Cruisers Forum
 


Join CruisersForum Today

Reply
 
Thread Tools Rate Thread Display Modes
Old 09-10-2011, 09:44   #16
Marine Service Provider

Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: South Florida and the Caribbean
Boat: A beautiful catamaran
Posts: 152
Re: Before I Buy, What Should I Know ?

I agree with getting the vessel thoroughly surveyed by a qualified marine surveyor. Be sure that the marine surveyor you hire is a surveyor that has actually sailed boats and has knowledge of sailing rigging and the stresses it causes on the vessel's hull. This will make for a much better survey. I know surveyors in my circle down here in Florida that will not survey sailboats, and if they do, have even heard stories of them not understanding the basic rigging or what the function of the lines and standing cables were. That is a big boat, but they are alot of fun to sail. Much like an airplane, the hardest part is docking (landing) them. But it is a great experience. The maintenance costs can vary, but just keep the vessel well maintained and it will save you thousands in the long run. A boat's biggest enemy is galvanic corrosion so check your zincs monthly.
__________________

__________________
Capt. John Banister, AMSŪ
SAMSŪ Accredited Marine Surveyor
Palm Beach Gardens, Florida
SuenosAzules is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-10-2011, 16:05   #17
Senior Cruiser
 
osirissail's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: A real life Zombie from FL
Boat: Gulfstar 53 - Osiris
Posts: 5,416
Images: 2
Re: Before I Buy, What Should I Know ?

Excuse me guys and gals - hire a marine surveyor for a $2500 boat? Not likely or practical to spend $400 plus or minus on a surveyor.
- - A couple of good friends or boatyard buddies can look at the boat for a round of drinks and tell whether the boat is trash or viable. Nothing on that type boat is that involved that good common sense and an eye for details can pick it out any gross problems.
__________________

__________________
osirissail is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-10-2011, 16:31   #18
Registered User

Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: St. Petersburg, Florida
Boat: Gemini 3200
Posts: 702
Re: Before I Buy, What Should I Know ?

Quote:
Originally Posted by osirissail View Post
Excuse me guys and gals - hire a marine surveyor for a $2500 boat? Not likely or practical to spend $400 plus or minus on a surveyor.
- - A couple of good friends or boatyard buddies can look at the boat for a round of drinks and tell whether the boat is trash or viable. Nothing on that type boat is that involved that good common sense and an eye for details can pick it out any gross problems.
Agree 100%! However, nowadays if you want insurance for your boat the insurance company will require a survey. If you want a slip in a marina the marina will require proof of insurance.

Fabbian
__________________
fgd3 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-10-2011, 17:05   #19
Senior Cruiser
 
Cheechako's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: Skagit City, WA
Posts: 19,347
Re: Before I Buy, What Should I Know ?

Quote:
Originally Posted by lippysyd View Post
First, this is so cool! thanks to all of you for chatting with me and answering all my questions. Way to make a noob feel welcome!



Ok, so this is my fuzzy area that's giving me the most worry. I don't wanna turn into a dork just yet and blast my friend with questions, but I probably should since he and I didn't talk about the marina fees too much. (and their website's very simple) He told me that he bought his slip for $1000 and that there's a yearly fee of $800. (maintainance, I think?) The slip next to his was also for sale at the same price. The marina is not in a vacation area, but even still, this sounds cheap. Anyone think this sounds fishy? I'm worried this is where my plan could go all to hell.
soounds fishy to me! but ai dont know the area....
__________________
"I spent most of my money on Booze, Broads and Boats. The rest I wasted" - Elmore Leonard











Cheechako is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-10-2011, 19:32   #20
Senior Cruiser
 
osirissail's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: A real life Zombie from FL
Boat: Gulfstar 53 - Osiris
Posts: 5,416
Images: 2
Re: Before I Buy, What Should I Know ?

Quote:
Originally Posted by fgd3 View Post
Agree 100%! However, nowadays if you want insurance for your boat the insurance company will require a survey. If you want a slip in a marina the marina will require proof of insurance.
Fabbian
Which is a good reason to stay with the marina that the boat is already in so that you don't have to "redo" such stuff with another marina.
- - A boat that small could be easily wrapped into your automobile and/or home insurance coverage with minimal additional expense.
__________________
osirissail is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 09-10-2011, 21:01   #21
Marine Service Provider

Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: north carolina
Boat: command yachtsdouglas32
Posts: 3,113
Re: Before I Buy, What Should I Know ?

Quote:
Originally Posted by osirissail View Post
Excuse me guys and gals - hire a marine surveyor for a $2500 boat? Not likely or practical to spend $400 plus or minus on a surveyor.
- - A couple of good friends or boatyard buddies can look at the boat for a round of drinks and tell whether the boat is trash or viable. Nothing on that type boat is that involved that good common sense and an eye for details can pick it out any gross problems.
I agree, is insurance required?Unless liability is what your talking about,I would not worry about it myself...but to each his or her own..good luck..DVC
__________________
tropicalescape is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-10-2011, 06:54   #22
Senior Cruiser
 
osirissail's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: A real life Zombie from FL
Boat: Gulfstar 53 - Osiris
Posts: 5,416
Images: 2
Re: Before I Buy, What Should I Know ?

Quote:
Originally Posted by tropicalescape View Post
I agree, is insurance required?Unless liability is what your talking about,I would not worry about it myself...but to each his or her own..good luck..DVC
It is the sort of "new" thing now that marinas and boatyards all require proof of liability insurance. There are a few who do not, but they are getting as rare as hen's teeth. Even marinas and boatyards in the Caribbean are now asking you on their registration forms to name your insurance carrier.
- - For small boats, usually your auto and/or home insurance company will wrap the boat under their coverage which solves the problem economically for boats that stay in USA waters.
__________________
osirissail is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-10-2011, 07:11   #23
Registered User

Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: Boston, MA
Boat: Bristol 38.8
Posts: 1,625
Re: Before I Buy, What Should I Know ?

You really do need a survey, even for a $2,500 boat. Consider the extra $500 as part of the purchase price.

A good survey will pinpoint the maintenance issues, especially the expensive ones. You won't have to guess. The most expensive issues are soft spots in the hull or deck, leaky tanks (water or fuel), engine problems, plumbing and electrical problems, standing rigging (the steel wire that holds up the the chainplates (where the standing rigging attaches to the hull) and the spars themselves (mast and boom). If any of the foregoing require major repairs or replacement it will likely cost more than you are paying for the boat.

Moderately expensive items include running rigging (all of the ropes), sails, cosmetic fixups (varnish, paint, bottom paint, etc.) Go price a gallon of decent quality ablative bottom paint (the kind hat keeps the slime off your hull).

Inexpensive items include electronics (you can usually buy used stuff that works fine), charts, USCG required safety equipment (life jackets, flares, fire extinguishers) although fire extinguishers can be expensive, even recharging the existing ones.

Even if you plan to much of the work yourself, the cost of items you have to buy (e.g. varnish, paint) will add up in a hurry.
__________________
Curmudgeon is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-10-2011, 17:44   #24
Marine Service Provider

Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: Eldean Shipyard, Holland, MI
Boat: 1977 Pearson 30
Posts: 113
Re: Before I Buy, What Should I Know ?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Curmudgeon View Post
You really do need a survey, even for a $2,500 boat. Consider the extra $500 as part of the purchase price.
I really don't understand that position. I think if surveyor's charged 20% of the purchase price of every boat they would loose 99% of their business.

Just out of curiousity, if we scale this up to a Bristol 38.8 currently on yachtworld for $149,000, would you have paid $30,000 to have it surveyed? Probably not. But, $18 per foot or about $750....sure, it's only 1/2% of the purchase price. There has to be a limit somewhere that the survey isn't worth the expense.

Personally, if the boat is currently in the water and being used I would say $10k is the cut off. If it is on the hard and hasn't been in the water in a couple years the number would go almost to zero.
__________________
Anonymous7500 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-10-2011, 17:56   #25
Registered User

Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: Boston, MA
Boat: Bristol 38.8
Posts: 1,625
Re: Before I Buy, What Should I Know ?

It's like sailing transatlantic on a stock Hunter. It depends on your appetite for risk. Suppose the surveyor finds major structural issues. Even at 20% of the purchase price, the surveyor just saved the buyer $2,000 plus lots of aggravation and possibly a friendship. If there were not some problems with this boat, it wouldn't be on the market for $2,500.

The original poster describes himself as knowing absolutely nothing about sailing. If he were an experienced boat sailboat owner I might have a different view.
__________________
Curmudgeon is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-10-2011, 17:59   #26
Registered User

Join Date: Oct 2011
Location: Michigan
Boat: 1972 Catalina 27
Posts: 45
Re: Before I Buy, What Should I Know ?

Quote:
Originally Posted by osirissail View Post
Excuse me guys and gals - hire a marine surveyor for a $2500 boat? Not likely or practical to spend $400 plus or minus on a surveyor.
- - A couple of good friends or boatyard buddies can look at the boat for a round of drinks and tell whether the boat is trash or viable. Nothing on that type boat is that involved that good common sense and an eye for details can pick it out any gross problems.
I'll be honest, I think this is likely the way we will go. I have a well seasoned sailing friend who has already offered to come and take a look at it this spring. He's been sailing all his life and he's an engineer, so if he says it's cool, I trust him. As far as the marina, hopefully the boat will only move one slip to the left.

BTW, i talked to my friend (with the boat) today. I had not talked to him about buying the boat since the weekend he took us out, so I was worried that he wasn't serious and I had gotten all excited for nothing. We still didn't get into nuts and bolts, but he is indeed serious, now knows we are too, and is looking for another boat. So... it's full speed ahead, lol. Hubby and I are so excited we're even quitting smoking to free up a little more cash in the budget. It'll give us access to more for maintainance. We've needed to quit for a long time, but quitting to get the boat is the first time I haven't dreaded the idea, so we're taking advantage.
__________________
lippysyd is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-10-2011, 18:06   #27
Registered User
 
Don1500's Avatar

Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: On Board, just above the water
Boat: Marine Trader 47
Posts: 1,176
Re: Before I Buy, What Should I Know ?

Buy this book: CHAPMAN: Piloting and Seamanship (Husick)
and this one: Ashley's Book Of Knots (Ashley)
and this one: The American Practical Navigator (Bowditch)

The read them. OR Just go sailing
__________________
The Nomad Blog Mother, mother ocean, I have heard you call
Everything I know about cruising I learned from Travis McGee - http://theroamingnomad.com
Don1500 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-10-2011, 18:06   #28
Senior Cruiser
 
osirissail's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: A real life Zombie from FL
Boat: Gulfstar 53 - Osiris
Posts: 5,416
Images: 2
Re: Before I Buy, What Should I Know ?

Quitting smoking is a very good idea - you don't want your new toy smelling like a tobacco humidor. If the boat does nothing else but get you two to stop smoking you will save enough over your lifetime in cigarette costs and medical costs to afford a nice catamaran when you get ready to retire and set off to cruise the world.
__________________
osirissail is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-10-2011, 18:13   #29
Registered User

Join Date: Oct 2011
Location: Michigan
Boat: 1972 Catalina 27
Posts: 45
Re: Before I Buy, What Should I Know ?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Don1500 View Post
Buy this book: CHAPMAN: Piloting and Seamanship (Husick)
and this one: Ashley's Book Of Knots (Ashley)
and this one: The American Practical Navigator (Bowditch)

The read them. OR Just go sailing
Ok that was gonna be my next question. Where do I start to learn until I can sail again next spring? I know absolutely nothing about sailing.

I added a few pictures in an album.
__________________
lippysyd is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-10-2011, 18:31   #30
Senior Cruiser
 
osirissail's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: A real life Zombie from FL
Boat: Gulfstar 53 - Osiris
Posts: 5,416
Images: 2
Re: Before I Buy, What Should I Know ?

First place to start is your public library. If there is one around you. They will most probably have some "how to sail" books which will give you a good start even if the books are somewhat old. The techniques are timeless. After digging through what is available for free - hit the flea markets and used book stores for more books at greatly reduced prices.
- - Another great economical source are experienced sailing friends. They will normally have some books in their personal collections that they would recommend and loan to you.
__________________

__________________
osirissail is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes Rate This Thread
Rate This Thread:

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
What Boat to Buy ? lee.millington Meets & Greets 9 25-09-2011 16:27
380: Wanting to Buy a Lagoon 380 monte Lagoon Catamarans 3 05-08-2011 07:14
Where to Buy BC Charts ? tangle Navigation 15 04-07-2011 00:16



Copyright 2002- Social Knowledge, LLC All Rights Reserved.

All times are GMT -7. The time now is 13:26.


Google+
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Social Knowledge Networks
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.

ShowCase vBulletin Plugins by Drive Thru Online, Inc.