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Old 05-01-2016, 20:18   #16
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Re: Am I crazy or what

Yes of course. The F350 dually that towed Ubuntu from San Francisco, had a towing capacity of 17,000 lbs. The truck I invest in will be similar and have the same towing capacity.

I own a 12,000 lb hitch with anti sway and big torsion bars. Its the only way to go.

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AND the truck has to be registered to tow the weight of the boat AND trailer as well as the weight the trailer puts on the truck. There is a limit to the total weight of the truck, trailer and cargo that the truck can handle per the plate specs/registration on the truck.

Now, I did say registered since I have seen a gazillion arguments on how much weight can be legally towed. There are two arguments about the weights, one is that the truck/trailer ratings cannot and should not be exceeded, while the second is that if you pay your tag/registration fees for a higher weight, you are good to go. The second argument might, just might, get you out of a citation, depending on the state, but if there is an accident, I think all bets are off if the lawyers find out that the truck exceeded the design weights of the truck.

Goose neck and fifth wheels are better/easier to tow sway wise but there are anti sway bumper hitches, like Hensley and ProPride, that are supposed to work well. There might be others but I have not read up on this in a decade or more.

We are thinking of buying a boat that can be towed and even though I have a diesel F350, I think we would hire out the towing since my truck is older and not a dually, so the total weight the truck can haul, while it might be legal, it would be questionable in my mind. We would only be towing a few hundred miles.

Later,
Dan
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Old 05-01-2016, 21:45   #17
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Re: Am I crazy or what

Just something to keep in mind, boat lists at 12,000 lb. Trailer, you stated 3222(which seems light for a triple Axle, but I only work with deck units)
So we are at 15,222 without gear. That's pushing real close to a 17,000 tow limit. Gross combined will also be close to tapped out once you have passengers and supplies. Which puts a huge strain on the truck for any long hauls, and eliminates any areas with road bans. Even a 90% ban will be off limits.
Make sure to check on width restrictions as well. There may be time and area restrictions on top of needing the permits and signage.
It sounds like you will run this as a delivery business so as a commercial truck won't have trouble getting permits but the truck will have to be in perfect mechanical shape.
I believe it was around 2011 that Chev raised their tow limits to over 20,000 lb. The others I'm not sure of. That extra wiggle room makes a big difference when inspected. And on wear and tear.
Good luck. If you can make it work, it will sure open up lots of new playgrounds for you:-)
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Old 05-01-2016, 21:48   #18
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Re: Am I crazy or what

mackconsult,

FWIW, my concerns would have to do with supporting the boat properly while she is out of the water, and what effects just sitting on its keel and bouncing 12,00 mi or so would have on the interior joinery, or might it even break tabbing, etc. I also would feel concern relative to wind damage: being towed is like sitting out a severe storm, with all the road grit and whatnot in their air. Would you make a cradle to support her? Would you shrink wrap her?

Good luck with it, the idea sounds cool, but maybe needs to work out a few wrinkles.

Ann
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Old 05-01-2016, 22:02   #19
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Am I crazy or what

I am worried about damage to the boat. My experience of trailer sailor boats is that they have keels or skegs designed to support the weight of the boat and the trailers were all customised to provide support to the hulls at strong points. I don't know about the boat you are thinking of towing but I would be surprised if it was designed in a way that would safely support it on the keel.

That being said, I do miss the joy of towing the boat to some fun new location. I have kept my windsurfer for this purpose.

Matt

(Oops. I see Ann has expressed similar sentiments while I was typing oh so slowly with two thumbs. )

Sent from my iPhone so apologies for weird autocorrect typos.
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Old 06-01-2016, 16:11   #20
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Re: Am I crazy or what

I don't know where guys are getting your information from.


When a boat runs aground on its keel at speed, the dynamics are much higher than a boat on a trailer. On trailers and in boat yards the rule of thumb is that 90% of the weight of the boat should be on the keel, and 10% on the pads.

I tow boats all the time ...... and I stick to the rule of thumb. I can guarantee you that on big boats if you don't put 90% on the keel you will be poking into the hull in multiple spots .....

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Originally Posted by GILow View Post
I am worried about damage to the boat. My experience of trailer sailor boats is that they have keels or skegs designed to support the weight of the boat and the trailers were all customised to provide support to the hulls at strong points. I don't know about the boat you are thinking of towing but I would be surprised if it was designed in a way that would safely support it on the keel.

That being said, I do miss the joy of towing the boat to some fun new location. I have kept my windsurfer for this purpose.

Matt

(Oops. I see Ann has expressed similar sentiments while I was typing oh so slowly with two thumbs. )

Sent from my iPhone so apologies for weird autocorrect typos.
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Old 06-01-2016, 16:22   #21
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Re: Am I crazy or what

Quote:
Originally Posted by mackconsult View Post
I don't know where guys are getting your information from.


When a boat runs aground on its keel at speed, the dynamics are much higher than a boat on a trailer. On trailers and in boat yards the rule of thumb is that 90% of the weight of the boat should be on the keel, and 10% on the pads.

I tow boats all the time ...... and I stick to the rule of thumb. I can guarantee you that on big boats if you don't put 90% on the keel you will be poking into the hull in multiple spots .....
Wow, you've got it sorted then. No, seriously, sorry for responding with my thoughts, you are clearly an expert in this field.

Of course if a boat runs aground on it's keel in some cases it will be totally buggered, but hey, like I said, sorry for answering your question.

Have fun.

Matt
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Old 06-01-2016, 16:36   #22
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Re: Am I crazy or what

Most boats will survive a grounding. Point is almost all designers ensure that a boat can support its self on its keel. No harm done.

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Originally Posted by GILow View Post
Wow, you've got it sorted then. No, seriously, sorry for responding with my thoughts, you are clearly an expert in this field.

Of course if a boat runs aground on it's keel in some cases it will be totally buggered, but hey, like I said, sorry for answering your question.

Have fun.

Matt
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Old 06-01-2016, 17:31   #23
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Re: Am I crazy or what

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ann T. Cate View Post
mackconsult,

FWIW, my concerns would have to do with supporting the boat properly while she is out of the water, and what effects just sitting on its keel and bouncing 12,00 mi or so would have on the interior joinery, or might it even break tabbing, etc. I also would feel concern relative to wind damage: being towed is like sitting out a severe storm, with all the road grit and whatnot in their air. Would you make a cradle to support her? Would you shrink wrap her?

Good luck with it, the idea sounds cool, but maybe needs to work out a few wrinkles.

Ann
As usual you bring up very good points. As I mentioned in an earlier comment, a lightweight trailer is risky for several reasons...not the least of which is the continual flexing of the trailer can indeed cause damage to the boat. I have seen support pads push through the hull, and in one instance the trip from Seattle to the Bay Area [due to] the constant pounding, light trailer, and tie down straps actually pushed the hull down with so much force that the hull in way of the fin keel shattered. Just as an idea of the costs involved in repairing damage to boats hauled on the highway, the company I worked for was insured by Lloyds of London and the deductible was $150k.

I was hauling an ancient 36' Chris Craft one time and it had been raining the whole trip, as I drove past the inspection window at the port of entry for Oregon, the bilge pump came on, and as you guessed it, it was aimed right at the State Trooper running the scales. Of course there was a window protecting him, but the clean up, lost time being inspected by the environmental people etc, cost a bundle. Not to mention the owner waiting in L.A. for his boat...

I have a few more stories, none of them due to negligence, but you get the idea. Risky business...
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Old 06-01-2016, 17:42   #24
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Re: Am I crazy or what

Oh yes all good points. I have towed quite a few boats myself and had quite a few "horror" stories that turned out okay.

I know what I am getting myself into and I do appreciate all your comments and opinions.

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As usual you bring up very good points. As I mentioned in an earlier comment, a lightweight trailer is risky for several reasons...not the least of which is the continual flexing of the trailer can indeed cause damage to the boat. I have seen support pads push through the hull, and in one instance the trip from Seattle to the Bay Area [due to] the constant pounding, light trailer, and tie down straps actually pushed the hull down with so much force that the hull in way of the fin keel shattered. Just as an idea of the costs involved in repairing damage to boats hauled on the highway, the company I worked for was insured by Lloyds of London and the deductible was $150k.

I was hauling an ancient 36' Chris Craft one time and it had been raining the whole trip, as I drove past the inspection window at the port of entry for Oregon, the bilge pump came on, and as you guessed it, it was aimed right at the State Trooper running the scales. Of course there was a window protecting him, but the clean up, lost time being inspected by the environmental people etc, cost a bundle. Not to mention the owner waiting in L.A. for his boat...

I have a few more stories, none of them due to negligence, but you get the idea. Risky business...
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Old 06-01-2016, 18:18   #25
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Re: Am I crazy or what

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Most boats will survive a grounding. Point is almost all designers ensure that a boat can support its self on its keel. No harm done.
Yes, boats are designed to be set on their keel.

Beg to differ on the grounding.

Depends.

High aspect fins will often sustain damage where encapsulated full keels are fine.

But for any type...

3 knots onto a sandbar, no worries.

6 knots onto granite, maybe OK.

Waves slamming boat onto bedrock for 24 hours, no chance.
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Old 06-01-2016, 18:25   #26
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Re: Am I crazy or what

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Oh yes all good points. I have towed quite a few boats myself and had quite a few "horror" stories that turned out okay.

I know what I am getting myself into and I do appreciate all your comments and opinions.
Best wishes and above all stay safe on those highways! I got out of that business years ago and my nerves are still recovering!! LOL!
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Old 06-01-2016, 19:56   #27
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Re: Am I crazy or what

I agree

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Originally Posted by ramblinrod View Post
Yes, boats are designed to be set on their keel.

Beg to differ on the grounding.

Depends.

High aspect fins will often sustain damage where encapsulated full keels are fine.

But for any type...

3 knots onto a sandbar, no worries.

6 knots onto granite, maybe OK.

Waves slamming boat onto bedrock for 24 hours, no chance.
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Old 06-01-2016, 19:57   #28
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Re: Am I crazy or what

Yep know how that goes. Most deliveries I do on the water any ways, under my USCG captains license. Some times it just makes more sense to pull a boat and put it on the trailer.

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Best wishes and above all stay safe on those highways! I got out of that business years ago and my nerves are still recovering!! LOL!
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Old 06-01-2016, 20:20   #29
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Re: Am I crazy or what

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Originally Posted by mackconsult View Post
I don't know where guys are getting your information from.


When a boat runs aground on its keel at speed, the dynamics are much higher than a boat on a trailer. On trailers and in boat yards the rule of thumb is that 90% of the weight of the boat should be on the keel, and 10% on the pads.

I tow boats all the time ...... and I stick to the rule of thumb. I can guarantee you that on big boats if you don't put 90% on the keel you will be poking into the hull in multiple spots .....
I'm just lurking on this forum..but I am now curious.

are you using some type of load cell at the keel and at all pad contacts, in order to KNOW the proper load distribution?

if so, can you share what type and model that you have?

reason I ask, is because I am planning to build a gantry...in some applications, I plan to lift with the gantry...and the load distribution requirements require I have specific numbers as I pull. And the same measured forces when I decide to drop gear into a cradle..in the lift, I plan on using strain gauges or tension meters to calculate load.., on the drop, load cells..measured forces.

But I am having a hard time finding a good reliable source of load cells that are user friendly and not a wallet buster that are rated from 1000-20000 pound range.... (the tension/strain gauges are mechanically more simple and inexpensive)

any ideas are appreciated.

nice rig btw!
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