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Old 01-09-2013, 13:27   #136
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Re: Advice on Circumnavigation Vessel

Thames 4 Blood , delivered several 45DS,s very good sea boat , excellent choice.

dave
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Old 01-09-2013, 13:30   #137
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Re: Advice on Circumnavigation Vessel

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settee lengths, curved instead of squared corners on settees, galley configuration (I would appreciate someone elses views on those looong straight galleys compared to a U shaped galley where the cook can lock themselves in safely).
Not all U shaped galleys are great, in some at the sink , you just get thrown across the front of the companionway. And in one or two cases, being able to dodge out of the way of the flying cooker door and contents , made being "locked" in quite dodgy

The straight galley does have its drawbacks absolutely. I had one on my 393. But several boat types have a backrest in the setback behind the galley. It can be made work. all boats are compromises

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Old 01-09-2013, 13:33   #138
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Re: Advice on Circumnavigation Vessel

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I have driven in Europe, Asia, the middle east, and South America. A Ford Escort is pretty much the same in the US as it is overseas. If it is made by Ford it is an American car. The poster I was addressing goes off on some wild tangents and I was just stating facts.
Ford of Europe designs European cars in Europe.

The comparison about cars was to do with the relative strengths on sailing designs and the markets where they sell. Im not debating cars.

Dave
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Old 01-09-2013, 14:43   #139
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Re: Advice on Circumnavigation Vessel

G'Day all,

The galley on Insatiable II has worked very well at sea and at anchor for all of the miles we've put on her. Very few changes that I would make if given the chance. Basic U-shape, with spaces well worked out for comfortable bracing when required, enough counter space on the top of the engine box so that the fridge lid isn't always covered with things when you need to get into it, and good ventilation.

Cheers,

Jim
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Old 01-09-2013, 16:33   #140
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Re: Advice on Circumnavigation Vessel

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Uh huh. So Bill Crealock and the other designers at Pacific Seacraft have never been to sea because they give people both a top and front loading fridge (I.e. the best of both worlds). Whatever.
You are fighting a losing battle. I am planning on my cruising boat to get me through the worst weather just in case I ever encounter it. I have never read about a PSC owner being unhappy with how the boat treated them when the conditions were nasty. I can put up with the smallish cockpit, not looking for a dock queen. The PSC 40 is on our buying schedule after we unload our current boat.
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Old 01-09-2013, 16:37   #141
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Re: Advice on Circumnavigation Vessel

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Dockhead's long post was a very good one. As was Evans'.

You might also try these resources:

Characteristics of offshore Boats (or something like that)

Nigel Calder's Cruising Handbook

Both of these discuss the issues Dockeahd raised, as well as a few other important ergonomics that many folks seem to neglect to their discomfort big time:

settee lengths, curved instead of squared corners on settees, galley configuration (I would appreciate someone elses views on those looong straight galleys compared to a U shaped galley where the cook can lock themselves in safely).

IIRC, you're in San Fransisco. Take yourself out in the ocean past the Potato Patch some gnarly winter day. That'll save you tons of traveling to find bad weather.

Good luck, don't give up, you're not the first one to ask the never-ending question, seems you've read up.

Beth and Evan's website is also quite helpful.
Is there ever a day out there when it is NOT gnarly?
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Old 01-09-2013, 18:47   #142
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Re: Advice on Circumnavigation Vessel

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You wouldn't happen to have any photos of that, would you? That sounds interesting.
I take plenty of boat images but mostly of the projects we are working on.

The Dutch thing was a Van de Stadt design, possibly some form of his Wibo.

The French boat was something light alloy with a lifting keel. G oogle some and you will probably run into it. Possibly Allures, and something well bigger than 40'.

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Old 01-09-2013, 19:09   #143
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I take plenty of boat images but mostly of the projects we are working on.

The Dutch thing was a Van de Stadt design, possibly some form of his Wibo.

The French boat was something light alloy with a lifting keel. G oogle some and you will probably run into it. Possibly Allures, and something well bigger than 40'.

b.
Here is that Dutch thing: Wibo 9.30 by vd Stadt. I sailed this one for 17 years and can tell you it was very nice, but no world cruiser.
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Old 01-09-2013, 20:32   #144
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Re: Advice on Circumnavigation Vessel

Thanks! That definitely is interesting. Can see the advantages in it if you have to go forward in a seaway. What makes you say it was no cruiser?
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Old 01-09-2013, 21:56   #145
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Thanks! That definitely is interesting. Can see the advantages in it if you have to go forward in a seaway. What makes you say it was no cruiser?
It is a cruiser, just not a world cruiser. Lots of details that are not seaworthy, but almost all owners were fixing that. Example: the seats in the cockpit were wood and just put over the lazaret opening etc. They could go overboard and leave you with huge openings that take water in. So, they need hinges, locks etc. Many things like that.
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Old 01-09-2013, 22:59   #146
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Re: Advice on Circumnavigation Vessel

I have to tell you that I really dislike a long sideways galley. They work Ok at anchor but are a real pain at sea. Helped a friend deliver a boat with one of those galleys and you'd never get me to own one for crossing oceans and don't take it lightly as nothing is used more than a galley at sea.
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Old 02-09-2013, 03:22   #147
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Re: Advice on Circumnavigation Vessel

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I have to tell you that I really dislike a long sideways galley. They work Ok at anchor but are a real pain at sea.
Yes I think in general , Id agree with you. But some long ways galleys with a back seat support behind the sink/stove are not too bad as there is a place to brace yourself.

The long galley tends to go into boat designs that squeeze 3 cabins into what is in reality a two cabin boat.

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Old 02-09-2013, 08:01   #148
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Re: Advice on Circumnavigation Vessel

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(...) Can see the advantages in it if you have to go forward in a seaway.(...)
Not something you are looking forward to, in a small boat anyways. If any sea is running, there will be a security line on the deck and you will be clipped in.

Still, shrouds, rails, cars, dorades and fittings that ARE NOT in your way are a great invention. Too bad, on very many boats (some from the top shelf) this is not the case.

Somehow, boats with clean, easy to walk decks and generous handholds all around are actually never discussed at CF.

Here it is only either Valiant or Bene ;-))))

Hardly ever.

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Old 02-09-2013, 08:12   #149
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Re: Advice on Circumnavigation Vessel

This is what a good seagoing deck looks like.

http://www.eyb-boats.com/Photos_bate...3334-1_400.jpg

This boat has no shrouds attached mid-deck, nothing on the sidedecks, hard rail all round and each of her two anchors fed to a separate winch, two well spaced foresails, two masts, deep and secure center cockpit, hard dodger, skeg rudder, no saildrive, lead ballast, proper bilge sump, vast kitchen facility, beautiful wood finish inside.

And she sails very well too.

I might have missed something but I bet you are getting my drift by now.

b.
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Old 02-09-2013, 09:43   #150
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Re: Advice on Circumnavigation Vessel

Barnakiel, great deck, now if it had handholds along the coach roof, and a little higher bulwark, it would be even better. Wide clear side decks make for a little less room down below, but are wonderful at sea. ____Another 2 cents worth.____Grant.
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