of the boom and up you go!
In the 1/4 berth image you can see the hatch to access the engine.
Thanks Craig,
I stand corrected...... thought all three were the same layout...gives me a few ideas.........
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Old 02-07-2013, 18:21   #27
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Re: Beneteau First 38 or First 405?

From David's posts it appears there are a few versions of the F38. A standard F38 (3 cabin 2 head, deep iron keel), F38M (2 cabin, 2 head, short lead keel) & F38s (2 cabin, 2 head Stark design/layout) with differences to layout, mast & keel configurations. However all appear to still have the engine under the cockpit. This location has advantages as the cockpit sole can be lifted to access/remove the engine. Maybe an easier securing method/hinges may alleviate the access issue?? Cockpit sole seal issues??
It wasn't until the F405 that the engine was moved further forward with subsequent better access and weight distribution (engine over the keel).
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Old 03-07-2013, 07:56   #28
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Re: Beneteau First 38 or First 405?

Quote:
Originally Posted by 40 South View Post
From David's posts it appears there are a few versions of the F38. A standard F38 (3 cabin 2 head, deep iron keel), F38M (2 cabin, 2 head, short lead keel) & F38s (2 cabin, 2 head Stark design/layout) with differences to layout, mast & keel configurations. However all appear to still have the engine under the cockpit. This location has advantages as the cockpit sole can be lifted to access/remove the engine. Maybe an easier securing method/hinges may alleviate the access issue?? Cockpit sole seal issues??
It wasn't until the F405 that the engine was moved further forward with subsequent better access and weight distribution (engine over the keel).

AH HA there is another a F38 owners version two cabin layout BIG Aft Head and standard chart table/galley (as in my photographs)
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Old 17-08-2013, 11:03   #29
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Re: Beneteau First 38 or First 405?

Hi Craig

If you are looking for a First 38, I'm willing to help you out with some question. I'm considering selling mine and I think we both can learn from the process. At the moment we are in San Blas, Panama and the internet is not first priority here, so I might not answer right away.

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Old 29-08-2013, 16:24   #30
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Re: Beneteau First 38 or First 405?

Hi Joachim

Thanks for the offer but I am not looking any more. I asked the question as there was one for sale in my local marina that I was considering. It has been sold. As it turns out there is now another for sale. Good luck if you decide to sell.
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