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Old 29-11-2010, 10:52   #91
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Capt.Don View Post
Are there references to the article(s) that I could review? Thanks
Don
The article appears at http://www.southwindssailing.com/pdf...august2010.pdf commencing on page 34 of the pdf. As noted above there are a few errors in the the dimentions as to the keelson due to editing 'tho the overall information is pretty accurate as it was based on communications with Benteau and with the designer.

FWIW...
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Old 29-11-2010, 10:57   #92
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Originally Posted by Randyonr3 View Post
Again Salty,
you're talking out your backside again and have no knowledge of what you say.....

Before you go running you mouth, you need to get your backside in order..
Ouch! Good gravey Randy.. You're getting a bit crusty old son! It "ain't" that important that one needs get their bood-pressure up, eh?

FWIW...

PS: How's the back?
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Old 29-11-2010, 11:03   #93
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Originally Posted by svHyLyte View Post
Ouch! Good gravey Randy.. You're getting a bit crusty old son! It "ain't" that important that one needs get their bood-pressure up, eh?

FWIW...

PS: How's the back?
So true Scott, So True.........
and the back is doing better...........
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Old 29-11-2010, 11:20   #94
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Originally Posted by SaltyMonkey View Post
Ummm...someone without any pecuniary interest or any unconscious or conscious bias based on an investment?....
Exactly the attitude/sentiment I referred to earlier. Speaking as 64+ year old professional engineer that's been sailing for 57 years, no "independant" assessment is without bias of some kind. It is human nature. But, Frankly Scarlett...

Quote:
Originally Posted by SaltyMonkey View Post
With respect to your measurements, these are hard salient facts that are extremely valuable to know and cannot be disputed. Unfortunately, they are also hard to come by along with other facts about a particular design that are hidden by the manufacturer. Beneteau is well known for this.
Ah... Well... Actually not. I had no difficulty with either Beneteau or German Frers who were quite cordial and forthcomming...

Quote:
Originally Posted by SaltyMonkey View Post
Try performing simple NA engineering calculations and waste an hour trying to look up some base numbers. Never mind the more complicated ones regarding stability...
Polars and stability are available below. It pays to know where to look.

Here Homer nodes...
Attached Files
File Type: pdf Angel-Polars-VPP.pdf (517.7 KB, 111 views)
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Old 29-11-2010, 11:55   #95
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Originally Posted by SaltyMonkey View Post
Try performing simple NA engineering calculations and waste an hour trying to look up some base numbers. Never mind the more complicated ones regarding stability.
Putting the numbers together never really mattered to much to us when we bought her.. One look at her bottom and I knew it was a boat I had to have.. This boat was built for comfort and speed..
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Old 29-11-2010, 12:12   #96
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This was built for speed... and in her heyday... comfort....
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Old 29-11-2010, 15:05   #97
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of course i know the delta Randy! I've been up there a number of times. Are you at "hidden" by chance? I could take the ferry over to see you
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Old 29-11-2010, 15:08   #98
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SaltyMonkey would like to know,
What makes up this Beneteau?
For many numbers do exist,
But professional opinions do resist.

If lists were made we'd all agree,
We would not argue and have tea.
My wallet empty I'd be free!
So says SaltyMonkey of the sea....
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Old 29-11-2010, 15:19   #99
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Salt how come you seem to pop up here there and everywhere with the same boat knocking theme. I am sure that what ever boat you buy will be the best and you will let everyone you meet know about it including how you out smarted all and sundry. The effect this subject has had on me is to reinforce my belief that a Benne, Jenne etc will do just fine.
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Old 29-11-2010, 15:26   #100
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Originally Posted by svHyLyte View Post
Polars and stability are available below. It pays to know where to look.
Here Homer nodes...
For some #&@#&$@ reason I cannot read this file on download

Do you think you have enough information to calculate STIX on this example by chance?

stix
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Old 29-11-2010, 15:44   #101
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Salt how come you seem to pop up here there and everywhere with the same boat knocking theme. I am sure that what ever boat you buy will be the best and you will let everyone you meet know about it including how you out smarted all and sundry. The effect this subject has had on me is to reinforce my belief that a Benne, Jenne etc will do just fine.

I dont have a "general" boat knocking theme at all here or anywhere else. You people are projecting and are ultra sensitive because you own one or have owned one! geeez! I 'm honestly trying to figure out this enigma of Beneteau history and lines - scalability vs around the lake - and it has me generally confused as a shopper. I've changed my opinion about "certain" models, but I have yet to get a complete understanding of what is considered the salient models for blue. Professionals - surveyors and delivery skipper opinions - do not seem to exist. If there are sooo many out there, where are the opinions? Why are they knot on major lists? No one dares to answer...

One thing I will say...and this is absolutely true...In my boat hunt here in SF I met a professional skipper who makes most of his money doing deliveries through the year. We were looking over bay area listings and I said "what bout this Bennie 370 Oceanis?" and he snarled and said he doesn't like them or deliver if he can help it. Mentioned he wasn't alone in that opinion as a delivery captain. There are many. Well, what can I say? This guy...is he wrong? He has a LOT of experience.

btw...this boat had sailed from France to SF bay area by a couple of chaps. It's may be still on market. I think this is the boat. I'm not sure:

Bennie Boat

Beautiful boat (on the surface), but I think they had some structural issue. I was open. Maybe one of you know the owners?

With reference to the 2009 F-35 - I mean this sincerely, that when I looked at the new F35 online, I said to myself...damn...maybe I am wrong about the newer ones...that looks quite nice of a boat for offshore needs as a possible racer/cruiser..I'll go check it out. And the depression hit me like a wave when I did.

I just don't know which are which...

I meant that about the book 10 BENNIES TO TAKE YOU ANYWHERE IN THE WORLD!
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Old 29-11-2010, 16:06   #102
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Salty... you'll always find folks with prejudices...
When I bought my '87' 321 in 2000 I let a few friends back in the UK and Med know and told them I planned on sailing it back over the following Spring...
I got an E-mail back froma mate who's an experienced former fisherman from Portsmouth who'd bought a 57ft Ferro schooner and was living in the Med...
"Don't do it they're death traps.." was his advice... I found out that this opinion came from an incident in the Biscay where a 45ft Bene on delivery to the UK with a crew of 3 had run into heavy weather... 1 Ocean yachtmaster, an Offshore YM and a Coastal Skipper...
I went online and looked up the UK Coastguard report of the incident...
The Skipper had kept all sail up and banged on the engine to maintain speed and keep his schedule in spite of headwinds of 35+ from the North... a large wave smacked the boat on the beam and one guy went over the side.... the 3rd guy was sent forward to deploy the liferaft... he inflated it while still on the foredeck and then ripped it trying to get it over...
Meanwhile the Skipper had not slowed the engine nor had he done anything to reef the jib or start dropping the main.... by the time they had got things under control they had no idea where the MOB was... they managed to locate the partly deflated liferaft but of the MOB they knew bot where to look apart from a vague retracing of what they presumed was their track...
Needless to say I was very much influenced by this report....
I've never sailed with a Yachtmaster since...
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Old 29-11-2010, 16:19   #103
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HA! Boatman! I think I know this report, and there was a whadoo about the keelbolts, the experience of the crew itself, and the skipper. My take it was a combination of things between the boat and the skipper's judgment...and the skipper got off scott free when clearly he made REALLY bad decisions, don't you think?

This might be it (Ocean Madam)?

http://www.maib.gov.uk/cms_resources...an%20Madam.pdf

Please note: This is the 390, NOT the 393 of our Australian circumnavigating friend MarkJ at the moment whom you all know
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Old 29-11-2010, 16:59   #104
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Salty... I'm pretty sure it was in 2000... but I could be wrong... there seem to be similarities but I read it just the once a long time ago so cant be sure....
But after reading I decided to go for it anyway as I'm of the Heave to school if its blowing 7+ for more than four hours when I'm on my own on the Ocean... some times even with crew... it depends on the sea state...
I hate getting wet and I wont expect my crew to do what I wont...
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Old 29-11-2010, 17:03   #105
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Salty so after all your investigations pray tell us what beneteaus you feel might get your estimed approval and which don't. So that we might findout if you know anything .

Dave
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